Did the US make the correct decision to enter the First World War?

Started by Razgovory, May 24, 2014, 11:55:10 PM

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Did the US make the correct decision to enter the First World War.

Yes!
16 (45.7%)
No!
14 (40%)
I don't know!
5 (14.3%)

Total Members Voted: 34

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grumbler

#90
May 27, 2014, 07:26:16 PM
Quote from: Tonitrus on May 27, 2014, 06:29:47 PM
Well, there is also, in the case of a German victory, the probability of Stalin and the Soviet Union trying to avenge Brest-Litovsk 20 or so years down the line.

If the Germans win, I doubt Stalin ever comes to power.  The military threat to the USSR would be pressing enough that a military bumbler like Stalin was known to be wouldn't have been chosen over the militarily gifted Trotsky.

Without Stalin's industrialization program, I wonder how well the USSR stands up over time.
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!

derspiess

#91
May 27, 2014, 08:01:43 PM
And I don't see a victorious Imperial Germany tolerating Trotsky's internationalist shenanigans for too long.
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

Tonitrus

#92
May 27, 2014, 08:31:05 PM
Even with victory, Germany is going to be in rough economic shape for a while...and a Great Depression could still bring about an unhealthy share of communist/socialist unrest in Western Europe (maybe hitting defeated France/Britain harder this time.  And who's to say that some character like DeGaull doesn't end up being France's version of Hitler?  (Minus all the Jewish hate and aryan mysticism).

Hell, there's probably even a Turtledove novel on the subject.  :P

Ed Anger

#93
May 27, 2014, 08:33:45 PM
Quote from: derspiess on May 27, 2014, 08:01:43 PM
And I don't see a victorious Imperial Germany tolerating Trotsky's internationalist shenanigans for too long.

OOOO, Strosstruppen burning Moscow. I just got a boner.
Stay Alive...Let the Man Drive

CountDeMoney

#94
May 27, 2014, 08:39:09 PM
Quote from: derspiess on May 27, 2014, 08:01:43 PM
And I don't see a victorious Imperial Germany tolerating Trotsky's internationalist shenanigans for too long.

If Germany had won, there never would've been a Poland to tempt Trotsky in the first place.

derspiess

#95
May 27, 2014, 08:44:00 PM
He'd still be tryin' to export him some revolution.
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

Ed Anger

#96
May 27, 2014, 08:44:51 PM
Quote from: derspiess on May 27, 2014, 08:44:00 PM
He'd still be tryin' to export him some revolution.

He got an Icepick import.
Stay Alive...Let the Man Drive

CountDeMoney

#97
May 27, 2014, 08:45:15 PM
Maybe south by southwest, perhaps.  But not due west.  :lol:

jimmy olsen

#98
May 27, 2014, 09:08:38 PM
Quote from: Tonitrus on May 27, 2014, 06:29:47 PM
Well, there is also, in the case of a German victory, the probability of Stalin and the Soviet Union trying to avenge Brest-Litovsk 20 or so years down the line.
If the U.S. isn't in the war and France is clearly crumbling, the Russians may accept the Germans original demands which IIRC were that Poland and Lithuania be made "independent".
It is far better for the truth to tear my flesh to pieces, then for my soul to wander through darkness in eternal damnation.

Jet: So what kind of woman is she? What's Julia like?
Faye: Ordinary. The kind of beautiful, dangerous ordinary that you just can't leave alone.
Jet: I see.
Faye: Like an angel from the underworld. Or a devil from Paradise.
--------------------------------------------
1 Karma Chameleon point

Sheilbh

#99
May 27, 2014, 10:01:36 PM
Quote from: Tonitrus on May 27, 2014, 08:31:05 PM
Even with victory, Germany is going to be in rough economic shape for a while...and a Great Depression could still bring about an unhealthy share of communist/socialist unrest in Western Europe (maybe hitting defeated France/Britain harder this time.  And who's to say that some character like DeGaull doesn't end up being France's version of Hitler?  (Minus all the Jewish hate and aryan mysticism).
:o :mmm: :w00t: :wub:

This is the first time I've ever actually really understood Spellus :o
Let's bomb Russia!

Grinning_Colossus

#100
May 28, 2014, 12:41:51 AM
Quote from: Tonitrus on May 27, 2014, 08:31:05 PM
Even with victory, Germany is going to be in rough economic shape for a while...and a Great Depression could still bring about an unhealthy share of communist/socialist unrest in Western Europe (maybe hitting defeated France/Britain harder this time.  And who's to say that some character like DeGaull doesn't end up being France's version of Hitler?  (Minus all the Jewish hate and aryan mysticism).

Hell, there's probably even a Turtledove novel on the subject.  :P

There's a very good Hearts of Iron mod on the subject. :)
Quis futuit ipsos fututores?

Razgovory

#101
May 28, 2014, 02:05:00 AM
No there isn't.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

Valmy

#102
May 28, 2014, 09:37:00 AM
Quote from: Tonitrus on May 27, 2014, 08:31:05 PMAnd who's to say that some character like DeGaull doesn't end up being France's version of Hitler?  (Minus all the Jewish hate and aryan mysticism).

France already had him with General Boulanger.  Yeah...I don't think there was much danger to anybody but France with that sort of thing.
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."

Agelastus

#103
May 28, 2014, 09:45:49 AM
Quote from: Razgovory on May 28, 2014, 02:05:00 AM
No there isn't.

Is this because:

(a) The pedant option: it's actually a mod for Hearts of Iron 2?
(b) The historian option: the scenario is unrealistic?
(c) The Gamer's option: the mod is far too complicated in an effort to avoid railroading and to give each nation, large or small, a unique experience?
(d) Something else?
"Come grow old with me
The Best is yet to be
The last of life for which the first was made."

Razgovory

#104
May 28, 2014, 12:04:18 PM
I take exception with the words "Very good".
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017
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