Tom Ridge joins the list of guys who make up lies about Bush

Started by DGuller, August 20, 2009, 03:42:30 PM

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alfred russel

#30
August 20, 2009, 10:53:50 PM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on August 20, 2009, 10:41:57 PM

If the first sentence of the article is correct, it's major.

If top administration officials mean Karl Rove or a similar political official, then I agree.

If top administration officials mean the Secretary of Defense and Attorney General and they explicitly mentioned the reason they wanted the threat level raised was political, I still agree, but to a lesser extent.

If top administration officials mean the Secretary of Defense and Attorney General, and they said they wanted the threat level raised after the Obama tape and Ridge thought that their motivation was in part political, I no longer agree.
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

There's a fine line between salvation and drinking poison in the jungle.

I'm embarrassed. I've been making the mistake of associating with you. It won't happen again. :)
-garbon, February 23, 2014

alfred russel

#31
August 20, 2009, 10:57:14 PM
Quote from: Berkut on August 20, 2009, 10:51:16 PM
Yawn.

Even at the time nobody took that crap seriously. Does it matter if it was bogus due to basic incompetence or due to politics?

It's not like these accusations were not leveled at the time, and this is some kind of breaking news story.

Bush allowed politics to influence his decisions??? Oh noes! Why, he must be the firstest President ever to do such a thing!

Raising the threat level meant deploying significant resources to increase national security. It isn't just a color coded bar that people laughed at.
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

There's a fine line between salvation and drinking poison in the jungle.

I'm embarrassed. I've been making the mistake of associating with you. It won't happen again. :)
-garbon, February 23, 2014

Eddie Teach

#32
August 20, 2009, 11:09:21 PM
To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

Fireblade

#33
August 20, 2009, 11:20:42 PM
Quote from: alfred russel on August 20, 2009, 10:57:14 PM
Raising the threat level meant deploying significant resources to increase national security. It isn't just a color coded bar that people laughed at.

You know, there's a town about an hour northeast of Little Rock called Bald Knob. About 2,000 people, mostly notable for growing a shitload of strawberries. It's such a shitty, obscure little town, that there's even people in Arkansas who haven't heard of it. In 2003 or 2004, I happened to be in Bald Knob, and wanted to go fishing in Bald Knob Lake.

Guess what I found out when I got there?

A big ass sign posted up saying that the lake is closed due to the threat level being at orange (or whatever), and a cop car blocking the road.

That was the day I became a Democrat.

alfred russel

#34
August 21, 2009, 12:11:49 AM
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

There's a fine line between salvation and drinking poison in the jungle.

I'm embarrassed. I've been making the mistake of associating with you. It won't happen again. :)
-garbon, February 23, 2014

Berkut

#35
August 21, 2009, 12:16:55 AM
Quote from: alfred russel on August 20, 2009, 10:57:14 PM
Quote from: Berkut on August 20, 2009, 10:51:16 PM
Yawn.

Even at the time nobody took that crap seriously. Does it matter if it was bogus due to basic incompetence or due to politics?

It's not like these accusations were not leveled at the time, and this is some kind of breaking news story.

Bush allowed politics to influence his decisions??? Oh noes! Why, he must be the firstest President ever to do such a thing!

Raising the threat level meant deploying significant resources to increase national security. It isn't just a color coded bar that people laughed at.

So?

Again, how is this news?

And how is it different from any number of examples of Presidents taking action because it was politically expedient to do so?

I agree that it is worthy of derision, but I don't understand why *this* particular example is so much more worthy than other examples.
"If you think this has a happy ending, then you haven't been paying attention."

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alfred russel

#36
August 21, 2009, 12:22:52 AM
Quote from: Berkut on August 21, 2009, 12:16:55 AM
Quote from: alfred russel on August 20, 2009, 10:57:14 PM
Quote from: Berkut on August 20, 2009, 10:51:16 PM
Yawn.

Even at the time nobody took that crap seriously. Does it matter if it was bogus due to basic incompetence or due to politics?

It's not like these accusations were not leveled at the time, and this is some kind of breaking news story.

Bush allowed politics to influence his decisions??? Oh noes! Why, he must be the firstest President ever to do such a thing!

Raising the threat level meant deploying significant resources to increase national security. It isn't just a color coded bar that people laughed at.

So?

Again, how is this news?

And how is it different from any number of examples of Presidents taking action because it was politically expedient to do so?

I agree that it is worthy of derision, but I don't understand why *this* particular example is so much more worthy than other examples.

Mobilizing the security apparatus of the country and warning of increased risk of attack at election time in order to get an electoral edge? I can't think of a number of examples of presidents using similar tactics, but regardless, I'd categorize that as worse than what got Nixon run out of office.
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

There's a fine line between salvation and drinking poison in the jungle.

I'm embarrassed. I've been making the mistake of associating with you. It won't happen again. :)
-garbon, February 23, 2014

Razgovory

#37
August 21, 2009, 12:31:21 AM
Meh when when people suggested this before it was just wild-eyed Bush hate.  When it's confirmed it's something we already knew. :lol:
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

Sheilbh

#38
August 21, 2009, 01:58:45 AM
Quote from: Razgovory on August 21, 2009, 12:31:21 AM
Meh when when people suggested this before it was just wild-eyed Bush hate.  When it's confirmed it's something we already knew. :lol:
I find that a bit odd.

I'm with Yi I think if this is true it should be big and it's problematic.

What's Ridge's reputation?  I remember reading that he was still pretty well regarded when people were mentioning him as a VP pick. 

QuoteI also love the way the fake news reporter interposed relatively innocuous comment of Tom Ridge with anonymous "Bush critics" (i.e. the reporters thinly disguised personal opinion) as if Ridge's comments actually reinforced his fantasies.
I could link you about a dozen articles suggesting just that, or 50 posts from CdM if we had old Languish.  It's not 'some Bush critics told me' but 'some Bush critics have said'.  The former's anonymous quoting, the latter is so you don't have to quote and date opinion columns.
Let's bomb Russia!

Fate

#39
August 21, 2009, 03:07:04 AM Last Edit: August 21, 2009, 03:08:50 AM by Fate
Ridge is not well regarded within his own party. I'm not sure what angle he's shooting for here. Bush kept us safe. Ridge should shut up. He had his chance to resign if he really felt that the administration was behaving in an unacceptable manner.

Caliga

#40
August 21, 2009, 05:00:57 AM
Story is on CNN this morning. ^_^
0 Ed Anger Disapproval Points

DontSayBanana

#41
August 21, 2009, 06:26:57 AM
You know why you guys are having trouble coming up with analogies? Because for what Nixon got run out of office for, Bush had a slap on the wrist before the end of his first term. Unjustified domestic surveillance, as well as fibbing to the American people about it. Using paranoia and threat awareness as a direct electoral tool? The closest example is NOT in US politics, but I'll be damned if I'm the one to name it out loud. :ph34r:
Experience bij!

DGuller

#42
August 21, 2009, 07:12:16 AM
Quote from: Razgovory on August 21, 2009, 12:31:21 AM
Meh when when people suggested this before it was just wild-eyed Bush hate.  When it's confirmed it's something we already knew. :lol:
The mind's capacity to ratioanlize uncomfortable thoughts away is nearly limitless.

Ed Anger

#43
August 21, 2009, 07:13:25 AM
I approve of it. Bush should have went full on evil and rounded certain people and groups up.
Stay Alive...Let the Man Drive

Razgovory

#44
August 21, 2009, 07:28:01 AM
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 21, 2009, 07:13:25 AM
I approve of it. Bush should have went full on evil and rounded certain people and groups up.

I doubt Bush even knew.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017
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