Russo-Ukrainian War 2014-25

[Barrister]

And when a name just changes on it's own that fine.

What I hate is the hectoring of "you MUST use this awkward, foreign sounding name".

Prime targets: Cote d'Ivoire, Timor-Leste, and Turkiye.

And no I can't be bothered to do the accents.  Because its a small step from that to trying to insist on Україна for Ukraine.

[HVC]

I want to be able to retain 'Kiev' in the English language.  I'm tired of being hectored by random people whenever I use the same spelling that we've been using for two hundred years. 

So I'm as pro-Ukrainian as you get, and I tend to support this.  When speaking in English we use English names.  It's Germany not Deuthschland, Rome not Roma, Moscow not Moskva - and yes Kiev is fine (although I have kind of switched to Kiyev for virtue-signalling, but won't hector you for Kiev).

The one thing I will gently reprimand for is "The" Ukraine though - as no other country has a definite article like that.

But even here - Ukraine is fine, not Ukraina.

I still slip up and the once in a while. Just feels more natural to me. Might just be what I'm used to. Netherlands is another one. I'm going to Netherlands is probably more correct, but the "the" just feels more natural in both cases.

*edit* or I guess The UK, but UK isn't really a country so the rules are different, I guess.

[Valmy]

The United States of America?

But saying "The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland"

Is sort of like "The Republic of France"

You can just say Great Britain or France.

[Tonitrus]

It low-key bothers me that in WW2 vernacular, we seem to be unable to say "German Army" or "German Air Force"...no...we gotta be all edgy and throw out the "Wehrmacht" and "Luftwaffe".  While not giving that courtesy to other non-English militaries. 

[Valmy]

It low-key bothers me that in WW2 vernacular, we seem to be unable to say "German Army" or "German Air Force"...no...we gotta be all edgy and throw out the "Wehrmacht" and "Luftwaffe".  While not giving that courtesy to other non-English militaries. 

Fucking Germany in WW2 had the best propaganda ever. They lost yet somehow became the most famous and respected army in the world. And it wasn't even close, by 1943 the damn thing was over they just decided to fight on for no reason and get millions of people killed.

At least in World War I the Central Powers gave up rather quickly after it became obvious they couldn't win.

And yeah we don't casually refer to France's Army 'Armée de Terre' in this war or WW1. But, of course, in Napoleon's day we do call it 'La Grande Armée' because much like the WWII Germans France has great propaganda for that era.

[Valmy]

Another example is the tendency to refer to Japan's aircraft carrier fleet as the "Kido Butai" or the German Submarines as the "U Boats".

[Razgovory]

Also writing "Royal Scots Greys" instead of "Royal Scots Grays" while in the US.  God, that is so annoying.

[Zanza]

It low-key bothers me that in WW2 vernacular, we seem to be unable to say "German Army" or "German Air Force"...no...we gotta be all edgy and throw out the "Wehrmacht" and "Luftwaffe".  While not giving that courtesy to other non-English militaries. 

Or use "Nazi" instead of "German". That always gives me the impression that people want to see the Nazis as some kind of clique that committed all the crimes instead of a broad responsibility by the German people.

[Josquius]

Purely in terms of sounds I wouldn't put Kyiv (Keev) rather than Kiev (kee-ev) in the same boat as Turkiye (with silly accents) or cote d ivoire.
Both kyiv and Kiev work perfectly fine in English..

And yeah. English changes names of cities all the time to match the political situation. Stettin, Danzig, Pressburg, etc...
With kyiv it's just taken them a while to get there.

From what I understand, you're still free to be a malcontent in Russia, if you don't organize.  Whether by design or because of insufficient power/resolve, Russia is not totalitarian.  That said, it's definitely easier to live your life if you believe everything shown on Fox News Channel 1.

Define being a malcontent.
There's no thought crime or aught like that. But I've definitely seen stories of people being arrested for mentioning they don't support the war.
I recall a recent one with a doctor where all they had to go on was a patients claim she had criticised the war, then there was one with a guy being arrested after his daughter drew a picture of the war which was a bit critical, etc...

[Crazy_Ivan80]

I want to be able to retain 'Kiev' in the English language.  I'm tired of being hectored by random people whenever I use the same spelling that we've been using for two hundred years. 

So I'm as pro-Ukrainian as you get, and I tend to support this.  When speaking in English we use English names.  It's Germany not Deuthschland, Rome not Roma, Moscow not Moskva - and yes Kiev is fine (although I have kind of switched to Kiyev for virtue-signalling, but won't hector you for Kiev).

The one thing I will gently reprimand for is "The" Ukraine though - as no other country has a definite article like that.

But even here - Ukraine is fine, not Ukraina.

I still slip up and the once in a while. Just feels more natural to me. Might just be what I'm used to. Netherlands is another one. I'm going to Netherlands is probably more correct, but the "the" just feels more natural in both cases.

*edit* or I guess The UK, but UK isn't really a country so the rules are different, I guess.

For The Netherlands I think the 'The' is actually a part of the name. If you really feel the need to use it without 'the' you should you a singular form, not a plural one. Netherland in other words

[grumbler]

It low-key bothers me that in WW2 vernacular, we seem to be unable to say "German Army" or "German Air Force"...no...we gotta be all edgy and throw out the "Wehrmacht" and "Luftwaffe".  While not giving that courtesy to other non-English militaries. 

Particularly irritating in that the speakers don't seem to understand that the Luftwaffe and Reichsmarine, like the Heer, are all part of the Wehrmacht/Armed Forces.

If you insist on using the German word for the German Army, use the right word.

[Admiral Yi]

It low-key bothers me that in WW2 vernacular, we seem to be unable to say "German Army" or "German Air Force"...no...we gotta be all edgy and throw out the "Wehrmacht" and "Luftwaffe".  While not giving that courtesy to other non-English militaries. 

The Royal Air Force, the Royal Navy

[Tamas]

It low-key bothers me that in WW2 vernacular, we seem to be unable to say "German Army" or "German Air Force"...no...we gotta be all edgy and throw out the "Wehrmacht" and "Luftwaffe".  While not giving that courtesy to other non-English militaries. 

The Royal Air Force, the Royal Navy

The Irrelevant Example

Edit: ok I partially take it back, could be just British indeed

[Duque de Bragança]

Another example is the tendency to refer to Japan's aircraft carrier fleet as the "Kido Butai" or the German Submarines as the "U Boats".

It's U-Boot (singular) in German though. 

And when a name just changes on it's own that fine.

What I hate is the hectoring of "you MUST use this awkward, foreign sounding name".

Prime targets: Côte d'Ivoire, Timor-Leste, and Türkiye.

And no I can't be bothered to do the accents.  Because its a small step from that to trying to insist on Україна for Ukraine.

Fixed! Either go for Ivory Coast (the Portuguese still call it Costa do Marfim). It makes more sense than a drunken English sailor imbroglio pronunciation such as Sierra Leone (Castilian and Italian) for the Serra Leoa.
And so on.

As for Timor-Leste, you can't be triggered by accents or diacritics, can you ?
Timor has the same meaning as Leste. Yes, it's tautological.
If you are not happy, try Timor Lorosae, also a possibility. 

 
And Latin alphabet diacritics ≠ cyrilic alphabet

[crazy canuck]

It low-key bothers me that in WW2 vernacular, we seem to be unable to say "German Army" or "German Air Force"...no...we gotta be all edgy and throw out the "Wehrmacht" and "Luftwaffe".  While not giving that courtesy to other non-English militaries. 

The Royal Air Force, the Royal Navy

The Irrelevant Example

Edit: ok I partially take it back, could be just British indeed

We used to have a Royal Canadian Air Force, Royal Canadian Navy, etc.  Now it is just the Canadian Armed Forces