Republican protesters openly admit using racist imagry

[Berkut]

Seeing the town hall meetings with the daily shrieking white woman screaming "I want my country back" I'd say it's fairly widespread.

Uhhh, people screamed stuff like that when Bush was President.

They called him a stupid redneck, said he looked like a monkey, etc., but that's okay 'cuz he is a white guy.

Right.

The reason the race card is being played now is simply because it CAN be played now - Obama is black, so it is a way to go after those who are opposed to him. I don't see any reason to believe there is anything more to any of this than that.

Are there crazies out there who have a problem with him because he is black? I am sure there are. Is that the basis for the rights opposition to him? No way.

The question is: is it ok to use racist imagery to attack a black guy, even though you disagree with him on grounds that are not related to his race? I'd say it is still racist.

Of course it isn't ok.

Imagine Germany had a Jewish treasury minister who wanted to raise taxes and his opponents (who would oppose him for non-ethnic, economical reasons) depicted him in cartoons as a crook-nosed money-grabbing Jew. Surely that would be antisemitic (and probably attract much more furore).

Indeed, and it should raise a furor. It should not be seen as reflective of the views of the entire party though, at least without some good reason.

[Tamas]

The only reason the racism card can be used to try and silence moderate opposition is clearly shown in this thread. And that is the fact that the moderate right treat the nutjobs along the lines of "hey dems leave them alone just because they are racist they can have valid opposing views too" whereas in fact they should be the very ones yelling at those cocksucker rednecks to stop that nonsense which only pollutes every reasonable criticism one might have.

As long as the moderate right refuses to alienate from the far right, the views of the two will be rightly handled as a single one.

[Berkut]

The only reason the racism card can be used to try and silence moderate opposition is clearly shown in this thread. And that is the fact that the moderate right treat the nutjobs along the lines of "hey dems leave them alone just because they are racist they can have valid opposing views too" whereas in fact they should be the very ones yelling at those cocksucker rednecks to stop that nonsense which only pollutes every reasonable criticism one might have.

As long as the moderate right refuses to alienate from the far right, the views of the two will be rightly handled as a single one.

But the racist nutjobs are alienated - nobody takes them seriously. They aren't like the moveon wing of the left.

This isn't about a kooky fringe - it is about the left trying to label simple opposition to the president as racism. The fact that there might be some crazies out there is irrelevant.

Even the nutty religious right isn't particularly racist.

[Jaron]

Typical. You act like there are so many sensible flavors of the right and all the left wing can be safely lumped into one cohesive force.

I am in all respects just slightly to the left of center, and I can see the fantacism of the far left (dailykos and the like). During election season, they are allies of convenience, but I don't know why you can't see that these are fringe elements and not accepted by the mainstream. The rest of us have higher expectations and are more critical of Obama. We just don't have to use the word nigger to get our point across like some of your right wing friends seem to need (albeit it ever so subtly)

[garbon]

Indeed.

People are acting as if the world was color (or gender-) blind. It isn't. And it means that you can't make one-size-fits all rules either. A cartoon showing a WASP grinding babies into food could be just an example of a more or less tasteless satire of his stance on something. A cartoon showing a Jew in the same situation would be (rightly) considered blood libel.

So do people need to run around memorizing stereotypes of various groups so as not to offend them?

[Jaron]

Indeed.

People are acting as if the world was color (or gender-) blind. It isn't. And it means that you can't make one-size-fits all rules either. A cartoon showing a WASP grinding babies into food could be just an example of a more or less tasteless satire of his stance on something. A cartoon showing a Jew in the same situation would be (rightly) considered blood libel.

So do people need to run around memorizing stereotypes of various groups so as not to offend them?

In essence, yes. That is correct. It is common sense in a multicultural democracy that such sensitivies must be adhered to.

[garbon]

In essence, yes. That is correct. It is common sense in a multicultural democracy that such sensitivies must be adhered to.

Doesn't it seem self-defeating to encourage people to learn beliefs about other groups that we don't want them to espouse?

[Jaron]

Unless you're going to claim that all the racist imagry and wording being used since Obama was elected is due to ignorance, I don't see the point of your argument. It is pretty clear to me anyways that the intent is malice.

[Razgovory]

The only reason the racism card can be used to try and silence moderate opposition is clearly shown in this thread. And that is the fact that the moderate right treat the nutjobs along the lines of "hey dems leave them alone just because they are racist they can have valid opposing views too" whereas in fact they should be the very ones yelling at those cocksucker rednecks to stop that nonsense which only pollutes every reasonable criticism one might have.

As long as the moderate right refuses to alienate from the far right, the views of the two will be rightly handled as a single one.

But the racist nutjobs are alienated - nobody takes them seriously. They aren't like the moveon wing of the left.

This isn't about a kooky fringe - it is about the left trying to label simple opposition to the president as racism. The fact that there might be some crazies out there is irrelevant.

Even the nutty religious right isn't particularly racist.

How do you know this?  And why are they able to be equated with moveon.org

[Strix]

The only reason the racism card can be used to try and silence moderate opposition is clearly shown in this thread. And that is the fact that the moderate right treat the nutjobs along the lines of "hey dems leave them alone just because they are racist they can have valid opposing views too" whereas in fact they should be the very ones yelling at those cocksucker rednecks to stop that nonsense which only pollutes every reasonable criticism one might have.

As long as the moderate right refuses to alienate from the far right, the views of the two will be rightly handled as a single one.

And, yet, the reverse isn't true. The moderate Democrats aren't lumped in with the far left when they refuse to alienate themselves from some whacked out view.

[Berkut]

The only reason the racism card can be used to try and silence moderate opposition is clearly shown in this thread. And that is the fact that the moderate right treat the nutjobs along the lines of "hey dems leave them alone just because they are racist they can have valid opposing views too" whereas in fact they should be the very ones yelling at those cocksucker rednecks to stop that nonsense which only pollutes every reasonable criticism one might have.

As long as the moderate right refuses to alienate from the far right, the views of the two will be rightly handled as a single one.

But the racist nutjobs are alienated - nobody takes them seriously. They aren't like the moveon wing of the left.

This isn't about a kooky fringe - it is about the left trying to label simple opposition to the president as racism. The fact that there might be some crazies out there is irrelevant.

Even the nutty religious right isn't particularly racist.

How do you know this?  And why are they able to be equated with moveon.org

They aren't equated - that is the point.

Moveon is the nutty wing of the left, but they are still certainly part of the left, and a powerful part.

The racist whackjobs who have signs with Obama dressed up like a witch doctor are not part of any actual portion of the Republican party. They are just some fruit loops out there. The left has them as well, like all the people who were swearing that Bush was going to have a coup or something.

This isn't about them though - this is about Carter and Seedy and JR trying to convince everyone that in fact the run of the mill members of the party are all double secret code racists, and that is why they don't like Obama.

[Razgovory]

I'm asking how do you know these things?  How do you know that moveon is the extreme nutty left and that the racists we see are so divorced from the mainstream of the right?

[Neil]

You are nuts dude.  Any logical fair person would conclude that is racist.

Only if you're an American, and are thus hypersensitive to race.

But then again, you eliminated Americans when you said 'logical'.

[Berkut]

I'm asking how do you know these things?  How do you know that moveon is the extreme nutty left and that the racists we see are so divorced from the mainstream of the right?

If you disagree with these things, normally what you would do is present some argument saying that they are not correct and why.

If you think Moveon and those types are part of the mainstream left, then great - but it doesn't really damage my case.

If you think that the people who are clearly racist represent the mainstream of the right, then feel free to make that case. So far, it is has only been made on the basis of some kind of double secret hidden code that only JR and Shelf (and Jimmy Carter) can apparently read.

[Razgovory]

I'm asking how do you know these things?  How do you know that moveon is the extreme nutty left and that the racists we see are so divorced from the mainstream of the right?

If you disagree with these things, normally what you would do is present some argument saying that they are not correct and why.

If you think Moveon and those types are part of the mainstream left, then great - but it doesn't really damage my case.

If you think that the people who are clearly racist represent the mainstream of the right, then feel free to make that case. So far, it is has only been made on the basis of some kind of double secret hidden code that only JR and Shelf (and Jimmy Carter) can apparently read.

In other words you aren't going to tell me why you know these things.