Donate organs - reduce your prison sentence

[Syt]

Based on this story about GOP Democrat lawmakers' proposal in Massachusetts.

https://www.cbsnews.com/boston/news/massachusetts-bill-prisoners-donate-organs-reduced-sentences/

Lawmakers propose letting Massachusetts prisoners donate organs for reduced sentences

BOSTON - A new bill proposed on Beacon Hill would allow Massachusetts prisoners to donate their organs for reduced sentences.

The legislation would give people anywhere from 60 days to a year off their prison sentence "on the condition that the incarcerated individual has donated bone marrow or organ(s)."

The "act to establish the Massachusetts incarcerated individual bone marrow and organ donation program" is sponsored by Democratic Reps. Judith Garcia, of Chelsea, and Carlos Gonzalez of Springfield.

They say it would "restore bodily autonomy to incarcerated folks" and expand the pool of donors, especially for people of color who struggle to find a match. But critics strongly disagree and say it might even be illegal.

"It's like you're harvesting organs. It just doesn't feel right. It doesn't feel humane," Project Turnaround founder Romilda Pereira told The Boston Globe. "You're bargaining with vulnerable people over their time."

A Brigham & Women's Hospital epidemiologist told the newspaper that the proposal was "perverse."

"There are certainly ways we can engage our free communities in educating them about the options of organ and bone marrow donation," Monik Jiménez said. "But going to our incarcerated population as a source is problematic, at best, and exploitative."

I think this is an interesting debate and I'm curious what Languishites think. I don't want to wade into whether this option should be offered for persons who committed crime X but not to those who committed crime Y, just the general principal of it.

Personally I'm a bit torn on it.

On the one hand, I feel this could be seen as another way how a convicted criminal can repay their debt to society and "do good" against the damage and harm they caused.

On the other hand, incarceration is one of the strongest measures a state can take against an individual, and in that situation the promise to get out sooner will probably create so much pressure that you have to wonder how "voluntary" such donations would be (which could lead into an argument whether criminals deserve such freedom of choice in the first place - which I think they do; I know some feel that criminals waive a whole slew rights by committing criminal acts against their fellow humans and society). Additionally, it might create more incentives, esp. in a system of for-profit prisons, to increase the number of persons (= potential donors) behind bars and lead to lobbiying from invested groups for more/harsher sentences in general.

Then there's the whole debate of trading time for literally a part of you. A year spent in prison can't be replaced (and depending on prison can be more or less traumatic). Neither can a kidney (well, your original, you might require a transplant later yourself ). Is giving up a kidney worth a year of freedom? Two years? Who can make those calls?

 

[garbon]

Terrible

[Syt]

Terrible

That's what I lean towards because of the potential for abuse and coercion (making prisons unpleasant enough that people are eager to do anything to get out sooner).

But if, as a society, criminals are to be punished, what is an acceptable punishment is a constant debate through all ages. From exile to death penalties in vayring degrees of "humaneness", branding, public humiliation, monetary fines, removal of rights and privileges, cutting off hands, etc.

I feel it's worth reflecting on this one, too, if only to confirm that it's a terrible idea and why.

[The Brain]

Sounds like a bad idea. And for it to even be non-insanely considered I think society would have to be in a different place regarding its view on organ donations than it is today. If selling your organs was a mainstream thing then maybe.

Apart from various practical reasons why it is a bad idea, legally it seems iffy. If you can effectively serve a year of prison time by instead donating a kidney, wouldn't that kinda make donating the kidney an alternative form of punishment, and therefore fall under some "cruel and unusual" ban? Or is there no such ban for "optional" forms of punishment?

[Josquius]

 Organ donations sounds a bit fucked up and goes into dystopia territory.
But I can see the appeal with bone marrow. There's nothing actually lost by the donor there. But they do have to go through something very unpleasant.
The trouble then though is not all prisoners who want to do this will have matches needing their donation so its quite unfair.

I'd lean towards no on a automatic donate x=y days off policy. But it's certainly something to explore for opening up this avenue to prisoners and it being a huge factor for probation boards to consider.

[The Brain]

Don't probation boards today take into consideration stuff like this?

[jimmy olsen]

You can't meaningfully consent in this situation

[The Larch]

Ugh, hell no.

In any case, which organs can you voluntarely give up on, anyway? A kidney is the only one that comes to mind. It's not as if you can go around giving up lungs or corneas.

[Josquius]

Don't probation boards today take into consideration stuff like this?

I guess?
I've not heard of it being much promoted though

[Razgovory]

I accidently voted yes.  So I'm sticking with that one.  Let the rich harvest the poor.

[Admiral Yi]

You can't meaningfully consent in this situation

Of course you can.  Yes or no.  Two choices.

[mongers]

This is such a bad idea, it even makes some of my ideas look sensible.

[Syt]

You can't meaningfully consent in this situation

Of course you can.  Yes or no.  Two choices.

"Either you donate your kidney, or we will make your life in here a miserable hell."

[celedhring]

My rule of thumb is that if you have an idea that could be the basis of a Black Mirror episode, then it's probably a terrible idea.

[Oexmelin]

You can't meaningfully consent in this situation

Of course you can.  Yes or no.  Two choices.

Rich and poor alike can decide to sleep under bridges