News from Iran? Good? Bad? Who knows?

[Viking]

So if Iran is trying to have a "color revolution", what color would it be? 

Green obviously...

or maybe pistachio...

[Ancient Demon]

A fucking beautiful fucking Iranian woman fucking shot down in her fucking prime by the motherfucking goatfucking Basij.

Jesus Christ.  That was among the most disturbing videos I've ever watched.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1aPejT0izs

The scream at the end of that is among the angriest things I've ever heard.  Fantastically disturbing.

Some people are saying that it's fake.

[Martinus]

A fucking beautiful fucking Iranian woman fucking shot down in her fucking prime by the motherfucking goatfucking Basij.

Jesus Christ.  That was among the most disturbing videos I've ever watched.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1aPejT0izs

The scream at the end of that is among the angriest things I've ever heard.  Fantastically disturbing.

Did you just find out Iranians are monsters?

[Queequeg]

Some people are saying that it's fake.

Some people are misanthropic idiots. 

[Martinus]

So if Iran is trying to have a "color revolution", what color would it be? 

You're not up to date. It's already called "green revolution".

[Queequeg]

Did you just find out Iranians are monsters?

The Basij are as bad as Hansmeister or anyone else thought they were.  Maybe worse.  But I have to admire the people who go out into the streets knowing that they face death.  The latest chants are MARG BAR KHAMENEI (death to Khamenei) and I WELCOME DEATH I WELCOME DEATH BUT NOT SUBJUGATION.  Takes balls. 

[Martinus]

In a non-religious country the Rebellion would have fizzled out fairly quickly.  Instead, you have Iranians going out on to the streets afraid but comforted that they are dying for a cause, that they are martyrs.  I think it is reasonably clear from that that religion is a two-edged sword.  And I wouldn't blame Twlever Shiism for the current government, as it was just as likely that Iran would be dominated by some form of Socialist tyranny, a la Burma (where the best resistance to the regime is also religious-based).

Well I wouldn't blow my load over this too soon if I were you. While I'm happy to see the regime toppled, there are striking parallels between this revolution and the one that toppled the last Shah. And the religious fervor from the protesters is exactly the reason why it is probably not going to improve the situation in Iran even if it is successful.

[Martinus]

Did you just find out Iranians are monsters?

The Basij are as bad as Hansmeister or anyone else thought they were.  Maybe worse.  But I have to admire the people who go out into the streets knowing that they face death.  The latest chants are MARG BAR KHAMENEI (death to Khamenei) and I WELCOME DEATH I WELCOME DEATH BUT NOT SUBJUGATION.  Takes balls.

People who blow up themselves in Israel-Palestine chant similar shit. That doesn't prove anything. Until I see the protesters demanding liberalization of this horrible country (in terms of women's rights, stopping persecution of atheists, apostates, gays etc.) I will just take a minor satisfaction from the fact that islamists are killing each other.

[Queequeg]

It is probably a fair guess that over the last week more people have been killed/maimed/tortured/imprisoned than during the last of the Shah.  This is a new Revolutionary narrative. 

Marty, Shiism started as a mystical, Sufism-enfused unorthodox version of Islam.  It wasn't until midway through the Safavid period that some retarded Clerics decided to take all the fun out of it.  No reason it can't come back. 

[Martinus]

It is probably a fair guess that over the last week more people have been killed/maimed/tortured/imprisoned than during the last of the Shah.  This is a new Revolutionary narrative. 

Marty, Shiism started as a mystical, Sufism-enfused unorthodox version of Islam.  It wasn't until midway through the Safavid period that some retarded Clerics decided to take all the fun out of it.  No reason it can't come back.

Well, forgive me if I am not holding my breath.

[Queequeg]

Well, forgive me if I am not holding my breath.

Your caution is admirable.  Just don't write the protestors off yet.  I don't think they are "Destroy Israel, Kill the Jews, Homosexuals, Atheists" types of Islamists.  I think comparisons could be made with the AKP, though obviously they run the intellectual gammut.  I've read blogs of Iranian Atheists who run out into the streets screaming Allah Akbar as a way of saying Fuck You to the regime. 

[Monoriu]

I don't think Iran will turn into a democracy even if the protesters win.  Do they want to change the system or do they want to change who is in charge?  Somehow I think it is the latter.

[Martinus]

I don't think Iran will turn into a democracy even if the protesters win.  Do they want to change the system or do they want to change who is in charge?  Somehow I think it is the latter.

I admit I don't know much about the Iranian situation, but I think it's the opposite to what you are saying - the idea of Iran being democratic (if shitty) I think was one of the selling points of the regime to the people. After all, these riots are over election results.

That's not something people in non-democratic countries riot over (even in communist Poland, until 1989 the protests never really were aimed at changing those in power per se, but improving working conditions, freedom of press etc.)

[jimmy olsen]

A couple of videos of marches here.

http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/2009/06/20/tehran_protests/

Protests continued in Iran today, despite yesterday's threat by Ayatollah Ali Khamenei to crush dissent if it went on. But the regime appears to be making good on its threats. Eyewitnesses reported massive security forces gathered all over Tehran, with Basij paramilitaries clubbing demonstrators and waves of arrests.

At about 9:20 p.m. in Tehran (12:50 p.m. Eastern time), Mir-Hossein Mousavi, the opposition candidate whose suspicious defeat by President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad last week sparked the protests, declared he was ready for whatever happened next.

"I am prepared For martyrdom," he wrote on his campaign Twitter page. "Go on strike if I am arrested."

Before dark, Tehran was already erupting in violence. Foreign embassies were reportedly taking in wounded demonstrators in need of safety.

"Shit has hit the fan," a correspondent in Tehran e-mailed Salon this morning. "Tohid Square on fire, people are chanting all along Satter Khan Street. Chaos, then suddenly quiet, people eating ice cream, etc., then more chaos. Fire in the middle of the streets -- chants, chants, chants and it is not yet night. Tehran is on fire tonight."

Salon has also obtained, from an Iranian student in the U.S., two video clips -- taken by cell phone by a friend in Tehran earlier today -- showing the marches. In the first, a crowd walks down the street, with fires burning along the way:

In the second, someone fires teargas into the crowd, and the protesters begin to run. Not long afterwards, the picture goes dark. (The clip has been edited, but chanting and screaming continue for several minutes.) The chants are in Farsi, but the student translated them. "Down with dictators!" the crowd is chanting at first. After the teargas, the crowd then starts yelling, "Don't fear, we are together."

The situation appeared to be getting more and more chaotic, and it seems likely that the regime will crack down harder. There were unconfirmed reports in government-controlled media that a bomb had gone off at the tomb of Ayatollah Khomenei. Mousavi accused the ruling clerics of plotting for months to rig the elections. The protesters, though, continued to use the language and tactics of the 1979 Islamic revolution -- many were reportedly carrying the Koran in the streets today, and each night, opponents of the regime have gone to their balconies or roofs to yell, "God is great," in Farsi, just as supporters of the revolution did 30 years ago.

And despite rumors that Mousavi had been arrested, he reportedly took to the streets to demonstrate today. Iranian journalist Fershteh Ghazi quoted him trying to rally the protesters:  "We have learned from our fathers that the blood of the innocent shall fall upon the guilty."

[Jaron]

Man, what I wouldn't give to be manning a machine gun nest at one of those protests. .