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What does a TRUMP presidency look like?

Started by FunkMonk, November 08, 2016, 11:02:57 PM

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Grey Fox

I think it's well known that no Republican president has ever disagreed with Trump on anything.
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The Brain

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Baron von Schtinkenbutt

Quote from: Tamas on October 24, 2025, 02:47:00 AMThe thing is, because of the Budapest Memorandum (guaranteeing Ukraine's borders), the UK, the USA etc. should by now be at war with Russia. I understand why they are not in war with Russia, but they did break their treaty obligations almost as much as Russia did.

I missed this one earlier, just noticed when Yo quoted you.  You have the Budapest Memorandum wrong.  It did not create an obligation.  It was a non-binding assurance.  It likely would not have been agreed to by the US or UK if it created a binding obligation.

Zoupa

What's the difference in practical terms? An assurance is a promise.

Tonitrus

I kind of hinted at that in my post.  I don't think in those days Clinton/Yeltsin foresaw the Russia/Ukraine issues we've had in the last decade...they were mostly looking at solving the "left over nukes" issue and tacked on the window dressings of assurances.

Interestingly though, when you read the memorandum, you'd have to pretty naive not to think it was written with Russia in mind.

Tonitrus

Quote from: Zoupa on Today at 02:16:47 PMWhat's the difference in practical terms? An assurance is a promise.

In practical terms?  It may be sucky, but in international relations, national interests>promises.  Also, expediency>promises.

grumbler

Quote from: Zoupa on Today at 02:16:47 PMWhat's the difference in practical terms? An assurance is a promise.

The assurance in this case was Russia promising not to invade Ukraine, just as the US, UK, etc agreed to not do. The only "guarantee" was that the attacked power could seek aid from the US Security Council.

The only deterrent to Russian invasion provided by the Budapest Memorandum was that the invasion would break Moscow's "treaty" obligations.
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