Treasury Department to Put a Woman on the $10 Bill in 2020

Started by jimmy olsen, June 17, 2015, 10:20:40 PM

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Caliga

#105
April 22, 2016, 03:50:36 PM
Everybody was racist and imperialist then.  Relax.  If he hadn't been those things, he would have been a weak leader.  Of course he couldn't be the same leader now, but he was a product of his era.
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Valmy

#106
April 22, 2016, 03:56:21 PM
Quote from: Caliga on April 22, 2016, 03:50:36 PM
Everybody was racist and imperialist then.  Relax.  If he hadn't been those things, he would have been a weak leader.  Of course he couldn't be the same leader now, but he was a product of his era.

Well that is just not true. But those were certainly far more popular positions than they are now :P
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."

garbon

#107
April 22, 2016, 03:57:59 PM
Quote from: Valmy on April 22, 2016, 03:42:47 PM
Quote from: garbon on April 22, 2016, 01:52:45 PM
From my long distance perspective looks like Jackson just heralded one group of white people taking on elite status from a different group.

So was the Russian Revolution. So therefore nothing of significance happened in Russia between 1917 and 1922 I guess? :lol:


Okay, Marti.
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."

I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

Caliga

#108
April 22, 2016, 03:58:16 PM
Oh, I'm sorry, I forgot about Woodrow Wilson, the non-racist and non-imperialist guy who set Europe up for the Second World War with his retarded self-determination unless you're German shit. :blush:
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Barrister

#109
April 22, 2016, 04:00:47 PM
Quote from: Caliga on April 22, 2016, 03:50:36 PM
Everybody was racist and imperialist then.  Relax.  If he hadn't been those things, he would have been a weak leader.  Of course he couldn't be the same leader now, but he was a product of his era.

To be fair, he was big on the Empire well into the 1950s and his second stint as PM, when the idea of the empire had come into serious questioning both internationally and from within the UK.  And of course the whole thing was then largely dismantled within the next 10-20 years.

But he was still fucking awesome.
Posts here are my own private opinions.  I do not speak for my employer.

Martinus

#110
April 22, 2016, 04:15:45 PM
Quote from: garbon on April 22, 2016, 01:52:45 PM
From my long distance perspective looks like Jackson just heralded one group of white people taking on elite status from a different group.

Given that white people have managed to built the most prominent and technologically advanced (on a sustained basis) civilisation to date, I'd say that's pretty significant. It's not like, say, black people, who never really accomplished a lot.

Caliga

#111
April 22, 2016, 04:25:30 PM
OH NO YOU DINT
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Habbaku

#113
April 22, 2016, 04:27:34 PM
Quote from: Barrister on April 22, 2016, 04:00:47 PM
Quote from: Caliga on April 22, 2016, 03:50:36 PM
Everybody was racist and imperialist then.  Relax.  If he hadn't been those things, he would have been a weak leader.  Of course he couldn't be the same leader now, but he was a product of his era.

To be fair, he was big on the Empire well into the 1950s and his second stint as PM, when the idea of the empire had come into serious questioning both internationally and from within the UK.  And of course the whole thing was then largely dismantled within the next 10-20 years.

But he was still fucking awesome.

Exactly.  We can accept Churchill as a truly great leader while also noting his colossal failures and generally being on the wrong side of history on many subjects.  Refusing to accept that he was either great or flawed is a childish position.
The medievals were only too right in taking nolo episcopari as the best reason a man could give to others for making him a bishop. Give me a king whose chief interest in life is stamps, railways, or race-horses; and who has the power to sack his Vizier (or whatever you care to call him) if he does not like the cut of his trousers.

Government is an abstract noun meaning the art and process of governing and it should be an offence to write it with a capital G or so as to refer to people.
-J. R. R. Tolkien

Habbaku

#114
April 22, 2016, 04:28:12 PM
Quote from: Caliga on April 22, 2016, 03:58:16 PM
Oh, I'm sorry, I forgot about Woodrow Wilson, the non-racist and non-imperialist guy who set Europe up for the Second World War with his retarded self-determination unless you're German shit. :blush:

:unsure:  Wilson was as racist as they came.
The medievals were only too right in taking nolo episcopari as the best reason a man could give to others for making him a bishop. Give me a king whose chief interest in life is stamps, railways, or race-horses; and who has the power to sack his Vizier (or whatever you care to call him) if he does not like the cut of his trousers.

Government is an abstract noun meaning the art and process of governing and it should be an offence to write it with a capital G or so as to refer to people.
-J. R. R. Tolkien

Razgovory

#115
April 22, 2016, 04:29:39 PM
Quote from: Valmy on April 22, 2016, 03:44:46 PM
Quote from: Habbaku on April 22, 2016, 03:40:55 PM
And Churchill was racist and imperialist, both things that we should be avoiding.

Basically their Teddy Roosevelt. Besides history rarely gives us easy labels for people.

Churchill is a liminal figure who stand on the line between the British empire and modern Britain.  So he represents much of what is good and what is bad of Imperial Britain.  In that sense, he was similar to Lincoln or FDR both figures who stood astride eras in American history.  However both Lincoln and Roosevelt were agents of change from one era to another, Churchill resisted the change that was coming and ended up on the wrong side of it.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

Admiral Yi

#116
April 22, 2016, 04:38:49 PM
What is the Wilson=racist indictment built on, other than segregating the civil service?

Barrister

#117
April 22, 2016, 04:40:02 PM
Quote from: Habbaku on April 22, 2016, 04:28:12 PM
Quote from: Caliga on April 22, 2016, 03:58:16 PM
Oh, I'm sorry, I forgot about Woodrow Wilson, the non-racist and non-imperialist guy who set Europe up for the Second World War with his retarded self-determination unless you're German shit. :blush:

:unsure:  Wilson was as racist as they came.

:yes:

He was the one who screened Birth of a Nation at the Whitehouse and loved it, while re-segregating the federal government.
Posts here are my own private opinions.  I do not speak for my employer.

Martinus

#118
April 22, 2016, 04:42:25 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on April 22, 2016, 04:29:39 PM
Quote from: Valmy on April 22, 2016, 03:44:46 PM
Quote from: Habbaku on April 22, 2016, 03:40:55 PM
And Churchill was racist and imperialist, both things that we should be avoiding.

Basically their Teddy Roosevelt. Besides history rarely gives us easy labels for people.

Churchill is a liminal figure who stand on the line between the British empire and modern Britain.  So he represents much of what is good and what is bad of Imperial Britain.  In that sense, he was similar to Lincoln or FDR both figures who stood astride eras in American history.  However both Lincoln and Roosevelt were agents of change from one era to another, Churchill resisted the change that was coming and ended up on the wrong side of it.

Can you give some examples of Churchill's racist opinions?
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