Hawaii verifies Obama birth records to Arizona

[CountDeMoney]

Assholes, the lot of you.

[Sheilbh]

Of course, sanity returned once Obama was actually elected, and he went ahead and implemented the very plan the MoveOn crown was screaming bloody murder about.

I don't remember anyone screaming bloody murder about the SOFA on the left.  I remember arguing with you because I said that whoever won the policy would be the same - withdrawal on the timetable negotiated by Bush - while you thought there'd be a difference.

I think there is a difference between MoveOn and the Tea Party which is that I can't remember many (any?) elected Democrats actively associating themselves with the Tea Party.  I can't think of any example of someone running as a solid MoveOn Democrat.  To use a couple of Labour Party examples I think MoveOn were more like the Fabians, a movement that tried to change their party's way of thinking with the blog like the Fabian journals.  The Tea Party remind me more of Militant Faction, a little bit entryist in style, a little bit of a party within a party - I'm still unsure if they'll get coopted by the Republican elite, or if they'll manage to coopt the Republican party.

[Admiral Yi]

Did the Fabians ever produce prose as lofty and insightful as "General Betray-Us?"

[DGuller]

For what it's worth DGuller, I find Berkut and grumbler's characterization of you and your posts pretty inaccurate.

  For what it's worth, I hold your opinion at a higher esteem than most others, and not solely because you always say good things about me. 

[grumbler]

Did the Fabians ever produce prose as lofty and insightful as "General Betray-Us?"

I think every group that lets kindergartners write their slogans has something equivalent:  "unfit to command;" "the one percent;" "don't ask, don't tell." 

[PDH]

Just say no!

[Razgovory]

Of course, sanity returned once Obama was actually elected, and he went ahead and implemented the very plan the MoveOn crown was screaming bloody murder about.

I don't remember anyone screaming bloody murder about the SOFA on the left.  I remember arguing with you because I said that whoever won the policy would be the same - withdrawal on the timetable negotiated by Bush - while you thought there'd be a difference.

I think there is a difference between MoveOn and the Tea Party which is that I can't remember many (any?) elected Democrats actively associating themselves with the Tea Party.  I can't think of any example of someone running as a solid MoveOn Democrat.  To use a couple of Labour Party examples I think MoveOn were more like the Fabians, a movement that tried to change their party's way of thinking with the blog like the Fabian journals.  The Tea Party remind me more of Militant Faction, a little bit entryist in style, a little bit of a party within a party - I'm still unsure if they'll get coopted by the Republican elite, or if they'll manage to coopt the Republican party.

I think when Berk is talking about the Moveon crowd he's actually referring to the anti-war crowd.  Why he calls it the "Moveon crowd", I don't know.  Maybe because he doesn't want to admit that more then just democrats and the far left were anti-war.  I do remember him being quite upset with the anti-war movement from the beginning.

[Razgovory]

Just say no!

Government is not the solution, Government is the problem.

[grumbler]

Just say no!

I'd argue that, while the campaign may have been misguided, that slogan was great.  The ones I mentioned, as well as "General Betrayus," don't even make sense.

[merithyn]

For what it's worth DGuller, I find Berkut and grumbler's characterization of you and your posts pretty inaccurate.

Agreed.

[dps]

For what it's worth DGuller, I find Berkut and grumbler's characterization of you and your posts pretty inaccurate.

Agreed.

That may be accurate, but DGuller's characterization of Berkut's position is even more off base.

[Berkut]

For what it's worth DGuller, I find Berkut and grumbler's characterization of you and your posts pretty inaccurate.

Agreed.

So when he cuts out the portion of my posts where I state the exact opposite of what he proceeds to rail on me about, you think that is pretty much all cool?

[PDH]

Just say no!

I'd argue that, while the campaign may have been misguided, that slogan was great.  The ones I mentioned, as well as "General Betrayus," don't even make sense.

To a 20-something in the 80s, "just say no" made no sense, as such long term thought was not part of the gameplan.  The slogan resonated with the 40-60 somethings who wrote the checks.

[Capetan Mihali]

For what it's worth DGuller, I find Berkut and grumbler's characterization of you and your posts pretty inaccurate.

Agreed.

To paraphrase the Byrds (and Doobie Brothers ) copying Arthur Reynolds, DGuller is just alright with me. 

[Razgovory]

For what it's worth DGuller, I find Berkut and grumbler's characterization of you and your posts pretty inaccurate.

Agreed.

So when he cuts out the portion of my posts where I state the exact opposite of what he proceeds to rail on me about, you think that is pretty much all cool?

You deserve worse.