Columbia student carrying mattress until school expels her rapist

[Martinus]

So, she decided to drop criminal charges because the policeman was "annoying" and called her a lot? Sorry but she does not sound very credible.

[garbon]

So, she decided to drop criminal charges because the policeman was "annoying" and called her a lot? Sorry but she does not sound very credible.

Yeah because after being raped, one should then plan to send the next year or so of one's life dealing with police in a fight for justice that might never come.

[garbon]

At any rate, I don't really think Ms. Mattress Girl and her rape or not rape is the key issue here. I think all of this - as stated clearly with the piece - is to raise more awareness of an ongoing problem on university campuses. I mean if you look at many of the posts in this thread there is a lot of stated disbelief that this is really an ongoing issue and a huge dose of the supposition that girls are blowing things out of proportion.

[alfred russel]

So, she decided to drop criminal charges because the policeman was "annoying" and called her a lot? Sorry but she does not sound very credible.

Yeah because after being raped, one should then plan to send the next year or so of one's life dealing with police in a fight for justice that might never come.

I'm not against that point of view in all cases, but in this case the victim is giving media interviews and carrying a mattress around campus.

[Admiral Yi]

Yeah because after being raped, one should then plan to send the next year or so of one's life dealing with police in a fight for justice that might never come.

It's not clear to me that she would have had to spend any time doing anything, just that the case would have taken time to come to trial.

At any rate, I don't really think Ms. Mattress Girl and her rape or not rape is the key issue here. I think all of this - as stated clearly with the piece - is to raise more awareness of an ongoing problem on university campuses. I mean if you look at many of the posts in this thread there is a lot of stated disbelief that this is really an ongoing issue and a huge dose of the supposition that girls are blowing things out of proportion.

If this girl's intention is to make people take accusations of campus rape seriously, she's doing a piss poor job.

[Malthus]

I think you are missing my point (or I am not stating it with sufficient clarity).

I am not saying that the allegation in this case "fell short of criminal behavior or cannot be prosecuted". On the contrary. The allegation was extremely serious and was, without a doubt, one that concerned "criminal behaviour" and that "could be prosecuted". And so it should have been - in the criminal courts, after a police investigation.

To use another example: if a student came to the university discipline committee and complained that his roommate had committed a murder, should the administrators:

(1) hold an administrative hearing, to determine whether the roommate had, in point of fact, committed an offence against the student code worthy of having them expelled, or

(2) call the cops to investigate the alleged crime of murder, given that the cops have stuff like trained investigators and forensics, and so are in a better position to determine whether a murder has occured than some administrators working for a university?   

To my mind, it makes no sense to choose option (1). Same with this particular case in the OP.

Ah.  I didn't know that the student went directly to the university disciplinary committee and that the committee decided not to notify the cops.  That was certainly wrong, and not in accordance with the law or university policies.

Where are you getting your excellent and interesting info?  None of it is in any version of the story I have heard.  Inside sources?

I don't think the sequence of events is in any way controversial.

She brought a compaint before the university discipline committee. It was rejected. She then went public with her allegations. This gained lots of publicity, and many asked why she did not go to the police. Responding to this pressure, she then went to the police (months after her discipline complaint was rejected, and now years after the alleged event). She was dissatisfied with the police investigation that ensued. She found their questioning rude and abusive. So she then withdrew her complaint - I assume, but do not know, this scotched their investigation. 

http://america.aljazeera.com/watch/shows/america-tonight/articles/2014/5/19/why-college-rapevictimsdonatgotothepolice.html

http://nymag.com/thecut/2014/09/columbia-emma-sulkowicz-mattress-rape-performance-interview.html

[Martinus]

At any rate, I don't really think Ms. Mattress Girl and her rape or not rape is the key issue here. I think all of this - as stated clearly with the piece - is to raise more awareness of an ongoing problem on university campuses. I mean if you look at many of the posts in this thread there is a lot of stated disbelief that this is really an ongoing issue and a huge dose of the supposition that girls are blowing things out of proportion.

That is a problem. But then we have this silly notion called presumption of innocence, too.

[Barrister]

Apparently she decided not to go to the cops, stating that it would be a waste of her time.

Actually here's what she said:

http://nymag.com/thecut/2014/09/columbia-emma-sulkowicz-mattress-rape-performance-interview.html

The last time we spoke you said you had filed a report with the NYPD and they were starting to investigate. What is the status of that?
It got transferred to the district attorney's office, and I decided I didn't want to pursue it any further because they told it me it would take nine months to a year to actually go to court, which would be after I graduated and probably wanting to erase all of my memories of Columbia from my brain anyway, so I decided not to pursue it.

Did the police seem to think there was a case there to pursue?
Yeah, they were going to contact the other women who reported against him, and they would have subpoenaed the information from the university files.

You were also hoping to file a complaint with the police regarding how you were treated. What happened with that?
I was contacted by an investigator who was really, really annoying to work with. He would call me randomly, and make me repeat everything that happened. He kept telling me I had to come into the station, and obviously I don't want to deal with the police any more right now. It's so disorganized, and it's really upsetting to work with them at all.

Harumph.  This is where she just lost me.

Look, wanting to "put something behind you" is fine, and I can understand that sentiment.  I can also understand the "wanting justice to be done" sentiment - obviously I'm a big fan.  But you can't have them both.  And you can't complain that justice isn't being done if you won't give a formal statement to police.

[derspiess]

At any rate, I don't really think Ms. Mattress Girl and her rape or not rape is the key issue here. I think all of this - as stated clearly with the piece - is to raise more awareness of an ongoing problem on university campuses. I mean if you look at many of the posts in this thread there is a lot of stated disbelief that this is really an ongoing issue and a huge dose of the supposition that girls are blowing things out of proportion.

That sounds like the rationale for excusing staged/false hate crimes on campus.

[Malthus]

So, she decided to drop criminal charges because the policeman was "annoying" and called her a lot? Sorry but she does not sound very credible.

I would have thought it a lot more annoying if the cops weren't pursuing the matter aggressively.

[Martinus]

Harumph.  This is where she just lost me.

Look, wanting to "put something behind you" is fine, and I can understand that sentiment.  I can also understand the "wanting justice to be done" sentiment - obviously I'm a big fan.  But you can't have them both.  And you can't complain that justice isn't being done if you won't give a formal statement to police.

Same.

[garbon]

At any rate, I don't really think Ms. Mattress Girl and her rape or not rape is the key issue here. I think all of this - as stated clearly with the piece - is to raise more awareness of an ongoing problem on university campuses. I mean if you look at many of the posts in this thread there is a lot of stated disbelief that this is really an ongoing issue and a huge dose of the supposition that girls are blowing things out of proportion.

That sounds like the rationale for excusing staged/false hate crimes on campus.

Also are staged/false hate crimes super common?

[garbon]

At any rate, I don't really think Ms. Mattress Girl and her rape or not rape is the key issue here. I think all of this - as stated clearly with the piece - is to raise more awareness of an ongoing problem on university campuses. I mean if you look at many of the posts in this thread there is a lot of stated disbelief that this is really an ongoing issue and a huge dose of the supposition that girls are blowing things out of proportion.

That is a problem. But then we have this silly notion called presumption of innocence, too.

ok?

[garbon]

Look, wanting to "put something behind you" is fine, and I can understand that sentiment.  I can also understand the "wanting justice to be done" sentiment - obviously I'm a big fan.  But you can't have them both.  And you can't complain that justice isn't being done if you won't give a formal statement to police.

Agreed but then of course she's an aggrandizing little shit as she's doing a performance piece. In fact, when I first looked at cover of magazine, I was like what is this bitch doing.

[Martinus]

At any rate, I don't really think Ms. Mattress Girl and her rape or not rape is the key issue here. I think all of this - as stated clearly with the piece - is to raise more awareness of an ongoing problem on university campuses. I mean if you look at many of the posts in this thread there is a lot of stated disbelief that this is really an ongoing issue and a huge dose of the supposition that girls are blowing things out of proportion.

That is a problem. But then we have this silly notion called presumption of innocence, too.

ok?

She is not just raising awareness, she also wants a specific guy expelled. Has it crossed your mind that he might be innocent?