Bernie v Joe, Who do you like?

[The Minsky Moment]

In sum: the President's lawyer did a deal with a mobbed up Russian-linked oligarch to get a falsified affidavit in return for using his clout to get the oligarch cleared of charges in the US.  The associate of the President's lawyer received a $1 million payoff as part of the scheme.

So yes - it is scandalous.

[Solmyr]

Additionally he doesn't have sexism going against him which was a factor with Clinton and he also doesn't have Clinton's history going against him.

You mean Joe "Let Me Creepily Smell Your Hair" Biden?

[dps]

The thing is, while Biden might be creepily out of touch with current views on personal space, Trump seems actively malicious in how he treats women.

[merithyn]

Don't be silly,  g. Being a woman had no bearing on her candidacy.

It certainly didn't help her win the woman vote

Fuck that election.

It's not so much "fuck that election" because women didn't vote for the woman despite the fact that she's a woman, it is  "fuck that election" because women did vote for the Trump despite the fact that he's a Trump.  I can account for men voting for Trump by invoking stupidity; the only way to account for the women's vote is by invoking insanity.

I agree. I simply don't understand...

[merithyn]

Yeah I just meant fuck that election in general. So much fuckness going on.

Yea, so we're going to do the exact same thing this time, but with less appeal for women to vote blue.

I'll disagree with you there. Biden, I think, holds more appeal for more women. He certainly does for me.

[merithyn]

Possibly. It is what I am worried about.

At least Clinton was coherent.

Also, I like Biden, but he is a little creepy with woomen - I don't think it's malicious - but it is a little weird, no?

Biden is a centrist, which I think appeals to more women than the unfocused dreams of Bernie. Warren had goals, plans, and ideals with meat. That's not what I've seen in Bernie.

[grumbler]

The nukes have been deployed against Trump already and he is still standing. He was blatantly dishonest and corrupt in 2016, but the scandals that got traction were emails and Benghazi (which I don't really see as even approaching a scandal, but here we are). Burisma has at least as much "scandal" value as the emails and Benghazi.

The nukes I referred to are almost all things that Trump has done since taking office.  He also illegally holds a lease from the US government for the old post office building in DC (now the DC Trump hotel).

Like I said, none of this matters to the True Trump Believers, but there's a shitload of people not in that category, and Trump will be on the defensive when it comes to exchanges of charges of corruption.  He'd be better served not bringing up corruption at all. 

[Razgovory]

Trump won't be on the defensive in November, he'll the the candidate who isn't the subject of a major criminal inquiry. 

[Eddie Teach]

I think he'll be on the defensive for poor disaster management.

[Barrister]

Trump won't be on the defensive in November, he'll the the candidate who isn't the subject of a major criminal inquiry.

Given everything that happened with impeachment, with Mueller, I don't think Trump can get away with that.  The harder he goes after Biden in the courts, the more afraid of Biden he looks, the more outraged centrists and liberals will be.

[Oexmelin]

Given everything that happened with impeachment, with Mueller, I don't think Trump can get away with that.  The harder he goes after Biden in the courts, the more afraid of Biden he looks, the more outraged centrists and liberals will be.

...and? You think this will translate into votes?

The only way Democrats win vote is by producing a narrative of their own, and that narrative must absolutely not be one rooted in some kind of sophisticated discourse about the facts of impeachment, or the details of Burisma, or any of those things. No one cares anymore. This is just not good campaigning.  Trump's message is simple stupid: Democrats hate you, and everything you stand for. They are unfair, and ready for anything. This  pushes the right buttons of Democrats who over, and over, and over again fall into the trap of trying to show that no, they are not unfair, really. So they keep responding to Trump, who keeps moving the goalposts and while it doesn't look like it at all, that Trumpian message is already quite disciplined by virtue of being vetted and repeated by Fox News. Trumps says something, and Fox spends considerable energy making it real, which in turn gives Trump, who feeds of it, the necessary branching narratives.   

[Razgovory]

It's like 2016 didn't happen.  I just saw a video where a Trump supporter stated she did not believe there was a coronavirus.  She said she wouldn't trust anything Democrats say.  One of the things we have found out because of Trump is that not only do people believe a lie if you tell it long enough, if you try to debunk the lie people will believe the lie even more.

[Maximus]

Yeah I just meant fuck that election in general. So much fuckness going on.

Yea, so we're going to do the exact same thing this time, but with less appeal for women to vote blue.

I'll disagree with you there. Biden, I think, holds more appeal for more women. He certainly does for me.

More than Clinton?

[merithyn]

Yeah I just meant fuck that election in general. So much fuckness going on.

Yea, so we're going to do the exact same thing this time, but with less appeal for women to vote blue.

I'll disagree with you there. Biden, I think, holds more appeal for more women. He certainly does for me.

More than Clinton?

Nope. Nor than Warren. But neither of them are in the race. Between Biden and Sanders, though, Biden is preferable.

[Maximus]

Yeah I just meant fuck that election in general. So much fuckness going on.

Yea, so we're going to do the exact same thing this time, but with less appeal for women to vote blue.

I'll disagree with you there. Biden, I think, holds more appeal for more women. He certainly does for me.

More than Clinton?

Nope. Nor than Warren. But neither of them are in the race. Between Biden and Sanders, though, Biden is preferable.

I was comparing it to 2016