News from Iran? Good? Bad? Who knows?

[Jos Theelen]

Reaction on article from Washington Post about elections:http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009/06/did-polling-predict-ahmadinejad-victory.html

Main point: the poll showed that only 50% of the people had decided who to vote. The other half didn't know or didn't want to say. From the 50% who told how to vote, roughly 2/3 went to Ahmedinejad en 1/3 to Mousavi.

[Valmy]

It's the Islamic Republic of Iran, they're not protesting against the Islamic part, they're protesting in favor of the Republic part so it makes sense for them to wrap themselves in Islam to legitimize themselves.

Read Sheilbh's reply to my post.  He seems informed on this situation and explained it rather well.

[Jaron]

You can have Sheilbh, i'll take Timmy anyday.

[Crazy_Ivan80]

  It's interesting and lucky for Mousavi.  Apparently colours are assigned randomly to different candidates by the electoral commission.  He happened to get green which in Shia Islam is a symbol of being a descendant of the Prophet, which Mousavi is.

Is there anyone in the middle east who doesn't claim to be a decendent of that guy?

[Neil]

  It's interesting and lucky for Mousavi.  Apparently colours are assigned randomly to different candidates by the electoral commission.  He happened to get green which in Shia Islam is a symbol of being a descendant of the Prophet, which Mousavi is.

Is there anyone in the middle east who doesn't claim to be a decendent of that guy?

Well, he was quite indiscriminate in his relations, and tribalism allows them to really stretch their extended families for all that they're worth.

[Jaron]

If white people bred like brown people, they'd have a chance at winning this race war.

[DisturbedPervert]

Is there anyone in the middle east who doesn't claim to be a decendent of that guy?

He did a lot of rape, so it's not a surprise.

[Sheilbh]

  It's interesting and lucky for Mousavi.  Apparently colours are assigned randomly to different candidates by the electoral commission.  He happened to get green which in Shia Islam is a symbol of being a descendant of the Prophet, which Mousavi is.

Is there anyone in the middle east who doesn't claim to be a decendent of that guy?

Who else are you thinking of?

My understanding is that it's actually pretty rare, because most Sunnis don't really place that great an emphasis on it and also Islamic society has quite obsessive record-keeping about links to Mohammed.  I believe Sunnis are comparatively uninterested because all of the descendants claim their family origin from the children of Fatima and Ali which makes it even more Shia-centric.  The viability and validity of a hadith for example is almost entirely based on the perceived reliability of the 'fiqh' which is basically the genealogy of the  hadith, who told who what who heard from the Prophet.  I don't believe claims are terribly widespread.  As with hadiths the validity of certain Sayyidi families is contested, I believe Mousavi's is considered relatively legitimate.

[Crazy_Ivan80]

Anyways, I'm thinking about Tienanmen atm (funny how that is 20 years ago) and how that event took place over quite a lot of time too. We all know how that ended.
Same with the Prague Spring and the 1956 Uprising in Hungary.
The militias and what not are -I fear- only yielding because they know that the armed forces (the Revolutionary Guards and such) are coming in force. They know they've got time.
And when they finally strike it'll be brutal and bloody.
I've got the odd feeling we'll be seeing lots of Iranians migrate in the next few years.

[Grinning_Colossus]

  It's interesting and lucky for Mousavi.  Apparently colours are assigned randomly to different candidates by the electoral commission.  He happened to get green which in Shia Islam is a symbol of being a descendant of the Prophet, which Mousavi is.

Is there anyone in the middle east who doesn't claim to be a decendent of that guy?

The ayatollahs with black turbans claim descent from Mohammed, the ones with white turbans don't.   

[Admiral Yi]

King Hussein of Jordan does.  I think the king of Morocco does as well.

[Valmy]

For all of Islam's attempts to avoid worshipping big Mo as a God they sure seem to do everything but.

[Sheilbh]

For all of Islam's attempts to avoid worshipping big Mo as a God they sure seem to do everything but.

If you think that's bad you should read about some Shia sects.  There was one that believed that Mohammed wasn't who God intended to deliver his prophecy to, it was Ali and the angel Gabriel got lost and chose the wrong man

Of course they still recognise the importance of Mohammed as the guy who did receive the prophecy.

There's reports that the Basij's base in central Tehran, in Azadi Square, has been stormed and is currently on fire, the commander's apparently dead.  The Basij are the militia of the Revolutionary Guard and have grown under Ahmedinejad's time in office.  It was speculated a while ago that he was building them up to repress any civil disorder.

[Sheilbh]

I think the king of Morocco does as well.

He does.  I believe through Fatima and Ali.  I think it's because of that that the King of Morocco declares himself in charge of all Imams in the country and 'the commander of the faithful'.

[Josquius]

  It's interesting and lucky for Mousavi.  Apparently colours are assigned randomly to different candidates by the electoral commission.  He happened to get green which in Shia Islam is a symbol of being a descendant of the Prophet, which Mousavi is.

Aha, I was wandering what the deal was there- how come he gets green and the others don't. If they were allowed to pick their own colours I'd imagine most of them fighting for green.