Dominion Voting System v Fox News

[Valmy]

Net income for fox news in 2022 was $1.507B. So this hurts but is hardly crippling.

Well I think the idea is for it to hurt bad enough that they don't do it again.

[The Minsky Moment]

I can't emphasize enough: (a) how hard it is to win a defamation suit against a media company is US courts, and (b) the extraordinary, perfect storm set of bad facts for Fox that nonetheless led to this result.  It's like a perfect case study in how badly a media company can screw up its editorial and legal risk management functions.

[HVC]

Net income for fox news in 2022 was $1.507B. So this hurts but is hardly crippling.

Well I think the idea is for it to hurt bad enough that they don't do it again.

2022 was a bad year. They made 2 billion the year before. So that can still mess up once a year and make 1 billion net income they have 5 billion in cash laying around

Question. a plea means they don't admit wrong doing, right? Can they face any other repercussions ? FCC or anything?

[grumbler]

2022 was a bad year. They made 2 billion the year before. So that can still mess up once a year and make 1 billion net income they have 5 billion in cash laying around

Question. a plea means they don't admit wrong doing, right? Can they face any other repercussions ? FCC or anything?

This was a civil suit, so settlement doesn't necessarily mean admitting that Fox was wrong, but Dominion was saying as recently as yesterday that any settlement had to include an apology from Fox.

[jimmy olsen]

They're being sued by another voting machine company "smartmatic" for 2.7 billion in damages, I assume they're going to want at least as big a payout.

Hell, if I was them, I would demand 49% of my claimed damages as well. That would be 1.323 billion.

[Barrister]

2022 was a bad year. They made 2 billion the year before. So that can still mess up once a year and make 1 billion net income they have 5 billion in cash laying around

Question. a plea means they don't admit wrong doing, right? Can they face any other repercussions ? FCC or anything?

What I saw was that Fox didn't admit to doing wrong, didn't apologize, but admitted the judge's findings that they had spread lies.
This was a civil suit, so settlement doesn't necessarily mean admitting that Fox was wrong, but Dominion was saying as recently as yesterday that any settlement had to include an apology from Fox.

[Habbaku]

2022 was a bad year. They made 2 billion the year before. So that can still mess up once a year and make 1 billion net income they have 5 billion in cash laying around

Question. a plea means they don't admit wrong doing, right? Can they face any other repercussions ? FCC or anything?

What I saw was that Fox didn't admit to doing wrong, didn't apologize, but admitted the judge's findings that they had spread lies.
This was a civil suit, so settlement doesn't necessarily mean admitting that Fox was wrong, but Dominion was saying as recently as yesterday that any settlement had to include an apology from Fox.

[grumbler]

2022 was a bad year. They made 2 billion the year before. So that can still mess up once a year and make 1 billion net income they have 5 billion in cash laying around

Question. a plea means they don't admit wrong doing, right? Can they face any other repercussions ? FCC or anything?

What I saw was that Fox didn't admit to doing wrong, didn't apologize, but admitted the judge's findings that they had spread lies.
This was a civil suit, so settlement doesn't necessarily mean admitting that Fox was wrong, but Dominion was saying as recently as yesterday that any settlement had to include an apology from Fox.

[Valmy]

I am now so confused about who said what.

[crazy canuck]

I am now so confused about who said what.

So is Fox

[Barrister]

Leaving out any quotes...

Fox News did not apologize.  They did not retract anything.

They acknowledged the judge's findings of fact that they had spread untruths on the air.

It was the kind of formulation only a lawyer could love.

Normally you'd expect either Fox to apologize and retract, or otherwise pay but continue to deny any wrongdoing.  But this is really a "cut the baby in half" kind of formulation.

[The Minsky Moment]

As Jimmy points out, the Smartmatic suit is still pending.  So Fox has to be very careful about making statements that could be used as admissions against it in that lawsuit.  No doubt that upped the price tag on this settlement.

[Barrister]

As Jimmy points out, the Smartmatic suit is still pending.  So Fox has to be very careful about making statements that could be used as admissions against it in that lawsuit.  No doubt that upped the price tag on this settlement.

Understood, but that's where I might have expected the "although Fox News continues to deny any wrongdoing, we have nevertheless settled this lawsuit" kind of statement.

Someone at Dominion insisted on the "acknowledgement".

[crazy canuck]

As Jimmy points out, the Smartmatic suit is still pending.  So Fox has to be very careful about making statements that could be used as admissions against it in that lawsuit.  No doubt that upped the price tag on this settlement.

Understood, but that's where I might have expected the "although Fox News continues to deny any wrongdoing, we have nevertheless settled this lawsuit" kind of statement.

Someone at Dominion insisted on the "acknowledgement".

I am not sure what your point is, what the judge already found as a fact in rulings on preliminary applications is not something that can be denied in a settlement agreement.

[viper37]

The Case That Could Be Fox's Next Dominion

Tucker Carlson, before he was sidelined by Fox, repeatedly endorsed a conspiracy theory about an Arizona man, who may sue for defamation. Legal experts say it would be a viable case.

Of all the distortions and paranoia that Tucker Carlson promoted on his since-canceled Fox News program, one looms large: a conspiracy theory that an Arizona man working as a covert government agent incited the Jan. 6, 2021, assault on the Capitol to sabotage and discredit former President Donald J. Trump and his political movement.
What's known about the man — a two-time Trump voter named Ray Epps — is that he took part in demonstrations in Washington that day and the night before. He was captured on camera urging a crowd to march with him and enter the Capitol. But at other points, he pleads for calm once it becomes clear the situation is turning violent. He can be seen moving past a line of Capitol Police at the barricades, but never actually goes inside the Capitol.
Federal prosecutors have not charged Mr. Epps with a crime, focusing instead on the more than 1,000 other demonstrators who acted violently or were trespassing in the Capitol. The Justice Department's sprawling investigation into the attack remains open, however, and Mr. Epps could still be indicted.
Yet for more than 18 months, Mr. Carlson insisted that the lack of charges against Mr. Epps could mean only one thing: that he was being protected because he was a secret government agent. There was "no rational explanation," Mr. Carlson told his audience, why this "mysterious figure" who "helped stage-manage the insurrection" had not been charged.


He repeated Mr. Epps's name over and over — in nearly 20 episodes — imprinting it on the minds of his viewers.
Mr. Epps was in the Marine Corps but said in his deposition before the Jan. 6 committee that he had otherwise never worked on behalf of any government agency. He and his wife, Robyn, have fled Arizona and are in hiding in another state, having sold their wedding venue business and ranch after receiving death threats from people who appeared to believe the conspiracy theory. And his legal jeopardy is far from over given that prosecutors are still unsealing new cases in connection with Jan. 6.
Now lawyers representing Mr. Epps and his wife are proceeding with plans to sue Fox News for defamation. "We informed Fox in March that if they did not issue a formal on-air apology that we would pursue all available avenues to protect the Eppses' rights," said Michael Teter, a lawyer for Mr. Epps who sent the network a cease-and-desist letter asking for an on-air apology and a retraction. After Mr. Teter did not hear from Fox about his request, he began to prepare the suit. "That remains our intent."
Mr. Epps declined to comment on his potential suit. A Fox News spokeswoman declined to comment.
Mr. Carlson also declined to comment. But he continues to push the false notion that the Jan. 6 attack was staged by anti-Trump elements inside the government. On a podcast last week, Mr. Carlson claimed that the riot "was not an insurrection" and that the crowd that day was "filled with federal agents."


First Amendment experts say Mr. Epps has a viable case for defamation — one reminiscent of the lawsuit the network recently settled with Dominion Voting Systems for $787.5 million, a case centered on numerous examples of false statements made on Fox News programs over an extended period.

[...]