11 dead in French satirical magazine shooting

[Jacob]

What? 

It's poetry.

[garbon]

What? 

It's poetry.

Oh! He was exemplifying 'fearless disrespect'?

[derspiess]

Howard Dean says we shouldn't call the attackers Muslims or even Islamists. What a dumbass.

[crazy canuck]

Then we have to agree to disagree. To me, critical thinking is one of the cornerstones of the Western civilisation.

I think that's the disconnect. Not everyone equates "critical thinking" with "disrespect."

Indeed, it's rather the opposite, actually.  "Critical thinking" implies that one approach an idea as free as humanly possible from pre-conceived notions.  Approaching an idea with "disrespect"  that you have a preconceived negative view of it.

That is very well put dps.

[CountDeMoney]

Howard Dean says we shouldn't call the attackers Muslims or even Islamists. What a dumbass.

That would be feeding into the narrative they deserve.  Call 'em...evildoers.  Smoke 'em outta their holes.

[garbon]

So I missed that apparently one of them* voluntarily surrendered?

*Or at least one of the people the police were looking for.

[Sheilbh]

One of the policemen who was killed was a Muslim.

They're probably particularly happy they got to kill him

[derspiess]

One of the policemen who was killed was a Muslim.

They're probably particularly happy they got to kill him

Or not.  They may have wanted to avoid killing a Muslim.

[Sheilbh]

I doubt it. This sort of extremist tend to think most other Muslims are either heretics or effectively apostates. It's one of the features of Jihadi Islamism, particularly ISIS, and one of the reasons Syria's so brutal.

[PDH]

I doubt it. This sort of extremist tend to think most other Muslims are either heretics or effectively apostates. It's one of the features of Jihadi Islamism, particularly ISIS, and one of the reasons Syria's so brutal.

This sounds so "wars of religion" period christian thinking.  The only problem with this is, given the timeline, it will be a hundred more years of reformation killing of everyone in sight before some sort of logic begins to prevail.

[CountDeMoney]

This sounds so "wars of religion" period christian thinking.  The only problem with this is, given the timeline, it will be a hundred more years of reformation killing of everyone in sight before some sort of logic begins to prevail.

And to think, we missed all of history's major wars of religious schism, reformation and consolidation.  But now we get to watch Islam attempting to wrestle control of itself, with apostates on one side and heretics on the other, backed by nation states.  I mean, really now;  other than the occasional ethnocentric massacres here and there on the undercard, you just don't get ringside seats to heavyweight title bouts of religion like this anymore. 

[derspiess]

I doubt it. This sort of extremist tend to think most other Muslims are either heretics or effectively apostates. It's one of the features of Jihadi Islamism, particularly ISIS, and one of the reasons Syria's so brutal.

All we know is that they were targeting those who dared defame the beloved prophet.  We don't know much else of what was going on inside their heads, but didn't someone say one of the attackers said it was okay that they executed that policeman on the sidewalk because he wasn't Algerian?  These guys weren't indiscriminately firing at everyone-- they clearly had their targets, and shot the police because they got in the way. 

Again, I don't know what was going on inside their heads, but I can easily see them having regret at having shot a Muslim (if they found out afterwards).  Jihadists and Islamists frequently show deference to other Muslims-- even those that aren't as hard core as they are.

[Sheilbh]

They really don't. They kill far more Muslims than anyone else and not just for ease. Takfirism is a big feature of lots of current jihadi groups - and remember that before ISIS were releasing videos of them killing Western reporters they were releasing videos of them killing apostates and executing Shia truck drivers who answered incorrectly about how to pray. Many of the groups we know as jihadi are called takfiri in the region because that's their more defining feature.

I mean the description of it here really matches ISIS's approach:
http://mondediplo.com/2007/07/03takfirism

The elimination of the enemy within was a necessary preliminary to any showdown with outsiders.

You're right we don't know about these guys but if the reports mentioned in this thread that they've been to Syria and are associated with AQAP are true then it's very unlikely that they'd see a Muslim French policemen as anything but an apostate.

[Razgovory]

What? 

You're a WWII buff, look at his avatar.  Try and figure out where that picture came from.  He's a nut.  Fucker makes me look rational.

[Syt]

"Two suicidal caricaturists"
- I'm tired of life. Should I jump in front of a train? Or off a high rise?
- I'll draw something about Mohammed.