Ukraine's European Revolution?

[Tamas]

A Financial Times article mentioned how the Hungarian PM, Orban, basically stayed silent during the whole ordeal, apart from making token gestures when his EU allies started noticing the silence.

Of course this must clearly connect in minds with the recent mega-deal signed with Putin regarding that  nuclear power plant.

One of the several odd things about that one, one most confusing for industry experts was: why such a hurry? Hungary still had years to look for the best deal and still the new plant would be completed before the current one had to be retired.

Since the signing of this deal, linking Hungary's very existence to Putin's good will once construction begins in about 5-7 years, took place about a month before the Ukrainian shit hit the fan - is it possible that Putin knew what was brewing in then-much-milder Ukrainian protests, and had to accelerate plans on gaining a Trojan Horse within EU and NATO?

[Syt]

[Queequeg]

We will fight to the death to defend our loyal friends in Ankara.

FYP.

Woah, that's a much bigger commitment than what Valmy had in mind.

Article 5 means never having to ask if you are a loyal friend.

Please tell me the Love Story reference was intentional.

[Viking]

We will fight to the death to defend our loyal friends in Ankara.

FYP.

Woah, that's a much bigger commitment than what Valmy had in mind.

Article 5 means never having to ask if you are a loyal friend.

Please tell me the Love Story reference was intentional.

Yes it was.

[Queequeg]

That made me snort coffee out of my nose.

[grumbler]

Russian conquest of the Crimea is always followed by claims on Constantinople.

[Admiral Yi]

Origins: The Shoveler.

[Viking]

That made me snort coffee out of my nose.

I suppose it might. My reason for making the reference was that once you are in NATO and get attacked we don't question whether you deserved being attacked or not.

[Sheilbh]

Having been at Twickenham hearing it with 80 thousand people singing, it stirs some emotions in me. But, politics wise, I put them in the category with RATM and Manic Street Preachers, great music, useless politics/philosophy.

Them? England rugby fans?

If you're trying to rationally critique the politics of a poem whose starting point is a mythical visit the Christ-child and Joseph of Aramathea made to England, I think you're maybe reading too much into things

Turkey said it had to scramble F-16s for the second time this week as a Russian surveillance plane again flew parallel the Turkish Black Sea coast.

Nice to see Russia buzzing the most phlegmatic NATO leader there

As I say they've been trying to build closer relations with the Greeks and Israelis explicitly designed to combat Turkish influence. It is bizarre how much of Putin's great Russian vision is 19th century: corrupt Erastianism, the voice of reaction at home and abroad, the 'defender' of Middle Eastern Christians, opposing Turkish influence, trying to expand their influence in the Levant and Eastern Europe.

[KRonn]

I saw on the news today that Russia has signed agreements with Egypt to be the weapons supplier for Egypt. I don't have any info on how extensive it is, or if it will replace the US. The militaries of the US and Egypt have had strong ties, so not sure how much that will be affected.

[Viking]

Having been at Twickenham hearing it with 80 thousand people singing, it stirs some emotions in me. But, politics wise, I put them in the category with RATM and Manic Street Preachers, great music, useless politics/philosophy.

Them? England rugby fans?

If you're trying to rationally critique the politics of a poem whose starting point is a mythical visit the Christ-child and Joseph of Aramathea made to England, I think you're maybe reading too much into things

Yes the hymn makes my knees go wobbly and brings tears to my eyes. After reading the lyrics and reading up about their meaning I found out how stupid they are. Same for RATM and the Manics, their rage and passion re-enforces my rage and passion when I hear their music. It's just my rage and passion that their rage and passion never have any kind of success.

[Sheilbh]

It's a poem. There's no 'meaning', there are 'meanings'. You may oppose the one that you've read into it, but that doesn't make it true.

If you're looking at the politics of that song in particular it was initially put to music as a 'bracing' and 'patriotic' hymn during WW1, since then it was the song of the Suffragette movement, preferred to 'God Save the King' by George V, and it's been used at Labour, Tory, Lib Dem, BNP and Women's Institute conferences.

Not to mention it's current use as an anthem for England at some sporting events, and its particular resonance in public school chapels and well-bred country weddings in appropriately latitudinarian Anglican Churches.

Wiki rather brilliantly describes a show about Jerusalem as England's national anthem having the following proponents, 'varied contributions come from Howard Goodall, Billy Bragg, Gary Bushell, Lord Hattersley, Ann Widdecombe and David Mellor, war proponents, war opponents, suffragettes, trade unionists, public schoolboys, the Tories, New Labour, football supporters, the British National Party, the Women's Institute, a gay choir, a gospel choir, Fat Les and naturists.'

As I say, it's got meaning, not a meaning.

Edit: Incidentally George V is right. As an anthem it's far better than 'God Save the King'. As you say it makes the knees go wobbly, rather than rigid. Which is what a good anthem should do.

[Valmy]

Man even the King didn't like God Save the King.  Anyway I just thought God Save the King was the UK's anthem, while each country in the UK had their own anthem.

[Admiral Yi]

Shelf, what exactly does "High Church Anglican" mean?

[Viking]

Isn't KGV the king who showed up late to a Scotland-England Rugby game, asked how "we" were doing (in his mind "we" being scotland) who blew his top when he was told how england was doing?