NJ teen loses first legal battle to make parents pay for education

[crazy canuck]

Funnily enough, at UF law school, there were a few Harvard, Yale, Columbia etc. undergrad grads in my class. None of them were at the top of the class though.

I'm sure they weren't.

Yeah, he kind of walked into that one.

[Capetan Mihali]

Funnily enough, at UF law school, there were a few Harvard, Yale, Columbia etc. undergrad grads in my class. None of them were at the top of the class though.

I'm sure they weren't.

Yeah, he kind of walked into that one.

  I was being in earnest...  (See Edit.)

[garbon]

Funnily enough, at UF law school, there were a few Harvard, Yale, Columbia etc. undergrad grads in my class. None of them were at the top of the class though.

I'm sure they weren't.

Yeah, he kind of walked into that one.

  I was being in earnest...

I would have earnestly meant it as well.

[stjaba]

Funnily enough, at UF law school, there were a few Harvard, Yale, Columbia etc. undergrad grads in my class. None of them were at the top of the class though.

I'm sure they weren't.  Law school is a whole different pathological ballgame, and relying on your native intelligence and academic writing skills doesn't get you very far...

At UF law, the Ivy alums seemed to generally rest on their laurels, whereas the top students busted their asses from day one. My perception was the Ivy kids figured they were smarter than most of the state school alums in law school so they didn't need to work as hard.

In reality, at schools like UF, there are tons of students who get accepted to Ivies and Ivy caliber schools but decide to attend UF because it is literally free if you have the grades, the best school in the state, and has a great alumni network. For instance, I got into U Chicago for undergrad with a partial scholarship, but I opted for UF since it was still the best choice for me. Had I wanted to go into investment banking or consulting or some similar field, Chicago would have been a better choice, but I knew I wanted to go to law school and probably stay in state for that, so going to Chicago would have led to debt and nothing else. Most of law school friends who did well and were also UF undergrad alums were also similarly situated.

[Capetan Mihali]

At UF law, the Ivy alums seemed to generally rest on their laurels, whereas the top students busted their asses from day one. My perception was the Ivy kids figured they were smarter than most of the state school alums in law school so they didn't need to work as hard.

In reality, at schools like UF, there are tons of students who get accepted to Ivies and Ivy caliber schools but decide to attend UF because it is literally free if you have the grades, the best school in the state, and has a great alumni network. For instance, I got into U Chicago for undergrad with a partial scholarship, but I opted for UF since it was still the best choice for me. Had I wanted to go into investment banking or consulting or some similar field, Chicago would have been a better choice, but I knew I wanted to go to law school and probably stay in state for that, so going to Chicago would have led to debt and nothing else. Most of law school friends who did well and were also UF undergrad alums were also similarly situated.

That doesn't surprise me.  Most people consistently overrate their intelligence, and few more so than those with fancy degrees.

EDIT: With that I'll sign off to belatedly abort this lawyer/legal education hijack. 

[grumbler]

It really depends what you are looking for and what fields your kids will one day be interested in studying.  Cal Tech for example is not just the best university in the world but it prefers its undergrad students for its Masters and PhD programs.  That makes it very attractive because if someone gets accepted there they are set for their academic careers.

I believe Cal tech claims that they have no such preferences.  Their claims would be consistent with their undergraduate admissions process, which is purely merit-based (no preferences for minorities, athletes, or legacies).  Now, Cal Tech may end up taking a vastly disproportionate share of its graduate students from its own student population, but that is at least partially explicable simply by the fact that its undergraduate admission standards are by far the toughest in the world (I remember seeing a fairly authoritative study that showed that the median admitted student at Harvard wouldn't be in the top 80% of the incoming Cal Tech class, or something like that).

[crazy canuck]

So what you are saying is what you are saying isnt all that different from what I said except you feel the need to say it in a slightly different way that makes no practical difference.

Grumble away Grumbler, Grumble away.

[Eddie Teach]

Besides that you claim they give their undergrad students preference in graduate admissions and grumbler claims otherwise.

[crazy canuck]

Besides that you claim they give their undergrad students preference in graduate admissions and grumbler claims otherwise.

And yet the greater number of their post graduate students are from Cal Tech 

Yeah, I wouldnt expect you to see that there is no practical difference either.  But continue to argue things that are pointless.  It looks as good on you as it does on Grumbles.

[Razgovory]

Thank god I didn't have to deal with too much teenager rebellion with my goddaughter. Other than that period when she was 14-15.

OH MY GOD DAD. I HAVE RIGHTS. I WANT TO GO ON A DATE WITHOUT A CHAPERONE. YOU ARE RUINING MY LIFE! WHY DO YOU HAVE TO MEET HIM FIRST? WE ARE JUST GOING TO THE MOVIES!

You should consider arranged marriages with the Houses of Europe for you daughters.

[crazy canuck]

Thank god I didn't have to deal with too much teenager rebellion with my goddaughter. Other than that period when she was 14-15.

OH MY GOD DAD. I HAVE RIGHTS. I WANT TO GO ON A DATE WITHOUT A CHAPERONE. YOU ARE RUINING MY LIFE! WHY DO YOU HAVE TO MEET HIM FIRST? WE ARE JUST GOING TO THE MOVIES!

You should consider arranged marriages with the Houses of Europe for you daughters.

I am pretty sure it was with that in mind that he acquired his estate in France.

[Capetan Mihali]

Besides that you claim they give their undergrad students preference in graduate admissions and grumbler claims otherwise.

And yet the greater number of their post graduate students are from Cal Tech 

Yeah, I wouldnt expect you to see that there is no practical difference either.  But continue to argue things that are pointless.  It looks as good on you as it does on Grumbles.

I thought grumbler made his point quite pleasantly and wasn't unnecessarily argumentative.  And I do think it is a relevant distinction in light of the discussion we were having re: whether having a highly-ranked/"elite" undergraduate degree is important for getting accepted by a highly-ranked/"elite" graduate program.

[crazy canuck]

You are right, I should have cut him some slack for not being his usual self.

[Beenherebefore]

http://news.yahoo.com/nj-teen-loses-first-legal-battle-parents-pay-001646897--finance.html

The "abortions should be mandatory" example.

[grumbler]

You are right, I should have cut him some slack for not being his usual self.

Unfortunately, you are being your usual self. 

Talk about unnecessarily argumentative! 

BTW, according to cal tech, 3 of 36  graduate students in physics admitted in 2013 (the last year data is available) were from cal tech - the same number as from USTC and national Taiwan University.
http://www.pma.caltech.edu/GSR/gradclass2013.html

Still want to argue for a Cal Tech preference for their own undergrads?  I'd love to see the data that claim is based on.