Any thoughts on the announcement?
Quote from: garbon on June 19, 2012, 09:14:40 AM
Any thoughts on the announcement?
The cover/keyboard idea is brilliant.
As for the rest... we'll have to wait and see the actual device. No prices have been announced. No idea how performance is. And I think it's bizarre they're releasing two different processor types - Intel and ARM. Software will not be compatible between them, so they're just splitting their user base in half.
The Metro apps can be made to be compatible.
The slide keyboard is not really new. Though using it as cover is.
Asus EEE Slide
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fsocialbarrel.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2011%2F01%2FAsus-Eee-Pad-Slide.jpg&hash=c84d3d97012bddc6242403f48ea46880e2cbe332)
Quote from: Grey Fox on June 19, 2012, 09:45:06 AM
The Metro apps can be made to be compatible.
Yeah, but doesn't that just make things more a PITA for apps developers...not a good thing when Apple already blows away everyone else for apps numbers?
Quote from: Tonitrus on June 19, 2012, 01:26:13 PM
Quote from: Grey Fox on June 19, 2012, 09:45:06 AM
The Metro apps can be made to be compatible.
Yeah, but doesn't that just make things more a PITA for apps developers...not a good thing when Apple already blows away everyone else for apps numbers?
Yes. Windows 8 is a god damn PITA for me already & it's not even out.
Well, call me a curmudgeon, but what I've seen of Windows 8 makes me want to punt Ballmer in the nutsack.
Like you need a new reason to do that.
Word is, they are only going to be selling it in MSFT retail stores and not through the normal distribution channels. I wonder what the thinking there is. They only have 20 stores.
Quote from: Tonitrus on June 19, 2012, 02:19:05 PM
Well, call me a curmudgeon, but what I've seen of Windows 8 makes me want to punt Ballmer in the nutsack.
Same.
I installed Win7 a while ago and it really is very good, but Win8 sounds like an unholy mess.
Quote from: Barrister on June 19, 2012, 02:42:41 PM
Quote from: Tonitrus on June 19, 2012, 02:19:05 PM
Well, call me a curmudgeon, but what I've seen of Windows 8 makes me want to punt Ballmer in the nutsack.
Same.
I installed Win7 a while ago and it really is very good, but Win8 sounds like an unholy mess.
A iTablet-like experience on my desktop? Nuh fuckin uh.
I have tried Windows 8.
It's a complete redesign. Metro kills everything we've learned to use since Windows 95.
It will certainly be interesting, depending on how committed MS is when they launch this turkey, how the market will react.
Would MS backpedal from a Windows-user backlash?
Will Windows users simply adapt?
Or will they just say "well, fuck it, guess I might as well go all-Apple then", and throw the balance all the way to Apple in the PC market as well.
Honestly, if Windows 8 operates as fugly as I think it looks...I will probably cling onto 7 as long as it's supported, and then just go with my third option. I am already somewhat familiar with the Mac interface on my laptop (even though I think Windows 7 is significantly superior). Maybe I am just too old to care to learn tablet-crap for a desktop...and I think it's fine for an iPad-type device, but I need my classic PC. :(
If I do have to go full-Apple, it also sucks that Mac Pro is dwindling away. I blame stupid kids (who lack the desire to tinker with components) these days. :mad:
Speaking of which, I am thinking of being all Ed Anger-ish and getting an iPad. :blush:
I'll buy one. Just because.
Quote from: Ed Anger on June 19, 2012, 04:14:22 PM
I'll buy one. Just because.
I think we already knew this. :P
It's more than likely we'll end up with a win8 tablet at work so I really hope it won't suck. The win7 prototypes they're testing are horrible though.
Quote from: Tonitrus on June 19, 2012, 04:12:27 PM
It will certainly be interesting, depending on how committed MS is when they launch this turkey, how the market will react.
Would MS backpedal from a Windows-user backlash?
Will Windows users simply adapt?
Or will they just say "well, fuck it, guess I might as well go all-Apple then", and throw the balance all the way to Apple in the PC market as well.
I doubt the latter will happen. Windows users generally seem to be an adaptable bunch though we'll probably hold on to an older version as long as possible. Only just now did I get Windows 7 at work - still had been on XP!
If anything gives me hope that Windows 7 will last quite some time is that there is probably no way the DoD will figure out Windows 8.
Some peeps at my wife's office already discussing replacing their work PCs with this thing. I think that's...unwise.
Quote from: Tonitrus on June 19, 2012, 07:07:54 PM
If anything gives me hope that Windows 7 will last quite some time is that there is probably no way the DoD will figure out Windows 8.
My corner of the DoD hadn't even figured out Windows 7 yet when I left.
Quote from: Tonitrus on June 19, 2012, 07:07:54 PM
If anything gives me hope that Windows 7 will last quite some time is that there is probably no way the DoD will figure out Windows 8.
Hell, I can't believe they've even gotten up to 7.
Quote from: MadBurgerMaker on June 19, 2012, 11:47:05 PM
Quote from: Tonitrus on June 19, 2012, 07:07:54 PM
If anything gives me hope that Windows 7 will last quite some time is that there is probably no way the DoD will figure out Windows 8.
Hell, I can't believe they've even gotten up to 7.
Not all of it has. :P
I like W7 very much and am not convinced of the Smartphone/tablet interface for desktop use. I'm using a mouse, not touch screen (and my screen is almost two feet away from me).
I will keep watching for any signs of accomodating a more "traditional" or less messy interface. Maybe that'll mean having to wait for Win9.
Win8 design currently kinda reminds me of their failed attempts at accessibility with MS-BOB.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.halobattleguide.com%2Fimages%2Fblog%2Ftech%2FMSBobStudy.JPG&hash=93a9e023a2ac38fd0c0e10fa5400d3c4e5b11588)
Quote from: Tonitrus on June 19, 2012, 04:12:27 PM
It will certainly be interesting, depending on how committed MS is when they launch this turkey, how the market will react.
Would MS backpedal from a Windows-user backlash?
Will Windows users simply adapt?
Or will they just say "well, fuck it, guess I might as well go all-Apple then", and throw the balance all the way to Apple in the PC market as well.
Honestly, if Windows 8 operates as fugly as I think it looks...I will probably cling onto 7 as long as it's supported, and then just go with my third option. I am already somewhat familiar with the Mac interface on my laptop (even though I think Windows 7 is significantly superior). Maybe I am just too old to care to learn tablet-crap for a desktop...and I think it's fine for an iPad-type device, but I need my classic PC. :(
If I do have to go full-Apple, it also sucks that Mac Pro is dwindling away. I blame stupid kids (who lack the desire to tinker with components) these days. :mad:
Win8 is the experiment, and the life-cycle will be like Vista in that respect. They'll extend the Win7 support timeline and Win9 will be the next real release. They know that enterprise users on which they depend (as no large business can use Apple shit in case they need some sort of custom application programmed) have for the large part just switched to 7 after bypassing Vista altogether, and they're not going to change OSes again so soon. Especially since Win8 is so fucked up that it will require a ground-up retraining of absolutely everyone. This is just an attempt to get into the tablet market coupled with a very public beta for Win9.
Personally, I think that Microsoft has miscalculated. Touchscreen doesn't really bring anything to the desktop, and attempting to adopt a more tablet-like interface doesn't make sense in a mature computer interface. And that's the thing: It is mature. They've found a pretty good balance with the Windows concept that they've been tinkering with for 20 years now, and everyone on the planet is now familiar with the concept of how to operate a Windows PC. Why stray from the path?
I'm going to backpedal a bit on my "cover as a keyboard is brilliant!" comment.
The cover as keyboard goes along with a built in kickstand. Which means in the end they expect you to use it on a flat surface. We almost never use the iPad on a flat surface. Instead it is used on the couch, in bed, in the car, or any other time when you're definitely not sitting at a desk.
Quote from: Barrister on June 20, 2012, 09:21:53 AM
I'm going to backpedal a bit on my "cover as a keyboard is brilliant!" comment.
The cover as keyboard goes along with a built in kickstand. Which means in the end they expect you to use it on a flat surface. We almost never use the iPad on a flat surface. Instead it is used on the couch, in bed, in the car, or any other time when you're definitely not sitting at a desk.
I don't see why a removable cover makes it unable to perform as a tablet. That you can use it as conveniently as a laptop when you are at a desk is a plus in my book.
Confirmed, we're getting a win8 tablet for work. That'll be fun. On the plus side our IT department probably won't have it working until late 2013.
Quote from: Barrister on June 20, 2012, 09:21:53 AM
I'm going to backpedal a bit on my "cover as a keyboard is brilliant!" comment.
The cover as keyboard goes along with a built in kickstand. Which means in the end they expect you to use it on a flat surface. We almost never use the iPad on a flat surface. Instead it is used on the couch, in bed, in the car, or any other time when you're definitely not sitting at a desk.
Apparently the cover/keyboard is disabled when you fold it back behind the thing to use as a tablet. You aren't required to use the cover/keyboard and the stand. As Liep says, it's not that it
can't be used as a tablet, it's that it
can be used as a little laptop in addition to being used as a tablet.
I am intrigued by the one that is coming out later with a full version of Windows. I've read that you can disable the stupid "Metro" part of Windows fairly easily, although I'm not sure I would do that on a touchscreen device like this. It isn't so bad on my wife's phone. On a desktop? Metro is never happening.
Quote from: MadBurgerMaker on June 20, 2012, 11:38:48 PMOn a desktop? Metro is never happening.
Agreed.
I have heard that there are certain functions for which metro is required because the desktop itself functions as merely one of many metro apps. That makes you flip in and out between metro and the desktop a lot on a PC. And the start menu is gone. Hopefully, they will give us some settings to re-desktopize it for the PC. In and out of metro does not sound appealing at all.
Quote from: MadImmortalMan on June 21, 2012, 12:14:32 AM
Quote from: MadBurgerMaker on June 20, 2012, 11:38:48 PMOn a desktop? Metro is never happening.
Agreed.
I have heard that there are certain functions for which metro is required because the desktop itself functions as merely one of many metro apps. That makes you flip in and out between metro and the desktop a lot on a PC. And the start menu is gone. Hopefully, they will give us some settings to re-desktopize it for the PC. In and out of metro does not sound appealing at all.
That is true. You need to use metro to start applications, especially if you haven't made a shortcup on the desktop or pin to task bar.
Also, since no one ever mentions it, the red X to close apps(and alt-f4) is GONE!
Quote from: Neil on June 20, 2012, 08:02:59 AM
They know that enterprise users on which they depend (as no large business can use Apple shit in case they need some sort of custom application programmed)
There are many reasons why Apple hardware is unsuitable for large enterprises, but this is not one of them. Most of it is the technical debt in Microsoft-centric enterprise applications, servers, and IT support staffs. MS has been coasting on that debt for at least a decade, but its going to wither away eventually if they don't start doing something interesting or keep putting out piles of shit like Vista.
Quote from: Liep on June 20, 2012, 04:38:55 PM
Confirmed, we're getting a win8 tablet for work. That'll be fun. On the plus side our IT department probably won't have it working until late 2013.
Arent you in public transport, driving trains? It never cease to amaze me the stupid things public and semi public companies pour out on their employees and at the same time fire ten percent or more of the workforce due to cost saving needs :S
V
Quote from: Valdemar on July 03, 2012, 06:23:05 AM
Quote from: Liep on June 20, 2012, 04:38:55 PM
Confirmed, we're getting a win8 tablet for work. That'll be fun. On the plus side our IT department probably won't have it working until late 2013.
Arent you in public transport, driving trains? It never cease to amaze me the stupid things public and semi public companies pour out on their employees and at the same time fire ten percent or more of the workforce due to cost saving needs :S
V
It'll actually bring down costs when we get it. That is, if it works as intended, but as we're seeing with the travel-card it'll be a sure success. :P
Should I get my planned new computer now, just to avoid W8? Will W7 get hard to get as they try to push W8 with every new computer? I was planning on waiting some more.
Quote from: Lucidor on July 03, 2012, 03:24:02 PM
Should I get my planned new computer now, just to avoid W8? Will W7 get hard to get as they try to push W8 with every new computer? I was planning on waiting some more.
Yeah, I'm starting to think the same.
Quote from: Lucidor on July 03, 2012, 03:24:02 PM
Should I get my planned new computer now, just to avoid W8? Will W7 get hard to get as they try to push W8 with every new computer? I was planning on waiting some more.
You have some time, as the planned end of mainstream support for W7 isn't until JAN15. It really depends on how quickly the OEMs pick it up.
Quote from: Liep on July 03, 2012, 08:58:14 AM
It'll actually bring down costs when we get it. That is, if it works as intended, but as we're seeing with the travel-card it'll be a sure success. :P
I never cease to be amased at the excuses in public organsations for fringe benefits for their employees while at the same time griping about how hard they have it... All the public employees I've met have far better phones tablets and laptops than I ever had in private organisations, and with far less work related uses...
My brother in law works in central administration, he has a laptop, an Ipad, a phone and free wifi, and all he actually do on it work related is to check mails... I mean, he is an office worker, he has NO specialised applications, his most powerfull tool is word :D
V
Mind you, we're not going to be allowed to bring these home. Or if we are I'm not going to, taxes and all.
Also, my high tech phone:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fst2.gsmarena.com%2Fvv%2Fbigpic%2Fnokia-6233.gif&hash=add41ed0367b03ca52234ae010a5abbd9652dc37)
Quote from: Baron von Schtinkenbutt on June 21, 2012, 07:45:37 AM
Quote from: Neil on June 20, 2012, 08:02:59 AM
They know that enterprise users on which they depend (as no large business can use Apple shit in case they need some sort of custom application programmed)
There are many reasons why Apple hardware is unsuitable for large enterprises, but this is not one of them. Most of it is the technical debt in Microsoft-centric enterprise applications, servers, and IT support staffs. MS has been coasting on that debt for at least a decade, but its going to wither away eventually if they don't start doing something interesting or keep putting out piles of shit like Vista.
Don't forget Millennium. Howevr, for all that XP was excellent system, so is Windows 7 and windows 2008. Active Directory is great for management and Apple only recently got into the game with stuff like it, and still needs time to grow.
Quote from: Baron von Schtinkenbutt on June 19, 2012, 09:40:24 PM
Quote from: Tonitrus on June 19, 2012, 07:07:54 PM
If anything gives me hope that Windows 7 will last quite some time is that there is probably no way the DoD will figure out Windows 8.
My corner of the DoD hadn't even figured out Windows 7 yet when I left.
My workplace still has Windows XP, since that's what our IT is comfortable with. :XD: I find it funny how my home computer is 10 years and 3 version ahead of my work computer when it comes to operating systems.
Ballmer got excited at the recent shindig in Atlanta and promised every MSFT employee one of these things. All the execs in the front row facepalmed. :lol:
Quote from: MadImmortalMan on July 26, 2012, 02:16:06 PM
Ballmer got excited at the recent shindig in Atlanta and promised every MSFT employee one of these things. All the execs in the front row facepalmed. :lol:
We'll that's one way to ensure a large installed base and sales... :unsure:
Quote from: DGuller on July 26, 2012, 01:57:10 PM
My workplace still has Windows XP, since that's what our IT is comfortable with. :XD: I find it funny how my home computer is 10 years and 3 version ahead of my work computer when it comes to operating systems.
Yeah, so were we. Windows XP + Office 2003. Corporate was almost done with its transition to Windows 7 and Office 2010, though.
Quote from: MadImmortalMan on July 26, 2012, 02:16:06 PM
Ballmer got excited at the recent shindig in Atlanta and promised every MSFT employee one of these things. All the execs in the front row facepalmed. :lol:
That what, a $500 bonus to every employee? Doesn't seem like a big deal to me. In fact, it sounds like an excellent idea.