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Should Trump be impeached?

Started by merithyn, April 29, 2019, 01:50:49 PM

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Should Trump be impeached?

Yes, before the election
Yes, but only after the election if he's re-elected
No, wait until he's out of office and then indict him
No, he's done nothing worthy of impeachment
Hell if I know

Solmyr

So is the US a presidential dictatorship now? Trump gets to do whatever he wants without any opposition (and if there is any, he calls it a coup attempt), members of his administration are free to ignore or actively oppose the legislative body, and this is all apparently fine with the majority of the electorate.

Valmy

#61
Quote from: Solmyr on May 03, 2019, 11:48:23 AM
So is the US a presidential dictatorship now? Trump gets to do whatever he wants without any opposition (and if there is any, he calls it a coup attempt), members of his administration are free to ignore or actively oppose the legislative body, and this is all apparently fine with the majority of the electorate.

What is the evidence that the majority of the electorate is fine with it? A large minority fanatically supports him, and the President can do almost anything he wants so long as over 33% of the legislature will go along with it. This is similar to the frustrations the Republicans felt when they controlled the legislature but not sufficiently to really stop Obama. The President is super powerful just generally.
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."

Valmy

Quote from: Zoupa on May 01, 2019, 05:54:58 PM
Don't feed the troll. His fedora gets bigger each time we feed it.

What I hate is that he is so good at baiting. He will say something reasonable and then I agree and then he turns around and then turns it up to something crazy. I am never quite sure how we got from A to B there.
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."

grumbler

Quote from: Valmy on May 03, 2019, 12:06:05 PM
What I hate is that he is so good at baiting. He will say something reasonable and then I agree and then he turns around and then turns it up to something crazy. I am never quite sure how we got from A to B there.

So long as you realize that he is lying about things like "Rachel Maddow and her Russian polar vortex," his baiting cannot work.  Like Trump himself, Legbiter seems to lie for the pleasure of lying - the fact that we all know he is lying just adds to his pleasure.  I am sure that there is a name for this pathology, but the effect is simply that you should assume that nothing he says is true, because anything he says that actually is true is only true by accident.
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!

crazy canuck

Quote from: Valmy on May 03, 2019, 12:04:30 PM
Quote from: Solmyr on May 03, 2019, 11:48:23 AM
So is the US a presidential dictatorship now? Trump gets to do whatever he wants without any opposition (and if there is any, he calls it a coup attempt), members of his administration are free to ignore or actively oppose the legislative body, and this is all apparently fine with the majority of the electorate.

What is the evidence that the majority of the electorate is fine with it?

A quibble of sorts - It doesn't really matter what a majority of the American electorate thinks.  It only matters how their votes convert to electoral college votes.  And I am concerned that the majority of college votes will be with Trump at the next election.

Sophie Scholl

Quote from: Solmyr on May 03, 2019, 11:48:23 AM
So is Venezuela a presidential dictatorship now? Maduro gets to do whatever he wants without any opposition (and if there is any, he calls it a coup attempt), members of his administration are free to ignore or actively oppose the legislative body, and this is all apparently fine with the majority of the electorate.

With the amount of oil we have, I'm surprised we haven't invaded ourselves yet.
"Everything that brought you here -- all the things that made you a prisoner of past sins -- they are gone. Forever and for good. So let the past go... and live."

"Somebody, after all, had to make a start. What we wrote and said is also believed by many others. They just don't dare express themselves as we did."

Razgovory

Quote from: grumbler on May 03, 2019, 12:28:31 PM
Quote from: Valmy on May 03, 2019, 12:06:05 PM
What I hate is that he is so good at baiting. He will say something reasonable and then I agree and then he turns around and then turns it up to something crazy. I am never quite sure how we got from A to B there.

So long as you realize that he is lying about things like "Rachel Maddow and her Russian polar vortex," his baiting cannot work.  Like Trump himself, Legbiter seems to lie for the pleasure of lying - the fact that we all know he is lying just adds to his pleasure.  I am sure that there is a name for this pathology, but the effect is simply that you should assume that nothing he says is true, because anything he says that actually is true is only true by accident.

Pseudologia fantastica.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

Razgovory

Quote from: Solmyr on May 03, 2019, 11:48:23 AM
So is the US a presidential dictatorship now? Trump gets to do whatever he wants without any opposition (and if there is any, he calls it a coup attempt), members of his administration are free to ignore or actively oppose the legislative body, and this is all apparently fine with the majority of the electorate.

It is rather alarming, isn't it?  Trump appears to believe that he is not subject to law, and with Barr in control of the Justice Department, he's correct to believe that.  I'm fairly certain Trump will be re-elected in 2020.  Trump can and will engage in unethical or even criminal behavior in the next election  That will be enough to win him four more years.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

Eddie Teach

Are you saying Trump will rig the election in his favor? Easier said than done.
To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

Oexmelin

Quote from: Benedict Arnold on May 03, 2019, 02:26:31 PM
Quote from: Solmyr on May 03, 2019, 11:48:23 AM
So is Venezuela a presidential dictatorship now? Maduro gets to do whatever he wants without any opposition (and if there is any, he calls it a coup attempt), members of his administration are free to ignore or actively oppose the legislative body, and this is all apparently fine with the majority of the electorate.

With the amount of oil we have, I'm surprised we haven't invaded ourselves yet.

I have a colleague who has his students write reports on the US using the same tone as is usually employed for describing other countries. It's always an enlightening exercise.

Que le grand cric me croque !

Sophie Scholl

Quote from: Eddie Teach on May 03, 2019, 04:27:09 PM
Are you saying Trump will rig the election in his favor? Easier said than done.
Nothing has been done to curb Russian or Chinese interference in our elections.  After the Muller Report and the narrative being put forth by the media in general and the right in particular, Russia and Trump were "cleared".  If anything, it will be easier in 2020 than it was in 2016.  Working with foreign agents is perfectly fine amongst other developments it seems.
"Everything that brought you here -- all the things that made you a prisoner of past sins -- they are gone. Forever and for good. So let the past go... and live."

"Somebody, after all, had to make a start. What we wrote and said is also believed by many others. They just don't dare express themselves as we did."

The Brain

The Republican party is now a Putin support party, as demonstrated by the past few years. Rather than resist Russia they will gleefully spread Uncle Sam's cheeks for further ramming.
Women want me. Men want to be with me.

Eddie Teach

Quote from: Benedict Arnold on May 03, 2019, 04:49:01 PM
Quote from: Eddie Teach on May 03, 2019, 04:27:09 PM
Are you saying Trump will rig the election in his favor? Easier said than done.
Nothing has been done to curb Russian or Chinese interference in our elections.  After the Muller Report and the narrative being put forth by the media in general and the right in particular, Russia and Trump were "cleared".  If anything, it will be easier in 2020 than it was in 2016.  Working with foreign agents is perfectly fine amongst other developments it seems.

They can spread all the propaganda they want, if we fall for it, that's on us.
To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

crazy canuck

Quote from: Eddie Teach on May 03, 2019, 05:09:23 PM
Quote from: Benedict Arnold on May 03, 2019, 04:49:01 PM
Quote from: Eddie Teach on May 03, 2019, 04:27:09 PM
Are you saying Trump will rig the election in his favor? Easier said than done.
Nothing has been done to curb Russian or Chinese interference in our elections.  After the Muller Report and the narrative being put forth by the media in general and the right in particular, Russia and Trump were "cleared".  If anything, it will be easier in 2020 than it was in 2016.  Working with foreign agents is perfectly fine amongst other developments it seems.

They can spread all the propaganda they want, if we fall for it, that's on us.

The consequences go a little wider in the world than just you.

Admiral Yi

Quote from: Benedict Arnold on May 03, 2019, 04:49:01 PM
Nothing has been done to curb Russian or Chinese interference in our elections.  After the Muller Report and the narrative being put forth by the media in general and the right in particular, Russia and Trump were "cleared".  If anything, it will be easier in 2020 than it was in 2016.  Working with foreign agents is perfectly fine amongst other developments it seems.

Nothing in the Mueller report or anywhere else cleared Russia of interfering in the election.