Quote from: Jacob on Today at 02:00:20 PMI tend to think it goes in this order (from best to worst):I'm not sure that good planned economy can beat out shitty liberal economy, even with excellent leadership. Part of the reason is that the scale of what needs managing is just too much, and would require many more levels of delegation than humans have learned to manage. Another reason is that keeping the system competent and free of corruption for long is very hard.
- A liberal economic order with competent leadership and appropriate regulations and safeguards
- Centrally planned economy with competent leaderships and appropriate safeguards
- A liberal economic order with incompetent or corrupt leadership with misaligned regulations and safeguards
- Centrally planned economy with incompetent or corrupt leadership with misaligned regulations and safeguards
My read is that China's is tending towards 2, with dashes of 4; while the US is going all in at 3.
Quote from: DGuller on Today at 01:58:56 PMQuote from: The Minsky Moment on Today at 01:26:11 PMI think in the age of AI China would eventually have better information about your wants than you do.Quote from: Valmy on Today at 01:16:17 PMI have thought that a centrally planned economy might work with sophisticated enough data and computer resources.
That's a very old debate. Oskar Lange was arguing its possibility in the 1930s.
The problem is that even if you had the computing power needed and a workable model, how do you know and how can you get all the necessary information to input into the model?![]()
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on Today at 01:26:11 PMI think in the age of AI China would eventually have better information about your wants than you do.Quote from: Valmy on Today at 01:16:17 PMI have thought that a centrally planned economy might work with sophisticated enough data and computer resources.
That's a very old debate. Oskar Lange was arguing its possibility in the 1930s.
The problem is that even if you had the computing power needed and a workable model, how do you know and how can you get all the necessary information to input into the model?
Quote from: Syt on Today at 01:05:24 PMGoing through the 1.08 beta patch notes and saw this:QuoteExiting using Alt+F4 in Ironman will now save the game.![]()
I accidentally discovered a much more convenient way to cheese the Ironman: by default your saves get saved to a OneDrive-linked folder, which versions the save file automatically. If there is no syncing to the cloud, you can just roll back your save to one of quite a few prior versions and overwrite the current save. I only did it once when I was trying to roll back the save for a HOI4 game far back enough to escape out of CtD loop.Quote from: The Minsky Moment on Today at 01:29:04 PMQuote from: Valmy on Today at 01:27:15 PMProbably through trial and error.
But what to try and how do you recognize error?
Hayek was wrong about almost everything but not about the knowledge problem. We don't even know what it is we need to know.
Quote from: Valmy on Today at 01:30:18 PMQuote from: crazy canuck on Today at 01:27:29 PMQuote from: Valmy on Today at 01:16:17 PMI have thought that a centrally planned economy might work with sophisticated enough data and computer resources.
We'll see if China successfully models it for us![]()
It's an interesting thought experiment, that might work if (and it's a big if) self interest of the decision makers is removed. What we are seeing in China are decisions being made for a reason other than optimal well being of the population. It's a bit like the when say communism failed in the Soviet Union and the reply being that Communism was never tried in the Soviet Union. But the question remains, could it ever really be implemented, or would self interest of those in charge always become the imperative.
I tend to think it is the latter, and for all its warts, Liberal Democracy may be the best model.
Well central planning has almost certainly been tried. Seems to me a regulated market economy works with the least disastrous results.
Liberal Democracy is not an economic modelBut if it is I would say straight up liberalism has a long history of disastrous economic meltdowns.
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