Coronavirus Sars-CoV-2/Covid-19 Megathread

[jimmy olsen]

A question. I'm old enough to have a smallpox inoculation scar on my arm. I remember reading about how smallpox was the first disease to be completely eradicated by vaccinations.

Was there a strong anti-vax movement back when smallpox vaccinations were being given? I mean, that one actually permanently scars you.

https://twitter.com/PadraicJudge/status/1389047619448721411

[Sheilbh]

A question. I'm old enough to have a smallpox inoculation scar on my arm. I remember reading about how smallpox was the first disease to be completely eradicated by vaccinations.

Was there a strong anti-vax movement back when smallpox vaccinations were being given? I mean, that one actually permanently scars you.

Not only that but the arguments appear to be fairly similar:
https://www.history.ox.ac.uk/article/covid-19-anti-vaxxers-use-the-same-arguments-from-135-years-ago

[The Brain]

Was Tyranny of Doctorcraft the premium MMORPG in those days?

[Josquius]

I could just be doing the opposite of the whole thing of seeing the past I never lived through, through rose tinted specs....
But it does strike me people in the past were a lot more aware of their ignorance. They knew that they didn't know everything and accepted that doctors and scientists knew what they were doing rather than thinking some random idiot online could know something mainstream scientists don't.

[Grey Fox]

In 1885 there was a Smallpox epidemic in Montreal. When the health authorities declared mandatory inoculation there were riots. French poor believed that the rich english were looking to eliminate them.

[Sheilbh]

I mean tbf, they were probably right

[Duque de Bragança]

A question. I'm old enough to have a smallpox inoculation scar on my arm. I remember reading about how smallpox was the first disease to be completely eradicated by vaccinations.

Was there a strong anti-vax movement back when smallpox vaccinations were being given? I mean, that one actually permanently scars you.

I was among the last ones to be vaccinated against smallpox. From what I gathered according to my parents (I was a baby) there was no opposition both in my time and theirs. Theirs was the one who left marks.
Both different times and countries, for what it's worth.

The anti-vaccination movement only came to Portugal well after Salazar and Caetano, in the early 2000s.

[mongers]

A question. I'm old enough to have a smallpox inoculation scar on my arm. I remember reading about how smallpox was the first disease to be completely eradicated by vaccinations.

Was there a strong anti-vax movement back when smallpox vaccinations were being given? I mean, that one actually permanently scars you.

I was among the last ones to be vaccinated against smallpox. From what I gathered according to my parents (I was a baby) there was no opposition both in my time and theirs. Theirs was the one who left marks.
Both different times and countries, for what it's worth.

The anti-vaccination movement only came to Portugal well after Salazar and Caetano, in the early 2000s.

Odd that there was once a time when most people trusted in the wisdom of their government and health workers.

[Syt]

With ICU cases creeping back up, FFP2 masks return from tomorrow in supermarkets and public transports. In other areas that require face coverings (other shops, theaters, etc.), FFP2 is required by non-vaccinated people, and recommended for vaccinated people. Police and shop owners are supposed to do spot checks.

[Syt]

Daily vaccinations are still at a snail's pace with 2/3 of the vaccinatable population fully immunized. The government seems to have no idea what to do about it except sending buses to various locations like churches, mosques, football stadiums, music venues etc. Several pro-government newspapers have had prominent articles and op eds urging people to get vaccinated, so yay, I guess?

[HVC]

Not sure how it works for universal health care countries (including canada) but can you cut off free health care for covid related hospitalization to the unvaccinated?  At this point I don't think soft measures will increase vaccination rates.

[Malthus]

A question. I'm old enough to have a smallpox inoculation scar on my arm. I remember reading about how smallpox was the first disease to be completely eradicated by vaccinations.

Was there a strong anti-vax movement back when smallpox vaccinations were being given? I mean, that one actually permanently scars you.

I spoke once with my parents about this once, and they said there wasn't anti-vaccine sentiment back when.  They were were in the first generation to get the Salk vaccine.  They knew people who had been crippled by polio; and whatever risk there was to getting the vaccine, it was certainly much better than that.  They thought that's why there's anti-vaxxers today; most people living today haven't even seen the permanent damage measles can do much less polio or smallpox.

This whole sentiment reminds me of the bit in Good Omens where one of the horsemen of the apocalypse, the Pestilence, retired because of modern medicine.

By coincidence, I was rewatching that very episode with my wife the other day, and we had the same reaction: that particular bit of whimsy has really not aged well!

[Malthus]

Not sure how it works for universal health care countries (including canada) but can you cut off free health care for covid related hospitalization to the unvaccinated?  At this point I don't think soft measures will increase vaccination rates.

I remember having similar conversations before - in law school, one of my study friends was adamant that those who (for example) smoke should be denied publicly funded health care, because they had no excuse for indulging in that particular stupidity and the rest of us should not have to pay for it. That this would condemn lots of people who presumably had friends and family to poverty or death did not move her (at the time, I was myself a smoker, and thought it odd to be expected to agree with this argument).

Point being that once the decision is made that stupidity should be punished with a removal of social responsibility for care, it will be difficult to contain it. If anti-Vaxx should not get health care, presumably other stupid decisions should be treated similarly - smokers, the obese, alcoholics, those who fail to exercise, etc.

[Malthus]

I mean tbf, they were probably right

If they wanted to do that, they merely had to ... not offer the French poor inoculations against smallpox.

[Malthus]

A question. I'm old enough to have a smallpox inoculation scar on my arm. I remember reading about how smallpox was the first disease to be completely eradicated by vaccinations.

Was there a strong anti-vax movement back when smallpox vaccinations were being given? I mean, that one actually permanently scars you.

Not only that but the arguments appear to be fairly similar:
https://www.history.ox.ac.uk/article/covid-19-anti-vaxxers-use-the-same-arguments-from-135-years-ago

This is very interesting and something I had no clue about.