Agreement for Nabucco Pipeline signed - gas route without Russia.

[Tamas]

Sorry for some reason I thought we were talking about Armenia.

Still, I do think that Chechnya and Azerbajian are apples and oranges. Azerbajian is not a rebel republic, the independence of which Russia is not recognizing. Like Ukraine or Lithuania, it may be a former part of the SU but its international status is completely different from that of Chechnya.

Yeah but it did not stop them in case of Georgia, did it?

[Valmy]

Sorry for some reason I thought we were talking about Armenia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_Soviet_Socialist_Republic

Um...Marty?

For somebody who grew up in the Soviet Bloc you sure seem uninformed about who your Warsaw Pact buddies were.

[KRonn]

North America also has vast amounts of untapped natural gas. That should be drilled for and exported to Europe, probably by ship, and to where ever else. And of course used in N. America.

[Valmy]

North America also has vast amounts of untapped natural gas. That should be drilled for and exported to Europe, probably by ship, and to where ever else. And of course used in N. America.

Whatever resources there are in North America shall be consumed by the unlimited appetite of the mighty American consumer.  NO GAS FOR YOU EUROPE!

[Martinus]

If you expect me to check that every fact I post on Languish is true, we may just as well finish our discussion here and now, as I see no point in continuing it. 

[Valmy]

If you expect me to check that every fact I post on Languish is true, we may just as well finish our discussion here and now, as I see no point in continuing it. 

That what we are here for: to educumacate you!

[HVC]

Gas from Azerbaijan's Shah Deniz 2 field will be a crucial component of the project. European officials have raised hopes that other gas producers, such as Iraq and Turkmenistan, also might contribute to the pipeline.

So then Russia will probably invade Azerbaijan by 2013.

Yeah, because Russian interference with nationalist Muslims has worked so well in the past.

Hey we haven't learned, why should they?

[DGuller]

Nope, it's just that Marty implied that Chechnya's reconquista by the Russians could not happen with Azerbaijan because Chechens were part of the SU. Azeris were, as well, so yes, they will get stomped if this Nabucco thing ever turns out to be a realistic project.

There is a big difference.  Chechnya was part of the Russian republic, while Azerbaijan was its own republic.  Therefore, Chechens had to rebel from Russia, which entitled Russia to come in and put them down.  On the other hand, Azeris automatically got their own country once USSR fell apart, so Russians have no pretext for coming.

[Tamas]

Nope, it's just that Marty implied that Chechnya's reconquista by the Russians could not happen with Azerbaijan because Chechens were part of the SU. Azeris were, as well, so yes, they will get stomped if this Nabucco thing ever turns out to be a realistic project.

There is a big difference.  Chechnya was part of the Russian republic, while Azerbaijan was its own republic.  Therefore, Chechens had to rebel from Russia, which entitled Russia to come in and put them down.  On the other hand, Azeris automatically got their own country once USSR fell apart, so Russians have no pretext for coming.

Yes. And as I said to Marty: that did not stop them in the case of Georgia. You really don't have to sweat it to find a casus belli in that region.

[Neil]

Nope, it's just that Marty implied that Chechnya's reconquista by the Russians could not happen with Azerbaijan because Chechens were part of the SU. Azeris were, as well, so yes, they will get stomped if this Nabucco thing ever turns out to be a realistic project.

There is a big difference.  Chechnya was part of the Russian republic, while Azerbaijan was its own republic.  Therefore, Chechens had to rebel from Russia, which entitled Russia to come in and put them down.  On the other hand, Azeris automatically got their own country once USSR fell apart, so Russians have no pretext for coming.

Amd Azerbaijan was part of the Russian Empire, and therefore the Russians have all the pretext they feel they need to invade and exterminate all who oppose them.

[derspiess]

Sorry for some reason I thought we were talking about Armenia.

Well, Armenia was a Soviet Republic as well.

The funny thing about Armenia is that (according to the map anyway) they seem to be participating in the pipeline, even though they are (AFAIK) pretty firmly within Putinvedev's sphere of influence.

I used to like Armenia over Azerbaijan, but that has flipped recently. 

[Valmy]

I used to like Armenia over Azerbaijan, but that has flipped recently. 

Was it Psellus that turned you off?

[derspiess]

Yes. And as I said to Marty: that did not stop them in the case of Georgia. You really don't have to sweat it to find a casus belli in that region.

Well, you do have to be a bit sneakier about it.  Helps a lot if there is a pissed off ethnic minority in the former SSR.

[derspiess]

Was it Psellus that turned you off?

Nah.  I try to reserve all my spite for Marty & Jaron.

[Queequeg]

I used to like Armenia over Azerbaijan, but that has flipped recently.

Every player in the Caucases has to play a complicated balancing game between Moscow and Washington/Brussels.   In the case of Armenia this is further complicated by the tenuous situation in Nagorno-Kharabakh, especially as the Azeri economy is taking off while the Armenian economy has yet to fully recover from the war and the earthquake.  Generally speaking, Armenia can play pretty close to Moscow as the Armenian American/European community have quite a bit of influence and general sympathy with the Armenian situation in the West goes  a long way.

That said, Armenia is in most respects still a better country.  The war took a toll on both sides but was largely fought within the former Azeri SSR, and more than a century of the oil industry has wrecked what was once a pretty place.