Jews steal arab organs!

[Malthus]

The article isn't going to be read only by Swedes. In the Arab world, this sort of conspiracy stuff will read like gospel.

These organ theft stories have been around for decades and have been aimed at virtually every country, and seem to be taken as truth almost everywhere.  Americans doing aid work Latin America have been been attacked by locals who thought they were scouting out which organs to steal.  The US even has an official who's job is to counter organ theft rumors.  Of course, I don't think a similar Israeli official would have much success at that job...

Having an official whose job it is to deny the rumours is simply proof that the rumours are true.

[Slargos]

And per ush, the moment you utter something that could be even remotely construed as negative about israel or israeli conduct, you're an israel-hating nazi.

It's getting pretty boring.

No it is usually when it is something like 'Israelis kill arabs to harvest organs!'.  How that could be considered something "remotely construed" as negative I don't know.

But we have been over this before.

If you'd cared to actually read my post instead of attacking your comfortable strawman, you will note that what I was talking about was the attack against DSB when he claimed that Israel has two basic responses when not getting their way.

Really. Don't bother reading. It's much more fun making nonsensical attacks.

[Slargos]

Unlike Yi and others I actually would like to see an apology and retraction from the paper (though not the government) and I think this is the sort of thing over which heads should roll.  Though I don't think the government need to get involved.

Again, have we actually seen a direct quote showing condemnation or are we just taking it as a matter of faith that the article doesn't simply reference accusations by the families?

Here's a different way of looking at it from a diplomatic standpoint- if Israel ever hopes to wind things down over there, they're going to need to win people's trust. If I was an Israeli functionary, I would be upset that these accusations are being leveled, but I would view it as an important barometer and a chance to dispel some of the myths; simply screaming "that's not true!" tends to fuel hysteria, not curb it.

Aftonbladet thrives on "opinion pieces" where they can insinuate but not state outright what they really mean.

No, there was no claim that organ harvesting was actually taking place. It was simply written in such a fashion that the gullible reader (and this piece is intended for national consumption where a sad majority infact seem to be borderline retarded) would assume that it is actually going on no matter the lack of evidence to support it.

[Valmy]

If you'd cared to actually read my post instead of attacking your comfortable strawman, you will note that what I was talking about was the attack against DSB when he claimed that Israel has two basic responses when not getting their way.

I was speaking generally.  I attack Israel all the time and nobody has ever attacked me as an anti-semite because, you know, I don't say stupid anti-semitic shit.

But DSB basically implied Israel is always breaking international law and are lying about it or ignoring it to cover their dastardly deeds...so yeah.  I didn't feel the need to address such a retarded statement but whatever.

[Malthus]

And per ush, the moment you utter something that could be even remotely construed as negative about israel or israeli conduct, you're an israel-hating nazi.

It's getting pretty boring.

No it is usually when it is something like 'Israelis kill arabs to harvest organs!'.  How that could be considered something "remotely construed" as negative I don't know.

But we have been over this before.

If you'd cared to actually read my post instead of attacking your comfortable strawman, you will note that what I was talking about was the attack against DSB when he claimed that Israel has two basic responses when not getting their way.

Really. Don't bother reading. It's much more fun making nonsensical attacks.

Hey, we all think you are a Jew-hating Nazi even before you say anything about Israel. 

[Valmy]

Aftonbladet thrives on "opinion pieces" where they can insinuate but not state outright what they really mean.

No, there was no claim that organ harvesting was actually taking place. It was simply written in such a fashion that the gullible reader (and this piece is intended for national consumption where a sad majority infact seem to be borderline retarded) would assume that it is actually going on no matter the lack of evidence to support it.

Great.  I bet they spew all sorts of hateful un-substantiated shit against the United States as well.  What a great paper.

[Slargos]

I realize that. I just think it is another term that is being over-used, especially in the context of a nation with its own state, army and government.

I guess I don't see how that context makes any difference.  Why couldn't a people with a state, army, and government be accused of killing people for fun?  Heck we Americans get accused to starting wars just to kill brown people all the time, because we find it fun.

Just because people have a state, army, and government you can then accuse them of killing people for fun and it is ok?

Ok, let me explain what I meant because I think I am not making myself clear.

To me "blood libel" is an expression used to make such accusations look particularly heinous and dangerous, because they are targeted at a vulnerable minority; in this context, blood libel was often used as a prelude to pogroms. As such they have a very strong negative connotation in Western culture.

In this context, using the term "blood libel" to describe such accusations being leveled against the Israeli state (which, as you yourself point out, could and are sometimes used against other countries as well) is a semantic/intellectual dishonesty, in the same vein as labeling anyone who criticises Israel as an "antisemite".

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I understand that the article draws parallels between what is alleged to happen in Israeli with the recent case of organ-heisting is New Jersey in which some Jews were involved - which presumably elides the distinction between "Israeli" and "Jew", and the notion that all Jews are more or less interchangable/involved in a conspiracy together. This feeds directly on the "blood libel" mythology, which most Jews are rather adverse to (not me though - I'm rather looking forward to recycling Slargos for his useful* organs).

That being said, I certainly don't think it is the government's business to get involved in such things; but the blame isn't all on Israel's side - I understand that the Swedish ambassador in Israel in fact *did* condem the article, and Israel merely got angry when the Swedish "home gov't" failed to reaffirm it. It doesn't lie is Swedish mouths to get pissed at their own diplomatic failure. If it is against Swedish constitutional law to denounce newspaper articles, their abassador should not have  - denounced the article.   

*Not brain. That gets thrown out. Not genitalia either. 

That a jewish-swedish ambassador to Israel would haste to make an ass of herself in this question is certainly no big surprise.

The pertinence of appointing a jew as ambassador to Israel is an entirely different question.

[Slargos]

And per ush, the moment you utter something that could be even remotely construed as negative about israel or israeli conduct, you're an israel-hating nazi.

It's getting pretty boring.

No it is usually when it is something like 'Israelis kill arabs to harvest organs!'.  How that could be considered something "remotely construed" as negative I don't know.

But we have been over this before.

If you'd cared to actually read my post instead of attacking your comfortable strawman, you will note that what I was talking about was the attack against DSB when he claimed that Israel has two basic responses when not getting their way.

Really. Don't bother reading. It's much more fun making nonsensical attacks.

Hey, we all think you are a Jew-hating Nazi even before you say anything about Israel. 

If I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times: Israel is a shining beacon of light in an otherwise dark sub-continent.

Infact, if I could help all jews move there, I would graciously do so.

It's only sad that they revert to behaving like arabs all the fucking time.

[Viking]

If I print 'Tibet families claim China runs secret camps to harvet Tibetan organs' I bet the Chinese would probably think it was more than just reporting there are crazy Tibetans out there also.  Typically you don't just start reporting conspiracy theories in a paper, just you know, to catalogue all the conspiracy theories out there.

Well, in a similar case, the chinese did say

A Chinese Foreign Ministry Spokesman rejected the claims about Sujiatun as a "lie... not worth refuting."

however, Israel's usual bane, Amnesty international did get involved

Amnesty International stated that it considers the Chinese government's statements to be "at odds with the facts in view of the widely documented practice of the buying and selling of organs of death penalty prisoners in China."

The (wiki) link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_harvesting_in_the_People%27s_Republic_of_China

The charge is prisons selling the organs of executed prisoners.

[Slargos]

Aftonbladet thrives on "opinion pieces" where they can insinuate but not state outright what they really mean.

No, there was no claim that organ harvesting was actually taking place. It was simply written in such a fashion that the gullible reader (and this piece is intended for national consumption where a sad majority infact seem to be borderline retarded) would assume that it is actually going on no matter the lack of evidence to support it.

Great.  I bet they spew all sorts of hateful un-substantiated shit against the United States as well.  What a great paper.

Yes they do. Their newsreporting is built on lies, half-truths and obfuscation.

Seriously, I know I whine a lot about the state of Sweden today, but if you guys could only get a minute glimpse of the efficiency of the propaganda machine they're running, you would be horrified.

I think the prize for most ironic swedish statement of the 20th century is when our minister of finance called Norway "the last soviet state".

[Slargos]

If you'd cared to actually read my post instead of attacking your comfortable strawman, you will note that what I was talking about was the attack against DSB when he claimed that Israel has two basic responses when not getting their way.

I was speaking generally.  I attack Israel all the time and nobody has ever attacked me as an anti-semite because, you know, I don't say stupid anti-semitic shit.

But DSB basically implied Israel is always breaking international law and are lying about it or ignoring it to cover their dastardly deeds...so yeah.  I didn't feel the need to address such a retarded statement but whatever.

So implying that I was trivializing the allegations of organ theft was just a mistake on your part then? Slip of the fingers? 

[Malthus]

The charge is prisons selling the organs of executed prisoners.

Seems to me a world of difference between selling the organs of condemned prisoners and selling the organs of those killed fighting with Israeli troops.

For one, the army of Israel is a conscript army, in a very fractious democracy. How would a large-scale program of "harvesting" work - and not get noticed?

Second, the conditions for "harvesting" are likely not ideal when someone has been shot to death and left lying in the Judean sun for a while.

Contrast that with excecuted prisoners in a dictatorship.

[Valmy]

So implying that I was trivializing the allegations of organ theft was just a mistake on your part then? Slip of the fingers? 

If you like.

[Malthus]

That a jewish-swedish ambassador to Israel would haste to make an ass of herself in this question is certainly no big surprise.

The pertinence of appointing a jew as ambassador to Israel is an entirely different question.

Appointing a Jew. And a woman, too.

What were they thinking, eh?   

[Valmy]

Yes they do. Their newsreporting is built on lies, half-truths and obfuscation.

Seriously, I know I whine a lot about the state of Sweden today, but if you guys could only get a minute glimpse of the efficiency of the propaganda machine they're running, you would be horrified.

I think the prize for most ironic swedish statement of the 20th century is when our minister of finance called Norway "the last soviet state".

So really this article is just par for the course then.  Israel is being rather foolish to draw so much attention to it.