S.F. is gearing up for bike lane plans

[garbon]

The last time we were in SF we rented some bikes to tour the city.  It was great fun.  The city already seems bike friendly so I am not sure what the big uproar is about.

My friends in the US say it's way more of a political issue over there. I remember that WSJ interview and the row between a couple of pedestrians and a cyclist in DC and I think it's probably yet another front in the culture wars.

I don't know. I've seen bicyclists be militant but I don't know that there is an organized anti-bicyclist crowd.

[Jacob]

My friends in the US say it's way more of a political issue over there. I remember that WSJ interview and the row between a couple of pedestrians and a cyclist in DC and I think it's probably yet another front in the culture wars.

It does seem like simple issues of civic governance have a tendency to be turned into acrimonious us vs them fights.

[sbr]

Gun racks don't work very well on bicycles, thus they are un-American.

[Jacob]

I don't know. I've seen bicyclists be militant but I don't know that there is an organized anti-bicyclist crowd.

You may not be organized, but there sure is a lot of visceral anti-bicyclist sentiment being expressed.

It's not just a US thing, though; we get some of it here in Vancouver too.

[garbon]

I don't know. I've seen bicyclists be militant but I don't know that there is an organized anti-bicyclist crowd.

You may not be organized, but there sure is a lot of visceral anti-bicyclist sentiment being expressed.

It's not just a US thing, though; we get some of it here in Vancouver too.

Of course, my opposition stems from a rationale place and not an emotional one as you suggest. I don't mind bicyclists in suburbs or bicyclists traveling along the Henry Hudson river path. I do take issue when bike zoning gets rid of streets/parking, bicyclists have extensive bike paths but insist on driving in the middle of car lanes/on sidewalks, bicyclists participate in events like Critical Mass which seem to be a celebration of how they can ensnarl car traffic.

[Jacob]

Of course, my opposition stems from a rationale place and not an emotional one as you suggest. I don't mind bicyclists in suburbs or bicyclists traveling along the Henry Hudson river path. I do take issue when bike zoning gets rid of streets/parking, bicyclists have extensive bike paths but insist on driving in the middle of car lanes/on sidewalks, bicyclists participate in events like Critical Mass which seem to be a celebration of how they can ensnarl car traffic.

I'm sure your opposition is rationally based, garbon. Nonetheless, much of the opposition is expressed in very visceral terms whether it's rationally based or not.

And yeah, Critical Mass is a bunch of bullshit; we get it once in a while up here.

[garbon]

Nonetheless, much of the opposition is expressed in very visceral terms whether it's rationally based or not.

Well that often happens when people are angry. Given that there is no organized anti-bicyclist crowd (which would also be odd to have - given the health benefits), it shouldn't be surprising that said frustration bubbles out in angry, emotive terms.

[crazy canuck]

I wont quarrel with you that cars are required if you live in the middle of nowhere - say Edmonton.  But if you live in a civilized region - say the Pacific coast - getting around by bike is a convenient, enjoyable and in many ways the preferred option so long as the distance travelled is reasonable.

Most of the pacific coast requires a car.

I said if you live in a civilized region.  I understand that there are large amounts of the US pacific coast in which cars are necessary.  But there are also oasis of civility.

[Eddie Teach]

Why pack an entire civilization into a 10 mile radius when you can drive a car and have some space and quiet?

[crazy canuck]

Why pack an entire civilization into a 10 mile radius when you can drive a car and have some space and quiet?

Space and quiet?  In LA?

[Ed Anger]

I need a car to get away from the subhumans that surround the Wolf's Lair.

[alfred russel]

My friends in the US say it's way more of a political issue over there. I remember that WSJ interview and the row between a couple of pedestrians and a cyclist in DC and I think it's probably yet another front in the culture wars.

It does seem like simple issues of civic governance have a tendency to be turned into acrimonious us vs them fights.

If people need cars to get around, and at certain times of the day the traffic is very bad say on a 2 lane road, it can be fustrating to have bikers going along at 10-15 mph when the flow of traffic picks up to a bit faster, but no one can safely get by the biker.

At the same time, it isn't so safe for the bikers.

The bottom line is that roads are scarce, it is difficult to have people traveling at different speeds, and bikes don't go as fast as cars.

[crazy canuck]

I need a car to get away from the subhumans that surround the Wolf's Lair.

By leaving the Wolf's Lair dont you necessarily (and perhaps unnecessarily) expose yourself to a greater danger of such contact?

[garbon]

I wont quarrel with you that cars are required if you live in the middle of nowhere - say Edmonton.  But if you live in a civilized region - say the Pacific coast - getting around by bike is a convenient, enjoyable and in many ways the preferred option so long as the distance travelled is reasonable.

Most of the pacific coast requires a car.

I said if you live in a civilized region.  I understand that there are large amounts of the US pacific coast in which cars are necessary.  But there are also oasis of civility.

You said civilized region - say Pacific Coast. The fact that most of the region apparently isn't civilized by your standards, hardly supports your assertion.

[Eddie Teach]

By region, he means Vancouver, Seattle, Portland and San Francisco.