Detroit thread. Post Kwame, Monica, and $1 houses here.

Started by MadImmortalMan, March 17, 2009, 12:39:21 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Ed Anger

Quote from: Savonarola on April 08, 2011, 01:42:53 PM
Ohio, unlike southern Canada, has some genuine contenders in the ugliest city category.

Damn Right.
Stay Alive...Let the Man Drive

Savonarola

Oh what a circus:

QuoteTerry Jones refuses to pay bond; judge gathers jury to decide Dearborn rally bid
3:56 PM, Apr. 21, 2011  |  149Comments

BY NIRAJ WARIKOO

DETROIT FREE PRESS

Florida pastor Terry Jones will face a jury trial after a Dearborn judge sided with Wayne County prosecutors and Dearborn police who were trying to make him pay a bond in order to rally in Dearborn.


Judge Mark Somers gave Jones a choice: either pay a bond or face a jury trial on whether he must pay a bond.


Jones refused to pay a bond and will now face a trial, according to Somers. Jury selection is next, said Judge Somers.


Wearing a faded black leather jacket, Jones entered the courtroom as a crush of media followed his every step.


He appeared in court along with Pastor Wayne Sapp, who burned a Quran last month in Florida under Jones' supervision, setting off violent protests in the Muslim world. Jones intends to protest Friday at the Islamic Center of America, the biggest mosque in Dearborn.

ACLU: Jones has right to protest at Dearborn mosque
Earlier, the ACLU of Michigan and others slammed local authorities for trying to deny Jones the right to protest outside the Islamic Center of America in Dearborn.

The ACLU said that authorities are denying Jones' Constitutional rights.


The government should "not impinge on a person's right to protest, even when their speech is as distasteful and offensive as Rev. Jones' is," said Rana Elmir, communications director for the Michigan ACLU. "We should combat hate speech with more speech. I disagree vehemently with Rev. Jones' message, but I believe wholeheartedly in his right to express himself."


Dearborn Police Chief Ron Haddad said that there are logistical and security problems to having Jones protest outside the Islamic Center of America, noting that he has received numerous death threats and has a $1.2-million bounty on his head from a Pakistan-based terrorist group. Moreover, the mosque is surrounded by several churches that have Good Friday services, making traffic an issue, he argued.


But Elmir said:


"We can't forget both religious freedom and the right to protest. The city of Dearborn should honor both of those rights equally."


Elmir said that Dearborn has had issues in previous cases of denying a person's right to protest.


She added that the ACLU is concerned about anti-Muslim hate speech and discrimination, but said that the solution is not censorship.


"The government can not silence demonstrations in anticipation that their message will not be welcomed."


Majed Moughni, a Dearborn attorney, agrees that Jones has the right to protest. Moughni is not a fan of Jones, having burned him in effigy last year outside his Dearborn home because he had threatened to burn the Quran. Jones later oversaw the burning of a Quran last month.


But Moughni says it's wrong for the city and county to try to hinder Jones' rights. Moughni added that this is turning Jones into a hero.


"Instead of him being the bad guy, now he's the hero," Moughni said. "They've turned him into a hero of the First Amendment."


"The prosecutors should withdraw their demands and let him speak as he wishes, which is his right under the Constitution."


Moughni said that even though he burned Jones in effigy last year, he now stands with Jones.


Michael Steinberg, legal director with the ACLU Michigan, said that the government's actions in this case are unconstitutional.


"In a free society, the government can't place a price on a person's ability to speak," Steinberg said.
In Italy, for thirty years under the Borgias, they had warfare, terror, murder and bloodshed, but they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci and the Renaissance. In Switzerland, they had brotherly love, they had five hundred years of democracy and peace—and what did that produce? The cuckoo clock

MadImmortalMan

"Stability is destabilizing." --Hyman Minsky

"Complacency can be a self-denying prophecy."
"We have nothing to fear but lack of fear itself." --Larry Summers

Razgovory

Quote from: MadImmortalMan on April 21, 2011, 04:13:56 PM
I can't think of a worse way to handle it.  :glare:

They could have shot him.

I always confuse Terry Jones with Terry Brooks.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

MadImmortalMan

"Stability is destabilizing." --Hyman Minsky

"Complacency can be a self-denying prophecy."
"We have nothing to fear but lack of fear itself." --Larry Summers

Razgovory

Quote from: MadImmortalMan on April 21, 2011, 09:33:19 PM
He's making Monty Python look bad.

Oh, they are different people?  I thought he just went crazy, bought a warehouse in the South, and declared it a church.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

Pat

Actually, he's been writing some really good books. His books on the barbarians in the roman world is well worth a read.

Savonarola

In Italy, for thirty years under the Borgias, they had warfare, terror, murder and bloodshed, but they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci and the Renaissance. In Switzerland, they had brotherly love, they had five hundred years of democracy and peace—and what did that produce? The cuckoo clock

Savonarola

The current budget calls for closing almost all Detroit City Libraries; with only the downtown branch and the main branch in mid-town staying open.  Just to rub it in for the closing branches:

QuoteCritics: $2.3M Detroit library project a symbol of waste amid budget crisis
Christine MacDonald / The Detroit News
Detroit —Detroit Public Library officials say finances have grown so bad they could close most neighborhood branches, but in a few weeks plan to unveil a revamped wing of a main library that even administrators say spares few expenses.

The South Wing is stocked with 20 yellow and orange European lounge chairs that cost $1,092 apiece, artistic pendant light fixtures and two alcohol-burning fireplaces. The project morphed from a $300,000 furniture update to a $2.3 million overhaul with new floors, study rooms, lighting and built-in, wood-framed book shelves.


"$1,100 per chair is reckless spending for a public institution," said Todd Kelly, president of American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees Local 1259, which represents 125 workers, including clerks, janitors and security staffers.

"It would be easier to swallow the current situation if we didn't see things like that."

It's not the only spending to come under question as the system considers closing up to 18 of 23 branches and laying off as many as 191 of 333 workers. A Detroit News review showed that, since 2008, the library has paid at least $160,000 to food vendors, including $1,760 at an ice-cream shop, and spent $1 million on 6 percent raises to union workers at a time counterparts in City Hall took 10 percent pay cuts.

Executive Director Jo Anne Mondowney agreed the South Wing renovation was costly and that too much has been spent on food. But she said she's only been on the job for about 19 months and isn't responsible for much of the spending.

Construction was approved by the library board the same month she started the job, but commission minutes show that the $624,000 contract for furniture and shelving was approved under her watch in May 2010. Mondowney said she didn't know who approved the chairs, which will be used by patrons, and that her staff tried unsuccessfully to return them.

"We are looking carefully and monitoring all of our expenses and revenues," said Mondowney, who also said she's cut down on food spending.

"There were some things we couldn't undo. The tiger was out of the house. I have focused staff to become much more mindful of our spending."

Union leaders argue the $2.3 million, which came from operational funds, could have helped reduce an $11 million shortfall.

But Edward Thomas, chairman of the library commission, said the South Wing spending has no connection to the library's current financial crisis. The library is funded by a 4.63 mill tax and officials project revenues will drop 20 percent per year until 2015 because of declining property values and population. The tax that generated about $40 million in 2010 is only expected to produce $14 million by 2015.

"Our monthly payroll is $2 million," Thomas said. "When you have a situation like this, people are looking for someone to blame. I just think some things are being made more of than they are. The root cause is really the decline in property taxes."

Commissioner Anthony Adams said the board must "learn from its past mistakes."

"You really can't justify $1,100 chairs," said Adams, who joined the board this year and has investigated the South Wing spending.

"I don't think there was any ill will, but it just doesn't look right in the current climate."

Wing was 'dilapidated'
Library Deputy Director Juliet Machie defended the renovation, saying it was a badly needed update that administrators and commissioners approved in 2008 when the system had a rainy day fund of nearly $35 million. The fund is at $17 million now, some of which will be tapped for the projected shortfall.

The 44,000-square-foot, two-story wing hasn't had new furniture since it was built in 1965 and was "dilapidated and dreary," said Machie, who helped lead the project under former Director Nancy Skowronski. Machie also was interim director for three months in the summer of 2009, before Mondowney came on in September 2009.

"It was pretty beat up," Machie said. "The staff had been asking, 'Can we do something?'"

Machie said the initial price of $300,000 was an estimate and commissioners knew it would increase. In January 2009, commissioners approved spending $1.5 million on the project. The commissioners are appointed by the Detroit Board of Education.

Skowronski, who retired, didn't return a call for comment.

Machie said officials argued about the value of the two fireplaces — which cost $5,021 apiece — but she said staff pushed for them because they had seen them in suburban libraries. The 24 pendant light fixtures hanging above computers cost $531 each.

Machie said she wouldn't have approved the chairs because they can be easily damaged. She said she has had to remove new leather chairs from the Skillman branch downtown and replace them with wooden ones after homeless people defecated on them.

Thomas said the Allermuir-brand chairs would not have been his choice, but "the public is entitled to have a comfortable place to come and read."

Food spending examined
The library's food tab also faces questions.

Spending with food vendors totaled $55,800 in 2008, $61,400 in 2009 and $40,600 in 2010, according to a Detroit News review of the library's checks. Some of the most frequent caterers were downtown's Lunchtime Global, Genet Your Everyday Gourmet and La Azteca Ice Cream in southwest Detroit.

Mondowney said most food was provided for the public at events but some was just for staff.

"I saw it as something we need to be mindful of," Mondowney said. "Food service is not a necessary part of doing business."

But records show about $5,400 has been spent on food vendors so far in January and February of this year.

Adams said food expenses have to be cut.

"You can't justify spending money on food when you are closing branches," Adams said.

Project a shadow over talks
Library leaders are meeting with union employees now to try to get them to accept concessions to trim their shortfall.

But Adams said concerns over the South Wing spending are dominating the discussion. Union representatives also have criticized a failed fundraising effort. The News first reported in February that the library set aside $200,000 in taxpayer money two years ago to launch a $20-million fundraising campaign for construction projects. But less than $100 was raised.

Kelly, with AFSCME Local 1259, said the union was surprised when library leaders proposed their 6 percent raise.

"We would have settled for 2 percent when we saw what the city was dealing with," Kelly said.

Michael Wells, president of UAW Local 2200, representing about 120 library staffers, said the raise is justified but will be difficult to give up because some members believe library administrators were more concerned about keeping up with plush suburban facilities than being fiscally responsible.

"What we need to do is live within our budget," said Wells. "We look to them for leadership and what do we get in return?"

In Italy, for thirty years under the Borgias, they had warfare, terror, murder and bloodshed, but they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci and the Renaissance. In Switzerland, they had brotherly love, they had five hundred years of democracy and peace—and what did that produce? The cuckoo clock

Savonarola

 :alberta:

QuotePolice: Terry Jones accidentally fired gun in Southfield TV station parking lot
10:30 AM, Apr. 22, 2011  |  44Comments

BY TAMMY STABLES BATTAGLIA

DETROIT FREE PRESS STAFF WRITER

Controversial Pastor Terry Jones accidentally fired his .40-caliber handgun while he was at a Southfield television studio Thursday night, according to police.


The outspoken pastor, 59, of Gainesville, Fla., was getting in the passenger side of his car at 11:10 p.m. after an interview when the Taurus handgun went off, sending a bullet into the floorboard, Southfield Police Lt. Nick Loussia said today.


"Officers heard a gunshot, approached the vehicle, asked Mr. Jones if he was OK," Loussia said. Jones and the driver were in the parking lot of Fox2 studios on West 9 Mile. "He was, and they also observed he had a gun in his hand."


Officers took the gun, and also found another gun near the 42-year-old driver, a man from Florida traveling with Jones. Both men were carrying valid Florida concealed weapon licenses, which are recognized in Michigan, Loussia said.


"Based on the facts of the investigation it did not appear a crime had been committed," Loussia said, explaining that officers returned the weapons and sent the men on their way. He did not know the type of weapon carried by the driver.


As he entered a Dearborn courtroom this morning, Jones told reporters that he had been up since 4:30 a.m. and firing his gun was "an accident."

Packin' heat and bustin' caps; Terry Jones is more Detroit than I am.
In Italy, for thirty years under the Borgias, they had warfare, terror, murder and bloodshed, but they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci and the Renaissance. In Switzerland, they had brotherly love, they had five hundred years of democracy and peace—and what did that produce? The cuckoo clock

Ed Anger

.40 cal? Real men carry PPK's. Like me and Hitler.
Stay Alive...Let the Man Drive

Savonarola

Again, in spite of that, we call this Friday good:

QuoteMuslims vow to confront Terry Jones rally with peace
2:45 PM, Apr. 22, 2011 



Interfaith leaders hold hands in front of the Islamic Center of America in Dearborn on Thursday, April 21, 2011. Interfaith leaders and supporters joined hands to show unity and condemn Pastor Terry Jones who oversaw the burning of a Quran last month in Florida. / WILLIAM ARCHIE

BY CHASTITY PRATT DAWSEY

The regularly scheduled Friday afternoon prayer took place at the Islamic Center of America in Dearborn today, as Muslims in this community await a rally by Pastor Terry Jones that some believe could smear their beliefs.

In the main hallway leading into the city's largest mosque, people stopped to sign a laminated scroll of paper that those of all faiths were signing.


"We as caring neighbors in southeastern Michigan stand together in condemning the actions of those who spew hate and fear..." the heading on the scroll begins.


An old man in a brown blazer picked up a black permanent marker, bent close, peered through his glasses and signed. Two younger ladies in shimmering head scarves who were toting fashionable patent leather shoulder bags signed, too.


They were followed by a man who set down a baby carrier that held a dozing girl.


Inside, under the building's high gold dome that is visible blocks away, Imam Hassan Al-Qazwini preached about tolerance taught in the Quran and in American law.


"Today my dear brothers and sisters, we are confronted by ignorance," he said, referring to Pastor Terry Jones of Florida. "Turn away from those ignorant."


Jones supervised the burning of a copy of the Quran, the Muslim holy book, last month. He is in Dearborn today to rally in front of the mosque to protest against what he calls the "radical element in Islam."


His plans were delayed, however, by the judicial system. He has been in court since this morning trying to win a judge's permission to hold the rally without first posting a peace bond.


Such bonds are sometimes required before an event to cover police and other expenses in the case of a riot or some other problem that could cost public dollars.


Rami Faraj, 17, of Dearborn attended the afternoon prayer. "He's preaching hate, we're preaching peace," he said. "He's clearly doing this for show. Let's not give him any attention."


Thursday evening at the mosque, about 700 people gathered for a counter-rally.


Al-Qazwini has asked people to go to the city's civic center this evening at 5 p.m. and to not come to the mosque in order to avoid contact and potential clashes with Jones and his followers.


Many of those who attended prayer at the mosque echoed the same sentiment - Jones has united people of different faiths who intend to show him that Islam is peaceful.


Heather Cowgar, 29, of Dearborn converted from Catholicism seven years ago. She said she believes Jones wants to cause a riot to give Islam a bad name.


"I believe the best thing is just a peaceful protest," she said. "So we can show him what our community is really about."


There's a priceless positive side to the commotion that Jones is stirring, said Zakaria Baalbaki, 33, of Dearborn Heights. "He brought all of the religions together. That is a wonderful thing to have. It's a great thing to see," Baalbaki said after signing the peace scroll along with leaders of other religions.


"Islam is all about peace. It's not about what people see sometimes on TV."


Eric Zarvi, 42, of Dearborn Heights said Jones is in for a surprise.


"He's looking for trouble. But we're not going to give him that."

In my opinion the inter-faith leaders should have told everyone to go home rather than holding their own counter-protest; not only are they giving Jones legitimacy, but they're also increasing the risk of a riot by having a gathering. 

The Klan did something like this in Toledo, Ohio; they held a march through a predominantly black neighborhood.  A counter-protest formed.  The situation turned ugly and a riot broke out; the Klan fled and left black people to destroy their own neighborhoods.
In Italy, for thirty years under the Borgias, they had warfare, terror, murder and bloodshed, but they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci and the Renaissance. In Switzerland, they had brotherly love, they had five hundred years of democracy and peace—and what did that produce? The cuckoo clock

The Brain

Quoteafter homeless people defecated on them.

How the FUCK can you be homeless in Detroit? Doesn't compute.
Women want me. Men want to be with me.

Ed Anger

QuoteUnder a new budget proposal from State Sen. Bruce Casswell, children in the state's foster care system would be allowed to purchase clothing only in used clothing stores.

Casswell, a Republican representing Branch, Hillsdale, Lenawee and St. Joseph counties, made the proposal this week, reports Michigan Public Radio.

His explanation?

    "I never had anything new," Caswell says. "I got all the hand-me-downs. And my dad, he did a lot of shopping at the Salvation Army, and his comment was — and quite frankly it's true — once you're out of the store and you walk down the street, nobody knows where you bought your clothes."

Under his plan, foster children would receive gift cards that could only be used at places like the Salvation Army, Goodwill and other second hand clothing stores.

The plan was knocked by the Michigan League for Human Services. Gilda Jacobs, executive director of the group, had this to say:

    "Honestly, I was flabbergasted," Jacobs says. "I really couldn't believe this. Because I think, gosh, is this where we've gone in this state? I think that there's the whole issue of dignity. You're saying to somebody, you don't deserve to go in and buy a new pair of gym shoes. You know, for a lot of foster kids, they already have so much stacked against them."

Casswell says the plan will save the state money, though it isn't clear how much the state spends on clothing for foster children or how much could be saved this way.
Stay Alive...Let the Man Drive

jimmy olsen

Quote from: The Brain on April 23, 2011, 02:12:43 AM
Quoteafter homeless people defecated on them.

How the FUCK can you be homeless in Detroit? Doesn't compute.
:lol:
It is far better for the truth to tear my flesh to pieces, then for my soul to wander through darkness in eternal damnation.

Jet: So what kind of woman is she? What's Julia like?
Faye: Ordinary. The kind of beautiful, dangerous ordinary that you just can't leave alone.
Jet: I see.
Faye: Like an angel from the underworld. Or a devil from Paradise.
--------------------------------------------
1 Karma Chameleon point