The rise of American authoritarianism

[grumbler]

Probably because they were measuring proxies for the psychological phenomenon.

  Their proxies for the psychological phenomenon of authoritarianism seem much further off

What proxies would you suggest?

Proxies for the authoritarianism they say they are looking for, or proxies for the authoritarianism you mistakenly believe they are looking for?

[CountDeMoney]

This whole Trump thing, it all has such a Riefenstahl tinge.

[Norgy]

This whole Trump thing, it all has such a Riefenstahl tinge.

I so missed that phrase when you were away. 

[grumbler]

it is no different than what happenned before and what is happening elsewhere.
People react to a perceive threat and seek to eliminate it.
In the past, in the US, Indians were seen as a threat and were forcefully eliminated.  French speakers were a threat to their way of life and laws were passed to deal with it.  The Federal government was a threat to Southerner's lifestyle, they took actions to deal with it.  Europeans have a fear of massive immigration that increase exponentially to the number of migrants, government become more&more authoritarian.

Pretty much a clean miss as regards the US.  Thanks for trying, though.

[Malthus]

I kinda liked the analysis in this article:

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/gop-overwhelmed-by-debt

To summarize: the Republicans have been, for years, engaging in tactics of demonization and conspiracy-mongering that have no relationship to facts or logic; such tactics have proved popular. The notion of the leadership was that they could turn on the nonsense to convince the rubes, then turn to governing when they win. This was already a problem for them before Trump came along.

Now, along comes a guy who cleverly creates a campaign that consists of nothing but such absurd statements. The Republican establishment would love to get rid of him, but have, effectively, no tools to dos so; how can they counter (for example) Trump's claim that he is being persecuted by the IRS for being a "Committed Christian" - when they have indulged themselves in exactly that sort of reality-ignoring tactic? He's speaking the language they invented, only better then them, because he doesn't give a shit about whether any of it is possible, or about actual real-world consequences - while establishment Republicans have one eye on the fact that talking smack has to have limits, that governing requires real-world and fact-based input.

Republicans who fail to talk this language have been effectively shut out.   

The truth is virtually Trump's entire campaign is built on stuff just like this, whether it's about mass deportation, race, the persecution of Christians, Obamacare, the coming debt crisis and a million other things. At the last debate, Trump got pressed on his completely ludicrous tax cut plan. He eventually said growth (which if you calculate it would need to be something like 20% annual growth on average) would take care of the huge budget shortfall it created. But Republicans can't really dispute this point since all of Republican campaign economics is based on precisely the same argument. What about Obamacare? Can Marco "Establishment" Rubio really get traction attacking Trump for having no specific plan to replace Obamacare when Republicans have spent the last five years repeatedly voting to repeal Obamacare without ever specifying a plan to replace it with? On each of these fronts, the slow accumulation of nonsense and paranoia - 'debt' to use our metaphor - built into a massive trap door under the notional GOP leadership with a lever that a canny huckster like Trump could come in and pull pretty much whenever. This is the downside of building party identity around a package of calculated nonsense and comically unrealizable goals.

I've been saying that this would be the end result of the Fox News "information" model for some time.

Beebs assured me that was crazy.

Heh, I was going to put in a footnote that I remember reading something like this on Languish before, and I thought it was you, but couldn't remember for sure.

[MadImmortalMan]

Trump's popularity I think has more to do with Republican voters being consistently disappointed by the people they elect. They gave these idiots most of the states and the Congress in a huge landslide and got basically nothing for it.

The fact that both parties have steadily grown more authoritarian is a different issue, and that's happening because it's actually what people want. Also technology is making things that people could not hope to control in the past more accessible to Tarkin's grip. Join alertID! Spy on your neighbors for free! People seem to love that shit.

Anyway, when did this Vox site get popular? It's like it snuck up on me, and suddenly it's all over the place.

[crazy canuck]

Probably because they were measuring proxies for the psychological phenomenon.

  Their proxies for the psychological phenomenon of authoritarianism seem much further off

What proxies would you suggest?

Proxies for the authoritarianism they say they are looking for, or proxies for the authoritarianism you mistakenly believe they are looking for?

Lets look past your attempt at baiting to get out of this and see if you can provide an answer to either one.

[crazy canuck]

Trump's popularity I think has more to do with Republican voters being consistently disappointed by the people they elect. They gave these idiots most of the states and the Congress in a huge landslide and got basically nothing for it.

The fact that both parties have steadily grown more authoritarian is a different issue, and that's happening because it's actually what people want. Also technology is making things that people could not hope to control in the past more accessible to Tarkin's grip. Join alertID! Spy on your neighbors for free! People seem to love that shit.

Anyway, when did this Vox site get popular? It's like it snuck up on me, and suddenly it's all over the place.

What do you think Republican voters wanted that they didnt get?

[Valmy]

What do you think Republican voters wanted that they didnt get?

Small government, freedom, eternal American glory, and low taxes.

[MadImmortalMan]

Trump's popularity I think has more to do with Republican voters being consistently disappointed by the people they elect. They gave these idiots most of the states and the Congress in a huge landslide and got basically nothing for it.

The fact that both parties have steadily grown more authoritarian is a different issue, and that's happening because it's actually what people want. Also technology is making things that people could not hope to control in the past more accessible to Tarkin's grip. Join alertID! Spy on your neighbors for free! People seem to love that shit.

Anyway, when did this Vox site get popular? It's like it snuck up on me, and suddenly it's all over the place.

What do you think Republican voters wanted that they didnt get?

They never make the agenda, they just react. I'm sure there are lots of various things their voters want to accomplish, but I think mostly they're just tired of playing by somebody else's rules.

[derspiess]

This whole Trump thing, it all has such a Riefenstahl tinge.

That's silly.  What I will admit though that his supporters' preference for action over talk, restoring past glory, etc. has eerie similarities to Italian Fascist propaganda from the 1920s and 30s.

Now if he films a huge rally in Nuremburg, PA this summer I'll agree with you.

[Valmy]

Now if he films a huge rally in Nuremburg, PA this summer I'll agree with you.

Oh God if he does I hope it looks like this:



I liked when I googled 'American Nazis' to get this pic it just turned up pictures of Obamahitler. I had to specify 1930s to get it

Oh 'Murica.

[derspiess]

  Always struck me as funny.  Like they were sayin' "yeah man, if Washington were alive, he'd *totally* be down with our Nazi vibe."

[MadImmortalMan]

Hamilton, maybe. 

Actually, it's like Chavez's crew worshipping Bolivar. Makes no sense.

[PJL]

I think it's fair to compare Trump to Mussolini, though whether he'd make Amtrak run on time is another thing altogether. Cruz on the other hand, he's definitely the Hitler type.