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The Off Topic Topic

Started by Korea, March 10, 2009, 06:24:26 AM

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Admiral Yi

It's an SNL reference, in case any Yuros were wondering. :nerd:

Valmy

Quote from: derspiess on September 24, 2019, 03:06:23 PM
So he is currently still dead, correct?



:hmm: I think I need an update to see if there has been a change in his condition
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."

Sheilbh

Quote from: The Larch on September 24, 2019, 06:08:47 AM
Also as clarification, the case is only about taking Franco's remains away to a different cemetery, not about tearing down the "Valley of the Fallen", which is actually a protected heritage site..
What's the view on that site?
Let's bomb Russia!

The Larch

Quote from: Sheilbh on September 24, 2019, 04:03:29 PM
Quote from: The Larch on September 24, 2019, 06:08:47 AM
Also as clarification, the case is only about taking Franco's remains away to a different cemetery, not about tearing down the "Valley of the Fallen", which is actually a protected heritage site..
What's the view on that site?

Of the Valley itself? It's an extremely thinly disguised glorification of Francoism, despite whatever objectives of representing and honouring all the civil war dead. Franco's (and also José Antonio Primo de Rivera's) presence there voids any theoretical shred of neutrality. Removing them (I'm not really sure if Primo de Rivera is also included in the decision) allows for a long overdue reconversion of the site into a true memorial, although the taint will be incredibly difficult to remove. Another problematic issue is the Benedictine abbey located there, which could be argued that deserves removing as well, or at least a proper reworking of their mission, as at the moment they're basically another francoist relic there which also tries to block any change.

Besides that, it's impressive, gloomy and fucking creepy.

Savonarola

Three college-aged men were ahead of me at the scan in at the gym this morning; only one scanned in and the rest just walked in.  As I was scanning in the receptionist (who probably isn't yet thirty) started complaining about these entitled young people who think they can go wherever they want.  Middle age has come rather early to the Millennial generation.
In Italy, for thirty years under the Borgias, they had warfare, terror, murder and bloodshed, but they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci and the Renaissance. In Switzerland, they had brotherly love, they had five hundred years of democracy and peace—and what did that produce? The cuckoo clock

Valmy

Quote from: Savonarola on September 25, 2019, 12:19:02 PM
Three college-aged men were ahead of me at the scan in at the gym this morning; only one scanned in and the rest just walked in.  As I was scanning in the receptionist (who probably isn't yet thirty) started complaining about these entitled young people who think they can go wherever they want.  Middle age has come rather early to the Millennial generation.

You go right from childhood to middle aged with barely a stop off at young adulthood :P
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."

Duque de Bragança

#71811
Quote from: Iormlund on September 24, 2019, 01:18:21 PM
Bah. I very much prefer to see him reburied in the Sagrada Familia. It would be a riot. Probably literally.

Franco below ground is always better than above ground so I see no point in moving him. Unless, it's a diversion for political reasons, such as taking the attention away from real problems which cannot be solved as quickly as by moving the bones of a bloody dictator.

Sheilbh

Quote from: The Larch on September 24, 2019, 07:23:55 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on September 24, 2019, 04:03:29 PM
Quote from: The Larch on September 24, 2019, 06:08:47 AM
Also as clarification, the case is only about taking Franco's remains away to a different cemetery, not about tearing down the "Valley of the Fallen", which is actually a protected heritage site..
What's the view on that site?

Of the Valley itself? It's an extremely thinly disguised glorification of Francoism, despite whatever objectives of representing and honouring all the civil war dead. Franco's (and also José Antonio Primo de Rivera's) presence there voids any theoretical shred of neutrality. Removing them (I'm not really sure if Primo de Rivera is also included in the decision) allows for a long overdue reconversion of the site into a true memorial, although the taint will be incredibly difficult to remove. Another problematic issue is the Benedictine abbey located there, which could be argued that deserves removing as well, or at least a proper reworking of their mission, as at the moment they're basically another francoist relic there which also tries to block any change.

Besides that, it's impressive, gloomy and fucking creepy.
Is there any movement to change it or maybe the site to acknowledge that stuff?

I always find it interesting how countries deal with the sort-of physical legacy of their history. Whether it's like this, or Soviet stuff in Russia, or external like Lutyens New Delhi.
Let's bomb Russia!

The Larch

Quote from: Sheilbh on September 25, 2019, 02:17:17 PM
Quote from: The Larch on September 24, 2019, 07:23:55 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on September 24, 2019, 04:03:29 PM
Quote from: The Larch on September 24, 2019, 06:08:47 AM
Also as clarification, the case is only about taking Franco's remains away to a different cemetery, not about tearing down the "Valley of the Fallen", which is actually a protected heritage site..
What's the view on that site?

Of the Valley itself? It's an extremely thinly disguised glorification of Francoism, despite whatever objectives of representing and honouring all the civil war dead. Franco's (and also José Antonio Primo de Rivera's) presence there voids any theoretical shred of neutrality. Removing them (I'm not really sure if Primo de Rivera is also included in the decision) allows for a long overdue reconversion of the site into a true memorial, although the taint will be incredibly difficult to remove. Another problematic issue is the Benedictine abbey located there, which could be argued that deserves removing as well, or at least a proper reworking of their mission, as at the moment they're basically another francoist relic there which also tries to block any change.

Besides that, it's impressive, gloomy and fucking creepy.
Is there any movement to change it or maybe the site to acknowledge that stuff?

I always find it interesting how countries deal with the sort-of physical legacy of their history. Whether it's like this, or Soviet stuff in Russia, or external like Lutyens New Delhi.

Back in 2011 a group of experts was created by the Zapatero government as part of the historical memory law (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valle_de_los_Ca%C3%ADdos#Expert_Commission_for_the_Future_of_the_Valley_of_the_Fallen), which was tasked with delineating the future of the Valley. Removing Franco's remains is IIRC actually one of their recomendations, in order to "depolitize" the monument and turning it into an effective memory site.

Syt

I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein's brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops.
—Stephen Jay Gould

Proud owner of 42 Zoupa Points.

Grey Fox

I understand what this "Short row a chin, unravel a mouth, and double decrease a nose." means.

:cry:

Also, fuck you Oxford comma.
Colonel Caliga is Awesome.

Sheilbh

#71816
The best obituary I read on Jacques Chirac is paywalled, so I'll just :(

Also, as one person on Twitter put it, responsible for a political poster that should inspire all parties:

:wub: :frog:

Edit: And I had no idea of his contribution of great campaign songs:
https://www.politico.eu/article/former-french-president-jacques-chirac-slice-of-soul-and-other-memorable-campaign-songs/

That first one is great :mellow:
Let's bomb Russia!

Tamas

I think nowadays a politician would do better with a poster of him screaming red-faced with a silly hairdo.

Admiral Yi

Well shit.  RIP Jaques.  The only Frenchman's pronounciation I could ever understand.

Sheilbh

Tony Blair's former aide Alastair Campbell sharing some Chirac anecdotes. My favourite was Chirac getting up to make a grandiloquent statement to end a NATO summit shouting match: 'La France propose ... un café.' :lol: :frog:
Let's bomb Russia!