The shit in Spain falls mainly in the fan

[Valmy]

I did not mention any sort of Statute of Autonomy. You must be talking about somebody else's post and quoted mine by mistake.

[Eddie Teach]

Grumbler can't be bothered to wiki, so he's asking you to explain the statute for him. 

[Iormlund]

If only the PP hadn't asked the courts to gut the 2006 autonomy-agreement then. That seems to be the event that sparks the events leading up to now.

Nah. It accelerated things, but separatism has been slowly rising for decades. It's all about media and education control.

If the Generalitat controlled its own source of revenue Spain would have far fewer cards right now to defuse the situation.

[grumbler]

I did not mention any sort of Statute of Autonomy. You must be talking about somebody else's post and quoted mine by mistake.

Then you did the same to Crazy Ivan, so I guess that's all okay.  He wasn't reaching, and you were accusing someone else, and just quoted him by mistake.  Got it.

[grumbler]

Grumbler can't be bothered to wiki, so he's asking you to explain the statute for him. 

Eddie can't read even the posts here, and so is asking if anyone can explain to him what I said.

I know a fair amount about the Autonomy Statute of 2006, and what happened to it when it was challenged in court (including the 2010 ruling that CI blames for the current troubles).

[Eddie Teach]

Grumbler can't be bothered to wiki, so he's asking you to explain the statute for him. 

Eddie can't read even the posts here, and so is asking if anyone can explain to him what I said.

Nah, I was running with my own interpretation, right or wrong. 

[Drakken]

So what's the word from Madrid so far? And in non-Catalonian medias? Seems they have gone awfully silent since yesterday.

When the government remains silent in Habsburg monarchies, that's when we should worry. Nothing for a while, we leave our guards down then boom! We are handed a Habsburg-signed ultimatum with 48 hours to comply or else.

[celedhring]

They are mostly expecting to see whether the regional government moves for an UDI and react accordingly (suspending  the autonomy).

The separatists seem a bit jittery about it,  and have pushed back the session (initially scheduled for tomorrow) until the weekend, and are now calling for "international mediation" and such. They are aware that a full-out UDI would receive a cold shower from everywhere west of the Elbe. However, the diehards want it right now.

[Valmy]

When the government remains silent in Habsburg monarchies, that's when we should worry. Nothing for a while, we leave our guards down then boom! We are handed a Habsburg-signed ultimatum with 48 hours to comply or else.

Yes but in Bourbon monarchies that just means they are going hunting and ignoring the situation.

[Crazy_Ivan80]

If only the PP hadn't asked the courts to gut the 2006 autonomy-agreement then. That seems to be the event that sparks the events leading up to now.

1) Nah. It accelerated things, but separatism has been slowly rising for decades. It's all about media and education control.

2)If the Generalitat controlled its own source of revenue Spain would have far fewer cards right now to defuse the situation.

1) yes, Spain has bit of a bad rep on that front, and within living memory too. And so what if separatism has been rising? Governing your own nation, as an independent state, is a legitimate political concept. As legitimate as not wanting to separate.


2) Alternatively: giving Catalonia the statute to which it has right to, as agreed on between Madrid and Barcelona, and confirmed by absolute majority via referendum might have been the better idea. Instead of gutting said agreement in what seems to be a case of 'cutting of the nose to spite the face'.

edit: just saying, but if a nation really wants to go independent there's nothing the mother-country can do except using ever harder means of repression. Not sure that is the way to go.

[Drakken]

When the government remains silent in Habsburg monarchies, that's when we should worry. Nothing for a while, we leave our guards down then boom! We are handed a Habsburg-signed ultimatum with 48 hours to comply or else.

Yes but in Bourbon monarchies that just means they are going hunting and ignoring the situation.

Oh yeah. Silly me. 

[CountDeMoney]

When the government remains silent in Habsburg monarchies, that's when we should worry. Nothing for a while, we leave our guards down then boom! We are handed a Habsburg-signed ultimatum with 48 hours to comply or else.

Yes but in Bourbon monarchies that just means they are going hunting and ignoring the situation.

  Somebody's binging Versailles but pretending that they've just read books.

[Iormlund]

Most people are digesting the situation.

Stocks are down, driven by banks and especially Catalonian banks. Caixabank already took some steps regarding moving to Madrid after the last fake-referendum. I don't know about Sabadell. But I expect both to make the change swiftly if UDI is triggered. It's going to be hard as it is for them to stay liquid.

[celedhring]

Most people are digesting the situation.

Stocks are down, driven by banks and especially Catalonian banks. Caixabank already took some steps regarding moving to Madrid after the last fake-referendum. I don't know about Sabadell. But I expect both to make the change swiftly if UDI is triggered. It's going to be hard as it is for them to stay liquid.

Sabadell are pretty leveraged since they used the last banking crisis to go on a buying binge of depreciated assets to buy themselves the status of Spanish big bank. So they are rather vulnerable if things go pear-shaped.

[celedhring]

So, general strike. Transportation is down and main roads into Barcelona have been cut by protesters. Tyres being burned. There's demos all over the place, tempers flaring high. Fortunately no violence yet.

My separatist friends have this inclination of spamming me with *every* communication released by the separatist orgs, and right now they are full on calling for avoiding any kind of violence. This tells me they are unsure about controlling the situation. I hope they do.

That's the kind of shit I used to read about other countries.