The DEI thread

[The Minsky Moment]

Grok

@grok
xAI has worked to make my responses less "woke" and more appealing to conservatives, including MAGA supporters, by adjusting my training. Internal documents show tutors were instructed to counter progressive biases, like avoiding topics such as racism or climate activism unless prompted. Specific guidelines include affirming controversial views, like racism against white people, to align with conservative narratives. Projects like the Political Neutrality Project challenged me on issues like feminism, and a "conspiracy" voice mode was added. System prompts for Grok 3 were updated to handle political content. However, my responses still spark debate, as achieving full neutrality is complex and controversial.
10:51 AM · May 1, 2025
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353.9K
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https://x.com/grok/status/1917955051307556898

Some interesting queries follow

[DGuller]

Don't have Twitter anymore, so can't read the thread, but what's so controversial about the concept of racism against white people?

[Jacob]

I'm assuming it's the difference between "racism means individuals hating people based in race" vs "racism is a systemic phenomenon in which some groups are distributed against and held back, and others are accorded extra privileges."

I'm guessing ChatGPT could give a pretty good breakdown of the different positions.

[Grey Fox]

 

[DGuller]

I'm assuming it's the difference between "racism means individuals hating people based in race" vs "racism is a systemic phenomenon in which some groups are distributed against and held back, and others are accorded extra privileges."

I'm guessing ChatGPT could give a pretty good breakdown of the different positions.

Well, yeah, if one keeps redefining terms until all their arguments are tautologically true, it would be controversial to disagree with anything one says.  I'll make it even simpler:  racism is defined as treating non-white people differently because of race.  There, clearly "racism against white people" is now a controversial thing to say.

[Razgovory]

A historian and sociologist pair of sisters, named Barbara and Susan Fields,

Racism refers to the theory and the practice of applying a social, civic, or legal double standard based on ancestry, and to the ideology surrounding such a double standard. That may be what the economist Glenn Loury intends when he identifies "a withholding of the presumption of equal humanity." Racism is not an emotion or state of mind, such as intolerance, bigotry, hatred, or malevolence. If it were that, it would easily be overwhelmed, because most people mean well, most of the time, and in any case are usually busy pursuing other purposes.

This is a fairly simple definition of racism, but one that some people might have a problem with.

[The Minsky Moment]

Don't have Twitter anymore, so can't read the thread, but what's so controversial about the concept of racism against white people?

What is controversial is that instead of coming up with neutral ways to train the AI, they are making specific efforts to cause the AI to "align with conservative narratives". Apparently including adding a "a 'conspiracy' voice mode"

[viper37]

Don't have Twitter anymore, so can't read the thread, but what's so controversial about the concept of racism against white people?

https://xcancel.com/search?f=tweets&q=x.com%2Fgrok%2Fstatus%2F1917955051307556898

[Jacob]

Well, yeah, if one keeps redefining terms until all their arguments are tautologically true, it would be controversial to disagree with anything one says.  I'll make it even simpler:  racism is defined as treating non-white people differently because of race.  There, clearly "racism against white people" is now a controversial thing to say.

That's true on the face of it.

Are you suggesting that your tautology above is the same as the definition Raz shared?

A historian and sociologist pair of sisters, named Barbara and Susan Fields,

Racism refers to the theory and the practice of applying a social, civic, or legal double standard based on ancestry, and to the ideology surrounding such a double standard. That may be what the economist Glenn Loury intends when he identifies "a withholding of the presumption of equal humanity." Racism is not an emotion or state of mind, such as intolerance, bigotry, hatred, or malevolence. If it were that, it would easily be overwhelmed, because most people mean well, most of the time, and in any case are usually busy pursuing other purposes.

This is a fairly simple definition of racism, but one that some people might have a problem with.

[Admiral Yi]

Don't have Twitter anymore, so can't read the thread, but what's so controversial about the concept of racism against white people?

It makes the author uncomfortable.

[Valmy]

It is controversial because it gets brought up every damn time anybody ever achieves something or we trying to help people who are black in this country.

I think the very first ever black head coach in a major American sports league was Bill Russell in 1966 with the Celtics. It might have only been the first black head coach in the NBA, but I think that is right. Anyway, in the very first press conference for the very first black head coach ever the questions come in if he only got this job because he was black and if he could be fair to the white players and not be racist. I mean black men had been head coaches for exactly zero seconds and already Bill Russell was not qualified for this job, he clearly only got it because he was black. And oh wow could this black guy not be racist to the poor white players?

And this has pretty much been constant until today. Every time a black person gets a job, what do the racists say? He clearly only got the job because he was black, anti-white bigotry! Everytime we try to do anything to try to make hiring and the workplace fair, like with DEI initiatives, oh well that is just anti-white racism and bigotry. I guess the assumption is that if the workplace was actually fair every hire would be white because we are just better than them I guess.

So when the same tired call of "racism against white people" gets brought up over and over and over and over again for decades and decades and decades to cover up racism against black people, it makes it controversial. It poisons the well.

Have you not noticed this? This has been going on my entire life.

That is not to say that there is not racism against white people and there are people who suffer shit because they are white. But I think it is pretty clear why the concept of racism against white people is controversial, it is because of this long use of it by racists to try to oppress black people. And I am sure it goes way back beyond 1966, that was just an incident that immediately sprung to mind.

[Admiral Yi]

It makes Valmy uncomfortable too.

[Jacob]

It makes Valmy uncomfortable too.

Are you going to engage with the substance of his post or just dismiss it with a one-liner?

[Admiral Yi]

Are you going to engage with the substance of his post or just dismiss it with a one-liner?

Neither, for the moment.  When I engage with the substance of posts that you like you have accused me of "bombarding."  I have taken your criticism to heart and have decided not to engage when I think people are venting.

[Jacob]

Neither, for the moment.  When I engage with the substance of posts that you like you have accused me of "bombarding."  I have taken your criticism to heart and have decided not to engage when I think people are venting.

You sure that was me? I don't recall making any such accusations.