The Shooting Gallery: Police Violence MEGATHREAD

[Sheilbh]

A video from Saturday. Thing with this one is it's tough to see how you write a rule against this sort of - it's just about culture.
https://twitter.com/RexChapman/status/1271832001364979716?s=20

[The Brain]

I think this is the incident

https://www.abqjournal.com/1380152/apd-man-shot-by-officers-in-august-was-armed-with-bb-gun.html

Thanks.

[Tamas]

So this shooting in Atlanta seems to be a much less clear-cut case to me than the murder of Flloyd.

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/06/14/us/rayshard-brooks-videos-final-moments/index.html


The victim who got shot by the police, was asleep in his car in a drivethru queue because he was so drunk. When he was to be arrested for driving under influence he struggled with the two officers, he grabbed on their tasers and fled, and according to the CNN article as I didn't watch that footage, he turns back and points the taser toward the chasing officer who in turn then shoots him.

Now, its fair to assume if the guy was a white middle-class looking drunk would have he been shot? Possibly not. But I am not sure what the police officer (who is being charged for homicide) was supposed to do. Get into a taser duel? Let the guy run off with a police taser?

I am not saying this surely wasn't a racist incident, but it is not a clear-cut case of murder like with Floyd.

[Zoupa]

Yes. He's supposed to let him run away. You don't kill someone over this.

[Maladict]

So this shooting in Atlanta seems to be a much less clear-cut case to me than the murder of Flloyd.

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/06/14/us/rayshard-brooks-videos-final-moments/index.html


The victim who got shot by the police, was asleep in his car in a drivethru queue because he was so drunk. When he was to be arrested for driving under influence he struggled with the two officers, he grabbed on their tasers and fled, and according to the CNN article as I didn't watch that footage, he turns back and points the taser toward the chasing officer who in turn then shoots him.

Now, its fair to assume if the guy was a white middle-class looking drunk would have he been shot? Possibly not. But I am not sure what the police officer (who is being charged for homicide) was supposed to do. Get into a taser duel? Let the guy run off with a police taser?

I am not saying this surely wasn't a racist incident, but it is not a clear-cut case of murder like with Floyd.

He would have to be fairly close to use it, the police officer(s) could have shot him in the leg?
And if he had kept running off with a taser, I don't see how killing him would be acceptable.

[jimmy olsen]

So this shooting in Atlanta seems to be a much less clear-cut case to me than the murder of Flloyd.

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/06/14/us/rayshard-brooks-videos-final-moments/index.html


The victim who got shot by the police, was asleep in his car in a drivethru queue because he was so drunk. When he was to be arrested for driving under influence he struggled with the two officers, he grabbed on their tasers and fled, and according to the CNN article as I didn't watch that footage, he turns back and points the taser toward the chasing officer who in turn then shoots him.

Now, its fair to assume if the guy was a white middle-class looking drunk would have he been shot? Possibly not. But I am not sure what the police officer (who is being charged for homicide) was supposed to do. Get into a taser duel? Let the guy run off with a police taser?

I am not saying this surely wasn't a racist incident, but it is not a clear-cut case of murder like with Floyd.

It's just a tazer, let him run off and pick him up when he's sobered up or call in a few more of the boys and pile on him. No need to shoot him in the back.

[Admiral Yi]

I'm mostly on the side of bad shooting.  I say mostly because if the cop gets tasered the dead guy has access to the cop's weapon.  I'm glad it wasn't my call.

[Syt]

I'm mostly on the side of bad shooting.  I say mostly because if the cop gets tasered the dead guy has access to the cop's weapon.  I'm glad it wasn't my call.

If the cop can't stay out of range from a drunk guy wielding a tazer ....

[Admiral Yi]

If the cop can't stay out of range from a drunk guy wielding a tazer ....

Maybe you're right.  Maybe the new protocol will have to be let the guy go if there's a chance the situation will possibly end in deadly force.

[Berkut]

Bad shoot.

The cop did not shoot him because he was threatened with the taser, he shot him in the back after he started running away. Given the short range of a taser, letting him run away would in fact be the very best way to remove that as a immediate threat.

[Berkut]

The bum on the bus bench was a tragic, but probably legitimate shooting. He had a gun, he reached for it when they told him to keep his hands clear, and they had reason to believe he was armed and a danger to others (several people had called in and said he was pointing a handgun at people).

Of course, it turned out to be a fucking BB gun made to look like a real gun (THAT should be fucking illegal right there), but you can't wait until he actually blows you away so you can be sure that a gun designed to look just like a deadly gun, is in fact a deadly gun.

[Admiral Yi]

Bad shoot.

The cop did not shoot him because he was threatened with the taser, he shot him in the back after he started running away. Given the short range of a taser, letting him run away would in fact be the very best way to remove that as a immediate threat.

He shot him after the taser was pointed at him.

[DGuller]

I get the logic that taser in suspect's hand may lead to a gun in suspect's hand, but that only works in 1-1 situations, and even then it's situational.  As a cop, you just have to take some risks to keep all people from your encounters alive.  Sometimes that means you let them take the first shot, if the alternative is to summarily execute anyone whose hands go where you don't like them going.

[Admiral Yi]

I get the logic that taser in suspect's hand may lead to a gun in suspect's hand, but that only works in 1-1 situations, and even then it's situational.  As a cop, you just have to take some risks to keep all people from your encounters alive.  Sometimes that means you let them take the first shot, if the alternative is to summarily execute anyone whose hands go where you don't like them going.

Would you be willing to take the other side of that deal?  Would you be willing to be a cop and let people take the first shot?  I sure as hell wouldn't.

[DGuller]

I get the logic that taser in suspect's hand may lead to a gun in suspect's hand, but that only works in 1-1 situations, and even then it's situational.  As a cop, you just have to take some risks to keep all people from your encounters alive.  Sometimes that means you let them take the first shot, if the alternative is to summarily execute anyone whose hands go where you don't like them going.

Would you be willing to take the other side of that deal?  Would you be willing to be a cop and let people take the first shot?  I sure as hell wouldn't.

I wouldn't be willing to be a lot of things society needs, because I don't have the right temperament.  Military service, police service, being a bouncer, that's not for me.  So what? 

I'm not saying that you always let people take the first shot, I'm saying that you may have to make it more likely for currently unarmed people to take the first shot, by not allowing the cops to blow away anyone who needs to adjust their dick because it's stuck in a zipper.  Yes, by letting people to continue moving their hands where they shouldn't, maybe occasionally they'll produce a gun out of their hand, and occasionally they may get the first shot off compared to if you blew them away earlier.  However, when Daniel Shaver shoots are considered good shoots, we have a serious problem with where the balance is between officer safety and very basic human rights.