UK extends visa rights to 3 million Hong Kongers

[Tonitrus]

The internets are going out all over Hong Kong  We shall not see them connected again in our lifetime. 

[Monoriu]

I don't even know what they are talking about.  Everybody here continues to have access to Facebook, Youtube, Google etc.  All these are banned on the Mainland.

What people are really worried about is that they have said stuff like supporting HK independence, posting private, illegally obtained information on the police (such as their ID numbers) on Facebook, evidence that they participated in the riots, or aided the rioters etc.  That will make them liable to prosecution.  The day of reckoning has come, and they are deleting their accounts and posts. 

[grumbler]

"I don't even know what they are talking about with this 'atomic bomb'  stuff.  That B-29 up there dropped its bomb more than 30 seconds ago, and nothing bad has happened."

- Hiroshima Mono, 6 August 1945, 0816:00, Hiroshima time.

[Zoupa]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jul/08/china-great-firewall-descends-hong-kong-internet-users

Bye Mono.

Oh no!

动态网自由门 天安門 天安门 法輪功 李洪志 Free Tibet 六四天安門事件 The Tiananmen Square protests of 1989 天安門大屠殺 The Tiananmen Square Massacre 反右派鬥爭 The Anti-Rightist Struggle 大躍進政策 The Great Leap Forward 文化大革命 The Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution 人權 Human Rights 民運 Democratization 自由 Freedom 獨立 Independence 多黨制 Multi-party system 台灣 臺灣 Taiwan Formosa 中華民國 Republic of China 西藏 土伯特 唐古特 Tibet 達賴喇嘛 Dalai Lama 法輪功 Falun Dafa 新疆維吾爾自治區 The Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region 諾貝爾和平獎 Nobel Peace Prize 劉暁波 Liu Xiaobo 民主 言論 思想 反共 反革命 抗議 運動 騷亂 暴亂 騷擾 擾亂 抗暴 平反 維權 示威游行 李洪志 法輪大法 大法弟子 強制斷種 強制堕胎 民族淨化 人體實驗 肅清 胡耀邦 趙紫陽 魏京生 王丹 還政於民 和平演變 激流中國 北京之春 大紀元時報 九評論共産黨 獨裁 專制 壓制 統一 監視 鎮壓 迫害 侵略 掠奪 破壞 拷問 屠殺 活摘器官 誘拐 買賣人口 遊進 走私 毒品 賣淫 春畫 賭博 六合彩 天安門 天安门 法輪功 李洪志 Winnie the Pooh 劉曉波动态网自由门

Just making sure.

[Monoriu]

"I don't even know what they are talking about with this 'atomic bomb'  stuff.  That B-29 up there dropped its bomb more than 30 seconds ago, and nothing bad has happened."

- Hiroshima Mono, 6 August 1945, 0816:00, Hiroshima time.

It is no use arguing about this now.  Time will tell.  I propose that we revisit this topic in say half a year. 

[Eddie Teach]

He's not arguing, he's saying "I told you so" while you're still around to hear it.

[grumbler]

He's not arguing, he's saying "I told you so" while you're still around to hear it.

No, I am just pointing out that the observation that "it hasn't happened yet" is just an observation, not an argument based on the presentation of any evidence.

[FunkMonk]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jul/08/china-great-firewall-descends-hong-kong-internet-users

Bye Mono.

Oh no!

动态网自由门 天安門 天安门 法輪功 李洪志 Free Tibet 六四天安門事件 The Tiananmen Square protests of 1989 天安門大屠殺 The Tiananmen Square Massacre 反右派鬥爭 The Anti-Rightist Struggle 大躍進政策 The Great Leap Forward 文化大革命 The Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution 人權 Human Rights 民運 Democratization 自由 Freedom 獨立 Independence 多黨制 Multi-party system 台灣 臺灣 Taiwan Formosa 中華民國 Republic of China 西藏 土伯特 唐古特 Tibet 達賴喇嘛 Dalai Lama 法輪功 Falun Dafa 新疆維吾爾自治區 The Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region 諾貝爾和平獎 Nobel Peace Prize 劉暁波 Liu Xiaobo 民主 言論 思想 反共 反革命 抗議 運動 騷亂 暴亂 騷擾 擾亂 抗暴 平反 維權 示威游行 李洪志 法輪大法 大法弟子 強制斷種 強制堕胎 民族淨化 人體實驗 肅清 胡耀邦 趙紫陽 魏京生 王丹 還政於民 和平演變 激流中國 北京之春 大紀元時報 九評論共産黨 獨裁 專制 壓制 統一 監視 鎮壓 迫害 侵略 掠奪 破壞 拷問 屠殺 活摘器官 誘拐 買賣人口 遊進 走私 毒品 賣淫 春畫 賭博 六合彩 天安門 天安门 法輪功 李洪志 Winnie the Pooh 劉曉波动态网自由门

Just making sure.

Also

Xi Jinping is a massive piece of shit

[Sheilbh]

BREAKING: #HongKongPolice have entered the office of the Public Opinion Research Institute, PORI, according to source. #RTHK is told that officers have a search warrant & accuses the survey body of dishonest use of computer. Source says police are trying to take away all PCs

From what I can see there's maybe two reasons for this. One is that PORI just did a poll on whether or not Hong Kong is still a free city, the other is that PORI are contracted to help run the pro-democracy camps' primaries.

Either way this is the risk for businesses in Hong Kong, it's not necessarily that it's a less liberal place than it was last week it's that it's a far less certain place than it was. That uncertainty might help the PRC government but it hugely removes the incentive of being in China and not the mainland. It's still probably just better if you need a location in China than mainland cities (but maybe not - arguably they're more stable still), but if you're needing a base in Asia then I feel like it'd be worth looking at places where you can predict whether what you and your staff do is illegal or not.

Edit: And adding to the uncertainty European and US banks in Hong Kong are reportedly conducting emergency audits of their clients to identify risks. Also the National Security Law makes it illegal for banks in Hong Kong to comply with international (US) sanctions against China or Hong Kong. So you either choose to do business in Hong Kong/China or the US - it's tough to see a way you can do both without breaking someone's laws. The impact will depend on the US sanctions list - but again this just adds to the uncertainty of working in Hong Kong as an international business now.

Edit: Also China's had a bit of a tantrum over Australia suspending their extradition treaty with Hong Kong. Australia's also been in discussions with Japan and they're talking about deepening the security relatinoship between Australia, the US, India and Japan ("the quad). The EU has also started to propose some measures - banning the sale of police equipment to Hong Kong, offering assylum for political activists and grants for scholarships for Hong Kong students.

Striking comment from the NZ foreign secretary that the law "fundamentally changed the environment for international engagement" because NZ is, by some distance, the most pro-China of the five eyes countries.

[Monoriu]

BREAKING: #HongKongPolice have entered the office of the Public Opinion Research Institute, PORI, according to source. #RTHK is told that officers have a search warrant & accuses the survey body of dishonest use of computer. Source says police are trying to take away all PCs

From what I can see there's maybe two reasons for this. One is that PORI just did a poll on whether or not Hong Kong is still a free city, the other is that PORI are contracted to help run the pro-democracy camps' primaries.

It is not the first reason.   

[Sheilbh]

It is not the first reason.

Interesting - is there something specific to pollsters that makes them risky or do you think this would apply to other companies that provide services to pro-democracy parties/activists?

[Monoriu]

It is not the first reason.

Interesting - is there something specific to pollsters that makes them risky or do you think this would apply to other companies that provide services to pro-democracy parties/activists?

That pollster is very pro-democratic.  I am not saying his polls are biased, but his political stance is very clear.  People who are familiar with HK's political scene won't be unfamiliar with him, and people will conclude that he doesn't run a normal business.  He is part of the pan-democratic establishment, and those who don't belong to that establishment don't have much to worry about. 

[Sheilbh]

That pollster is very pro-democratic.  I am not saying his polls are biased, but his political stance is very clear.  People who are familiar with HK's political scene won't be unfamiliar with him, and people will conclude that he doesn't run a normal business.  He is part of the pan-democratic establishment, and those who don't belong to that establishment don't have much to worry about.

Okay. What about other businesses though? You've mentioned the restaurants in the yellow economic circle, there's this pollster. I mean what about if you're the banker or lawyer for a pan-democractic party? Is that within the pan-democratic establishment or just a normal business providing services to the pan-democrats?

[Monoriu]

That pollster is very pro-democratic.  I am not saying his polls are biased, but his political stance is very clear.  People who are familiar with HK's political scene won't be unfamiliar with him, and people will conclude that he doesn't run a normal business.  He is part of the pan-democratic establishment, and those who don't belong to that establishment don't have much to worry about.

Okay. What about other businesses though? You've mentioned the restaurants in the yellow economic circle, there's this pollster. I mean what about if you're the banker or lawyer for a pan-democractic party? Is that within the pan-democratic establishment or just a normal business providing services to the pan-democrats?

Banks would be fine.  A ton of pan-democrats are senior lawyers (or Queen's Counsels in the UK), so they don't need to hire lawyers.  They are the lawyers  Apple Daily, the largest pan-democratic newspaper, is finished.  The yellow economic circle are mostly tiny eateries.  They'll be targetted in many different ways, but my guess is they'll be fine if they leave the circle soon enough.  Many already have. 

I mean, if you are apolitical, you'll be fine. 

[Razgovory]

What percentage of government workers on the mainland and apolitical, that is to say not part of the Communist party?