What does a BIDEN Presidency look like?

[Jacob]

Okay, I officially accept that the answer to my question "aren't most major media outlets in the US owned by GOP sympathizing oligarchs?" is "no, not when it comes to national media."

With respect to local media it does seem to be the case, though... correct?

... and then there's the question of the major social media spaces.

Twitter is definitely GOP aligned.

Tik-tok - I don't know. I expect it's a malign influence, but probably not explicitly GOP aligned?

Facebook - I don't know what Zuckerberg's personal political priorities are, but I believe it's fairly well established that Facebook as social media group amplifies right wing content quite effectively.

Alphabet (mainly youtube I think) - I have no idea about whether the main stakeholders' political ideals, but the efficacy of the "I'm curious about some topic" --> "right wing / conspiracy content floods my feed" funnel is pretty well established I think?

Of course Facebook / Alphabet could be less about the inherent bias of those systems and more about the fact that right wing/ conspiracy proponents are better organized when it comes to leveraging the systems as they're designed.

But from my POV at least, social media seems to be encouraging and facilitating a rightward drift in the political discourse.

[garbon]

Under Bezos the WaPo changed it's tagline to "Democracy Dies in Darkness".  I think we can safely exclude him from being pro-Trump.

I mean I guess the one other example of a "pro-GOP oligarch" would be Elon - but that's a social media company, not a news outlet.

WaPo is a solid newspaper with editorial freedom.
/journalist

Heyo

[Valmy]

Under Bezos the WaPo changed it's tagline to "Democracy Dies in Darkness".  I think we can safely exclude him from being pro-Trump.

I mean I guess the one other example of a "pro-GOP oligarch" would be Elon - but that's a social media company, not a news outlet.

WaPo is a solid newspaper with editorial freedom.
/journalist

Norgy?

[DGuller]

I've been saying for a while that unfortunately the way the media works makes it biased towards GOP regardless of who owns it.  Scaremongering sells news stories, and scare mongering also sells right-wing politics.

[Valmy]

Alphabet (mainly youtube I think) - I have no idea about whether the main stakeholders' political ideals, but the efficacy of the "I'm curious about some topic" --> "right wing / conspiracy content floods my feed" funnel is pretty well established I think?

Oh my God yes. But maybe if you are a right win/conspiracy buff you get annoyed when left wing/skeptic stuff gets sent your way as well. I don't know how it looks from their perspective.

In any case with Youtube I have tools to get rid of that stuff.

[Jacob]

In any case with Youtube I have tools to get rid of that stuff.

What tools are those?

I've kept my oldest off youtube (more or less) because I don't want him sliding down any of those funnels. If there's an effective way to control them, it would give me some peace of mind.

[Valmy]

In any case with Youtube I have tools to get rid of that stuff.

What tools are those?

I've kept my oldest off youtube (more or less) because I don't want him sliding down any of those funnels. If there's an effective way to control them, it would give me some peace of mind.

Just clicking the three dots and selecting "not interested" and "don't recommend this channel"

My son wants to round up all the billionaires and have them shot at this point but I am watching him. I check his youtube account from time to time.

I have been surprised by how much has changed in Middle School since my time there in 1988-1991 but one thing that most surprised me is what has not changed: racist, sexist, and homophobic jokes are still so common among boys that age. It is like nothing has changed at all since the late 80s. That is wild to me. But back in those days we couldn't take that discourse online...

[Sheilbh]

Norgy!

[Norgy]

Norgy!

Happy to see you, old friend! 

[Norgy]

Under Bezos the WaPo changed it's tagline to "Democracy Dies in Darkness".  I think we can safely exclude him from being pro-Trump.

I mean I guess the one other example of a "pro-GOP oligarch" would be Elon - but that's a social media company, not a news outlet.

WaPo is a solid newspaper with editorial freedom.
/journalist

Norgy?

Uhm, yes. Glad to see you all!         

[Barrister]

Is there any chance of "geriatricy" becoming a system of rule? Oldest and least mentally ill person gets a term.

I am not dropping by to just spite or ridicule, quite the opposite, I am deeply concerned. It is not like things are ship-shape in Norway, or in Europe.

For five years I have worked in the press. And I am fairly certain that my sector is a huge part of the problem. It is not "fake news", but rather how we report and that on a 24-hour news cycle, we tend to go for easy headlines. I have three items to deliver every day and they should be read by so-so many, else I have failed. I can only imagine how it works in larger media houses.
In my first stint, back in the late 90s, editors were happy if we managed to produce one good piece in a day.

Isn't more a "simple" issue that advertising has been swallowed up by the social media companies, leading to much tighter margins - and thus the need for quit hits?

Like I'm all for the argument "media is kind of fucked right now" - I just didn't think it was the simple argument put forward that media was controlled by the GOP.

And good to see you Norgy.

[Sheilbh]

Tik-tok - I don't know. I expect it's a malign influence, but probably not explicitly GOP aligned?

Not GOP aligned at all. In part its difficult to know because it's very opaque and heavily algorithmic on your interests.

But from what I've read left-leaning with Chinese characteristics - so I believe on foreign policy stuff especially it does seem like stuff aligned with China's position gets pushed a lot. Domestically it's just lefty. Although that may just be demographics.

Facebook - I don't know what Zuckerberg's personal political priorities are, but I believe it's fairly well established that Facebook as social media group amplifies right wing content quite effectively.

On their political leaning by all accounts very influential in Meta is stalwart Lib Dem Sir Nick Clegg as global head of public policy

As above - this may just reflect the demographics of the users. Facebook is actively getting out of news because it doesn't earn them any money and from what I've read it's not really a major location for political advertising any me.

Tech reporters here called 2024 our first post-Facebook election.

Of the Meta platforms - it's not a big deal in the US but the one I think is most politically consequential is WhatsApp.

Alphabet (mainly youtube I think) - I have no idea about whether the main stakeholders' political ideals, but the efficacy of the "I'm curious about some topic" --> "right wing / conspiracy content floods my feed" funnel is pretty well established I think?

Yeah definitely on YouTube. Although I think it is fairly specifically watch something about video games -> race science in three goes.

Although certainly in the UK the left alternative media seems to do well/focus on YouTube (Owen Jones, Novara etc) - as, indeed, do the centrist podcasters - so I don't know if we just sadly experience YouTube through the speedrun from enjoying a Paradox game to full-blown fascism

Although as above I wonder if this is demographics - thinking of the gender split among young people in a few countries. Maybe young women are on TikTok and young men are on YouTube?

[Sheilbh]

Isn't more a "simple" issue that advertising has been swallowed up by the social media companies, leading to much tighter margins - and thus the need for quit hits?

Like I'm all for the argument "media is kind of fucked right now" - I just didn't think it was the simple argument put forward that media was controlled by the GOP.

So I saw a chart on something today - it is highly, highly dubious (measuring sentiment) but I thought it was interesting and ties into this:


Someone was prompting it based on an NBC headline: "The Fed may soon cut interest rates. That could make your next trip abroad." (sub-head: "Falling interest rates tend to be 'dollar negative.' A weaker dollar means Americans can buy less abroad.")

All true but an interesting angle on rate cuts which you would normally frame around lower cost of credit for consumers (and business) taking on debt to buy a car, home, invest in their business etc. And I think this is true on Languish and on Twitter and online generally - people seem to have a harder time believing and sometimes get annoyed when you point out positive things rather than negative things.

So anyway, back to the chart. I think you're right. You've got a huge disruption in the business model with advertising. That made a lot of news organisations focus on pageviews as their key metric (many now think that was a mistake and are trying to work a way out of it). But also journalists and editors love reach so as they're trying to get out of the focus on pageviews part of it is also trying to bring newsrooms along. Because people read the negative more or hateclick that's the perspective that spread as it lined up with the metrics that the business and newsroom cared about (which turned out to be a huge mistake).

I'd add that across the industry and on Google the number of clicks and searches on news was rising until covid. And across the entire industry it has been very rapidly declining since covid. No-one really knows why - too much bad news caused people to "drop out", consumption habits changed in the pandemic, who knows?

And I think we undersestimate how recent the disruption of the internet is on media - I think it's only in the last 10-15 years that almost all news organisations accepted that they might need different headlines for online than print. That online wasn't just a website version of their print content.

[Norgy]

Is there any chance of "geriatricy" becoming a system of rule? Oldest and least mentally ill person gets a term.

I am not dropping by to just spite or ridicule, quite the opposite, I am deeply concerned. It is not like things are ship-shape in Norway, or in Europe.

For five years I have worked in the press. And I am fairly certain that my sector is a huge part of the problem. It is not "fake news", but rather how we report and that on a 24-hour news cycle, we tend to go for easy headlines. I have three items to deliver every day and they should be read by so-so many, else I have failed. I can only imagine how it works in larger media houses.
In my first stint, back in the late 90s, editors were happy if we managed to produce one good piece in a day.

Isn't more a "simple" issue that advertising has been swallowed up by the social media companies, leading to much tighter margins - and thus the need for quit hits?

Like I'm all for the argument "media is kind of fucked right now" - I just didn't think it was the simple argument put forward that media was controlled by the GOP.

And good to see you Norgy.

Yes, and yes.
And I don't buy media being controlled in any particular way. For that to happen, we journalists would have to be much more organised. We are not.

There is no doubt ad revenue has dried up along with paper subscriptions.
I am glad that after so much success in life I finally got into a dying industry. Next, I am going to try my hand at a sowing machine.

[The Minsky Moment]

Valmy for Congress!

I'd vote for him if he drops his support for the Washington Football Team or whatever dumb name they now have.

Snyder's folly.

And yes I know the ownership changed, but that taint just doesn't fade.