For a nation that, for whatever reason, finds the shortened version of "Paki" for Pakistanis is OMG RIGHT WOTS ALL THIS RACCISS THEN, one would think you'd have grasped nuance as well by now.
And blaming some ex-pat Teabaggers is just poor form, as I was telling my man Buskers this morning over pudding, not at all very sporting, I must say.
QuoteCollege: Obama effigy burning 'not intentionally racist'
University says 'crassly insensitive' students will send letter of apology to White House
A Conservative party college student association in Britain will send a written apology to Barack Obama after its members burned an effigy of the U.S. president, it was announced Thursday.
Matthew Marshall, the President of the Conservative and Unionist Association at St Andrews University, in Scotland, apologized "unreservedly" for the incident, which took place on a beach last weekend.
A source said a number of the Conservative group's committee members were Americans who support the Republican party.
The University — founded in 1413 and where Prince William and Kate Middleton both studied and met — said the society would be writing to Obama to apologize.
Members of the association burned the effigy after its committee chose the U.S. president over the late Libyan dictator Moammar Gadhafi, a student official told msnbc.com on Wednesday.
The incident took place on a beach in St. Andrews on Friday as part of a tradition by the society that has seen effigies of former U.K. Prime Minister Gordon Brown burned and former South African President Nelson Mandela hung among others.
'Satisfied'
A statement issued by the university on Thursday said: "We are satisfied that while the actions of the St Andrews Conservative Association in burning an effigy of President Obama were naïve and crassly insensitive, they were not intentionally racist."
"This incident however has caused very understandable offence and concern to many people and the University deeply regrets this," it added.
"We have met the President of the Conservative Association to make him aware of the University's very serious concerns and he has been quick to make an unreserved public apology, and it is correct that he has done so," the statement said. "We welcome his assurance that this practice will not be repeated. The Conservative Association is also to write to offer a personal apology to President Obama."
Marshall had earlier said he was sorry the incident had happened.
"President Obama is an important ally to the British government. It was a stupid thing to do and we apologize for any offense caused," he said.
It is unclear who was actually responsible for the burning of the effigy.
If it was hanged in effigy I could see the racism. How often were blacks burned alive?
I suspect a few years back they'd have burnt an effigy of Bill Clinton and we'd never have heard of it. They already did Gorgon Brown and no-one raised an eyebrow.
Mind you, bear in mind they're in Scotland - burning anyone who isn't ginger could probably be construed as racist.
Posh thickoes (or in fact students of any kind) do stupid stuff at University, news at 11.
It's poor form, but so is seeing racism everywhere.
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 24, 2011, 10:36:54 AM
If it was hanged in effigy I could see the racism. How often were blacks burned alive?
Enough.
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Quote from: Peter Wiggin on November 24, 2011, 10:57:33 AM
It's poor form, but so is seeing racism everywhere.
In Georgia you are suppose to politely ignore it.
They used to burn Reagan in effigy over at Lewes Bonfire with monotonous regularity. The Pope as well of course and the Prime Minister.
Quote from: Razgovory on November 24, 2011, 11:00:20 AM
In Georgia you are suppose to politely ignore it.
Politely ignoring people is my m.o. in public. When that doesn't work, I rudely ignore them.
Quote from: Richard Hakluyt on November 24, 2011, 11:02:29 AM
They used to burn Reagan in effigy over at Lewes Bonfire with monotonous regularity. The Pope as well of course and the Prime Minister.
They used to hang the Pope in effigy on Guy Fawkes day in America. Then George Washington told them to stop. So they did. :wub:
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on November 24, 2011, 10:57:33 AM
It's poor form, but so is seeing racism everywhere.
It's a problem with some brands of American. Just like it was unpatriotic to crticize Bush, now it's racist to criticize Obama.
Quote from: Razgovory on November 24, 2011, 10:59:07 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 24, 2011, 10:36:54 AM
If it was hanged in effigy I could see the racism. How often were blacks burned alive?
Enough.
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State rights weren't always pretty, but they worked.
It's idiotic and cretinous beyond belief to find racism in that. There is no history of lynching blacks in the UK, so the symbolism is not there to make it racist (even if he was hanged, rather than burned, in effigy). On the other hand, there is a long traidition of burning/hanging politicial figures in effigy.
The only racists here are the morons who think this, otherwise politically clear, message has a different meaning because Obama is black.
This is retarded. And a clear example of race only being a problem because we make it a problem. You should be free to think a black guy is a dick without having to worry about being called racist for it.
I note it says they burned a Mandella effigy in the past...surely that would be more racist, the guy being actually black? There was no fuss there though....or at least it isn't mentioned.
Quote
For a nation that, for whatever reason, finds the shortened version of "Paki" for Pakistanis is OMG RIGHT WOTS ALL THIS RACCISS THEN, one would think you'd have grasped nuance as well by now.
And this from a nation which finds the term Oriental offensive...
Different countries have different histories and find different terms offensive.
Quote from: Tyr on November 24, 2011, 08:23:40 PM
And this from a nation which finds the term Oriental offensive...
Different countries have different histories and find different terms offensive.
I prefer calling them "celestials".
Quote from: Tyr on November 24, 2011, 08:23:40 PM
Quote
For a nation that, for whatever reason, finds the shortened version of "Paki" for Pakistanis is OMG RIGHT WOTS ALL THIS RACCISS THEN, one would think you'd have grasped nuance as well by now.
And this from a nation which finds the term Oriental offensive...
Seedy is a nation, now? When did that happen?
And when did "Oriental" become something the SeedyNation found offensive? Obsolete when referring to people (as in Oriental versus Occidental), but hardly offensive, except to the highly-PC crowd, who think that "man" and "woman" are offensive.
Quote from: grumbler on November 24, 2011, 08:39:08 PM
Quote from: Tyr on November 24, 2011, 08:23:40 PM
Quote
For a nation that, for whatever reason, finds the shortened version of "Paki" for Pakistanis is OMG RIGHT WOTS ALL THIS RACCISS THEN, one would think you'd have grasped nuance as well by now.
And this from a nation which finds the term Oriental offensive...
Seedy is a nation, now? When did that happen?
And when did "Oriental" become something the SeedyNation found offensive? Obsolete when referring to people (as in Oriental versus Occidental), but hardly offensive, except to the highly-PC crowd, who think that "man" and "woman" are offensive.
Lot's of people do. Saying Oriental at the Uni I work for would result in a trip to the Sensitivity Enforcement Camp.
Quote from: grumbler on November 24, 2011, 08:39:08 PM
Quote from: Tyr on November 24, 2011, 08:23:40 PM
Quote
For a nation that, for whatever reason, finds the shortened version of "Paki" for Pakistanis is OMG RIGHT WOTS ALL THIS RACCISS THEN, one would think you'd have grasped nuance as well by now.
And this from a nation which finds the term Oriental offensive...
Seedy is a nation, now? When did that happen?
And when did "Oriental" become something the SeedyNation found offensive? Obsolete when referring to people (as in Oriental versus Occidental), but hardly offensive, except to the highly-PC crowd, who think that "man" and "woman" are offensive.
In SeedyNation, grumbler would be my SecDef.
Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on November 24, 2011, 08:41:32 PM
Saying Oriental at the Uni I work for would result in a trip to the Sensitivity Enforcement Camp.
What if you did it properly, like in reference to a Turk?
Hopefully in SeedyLand, Geordies would be hunted down like the animals they are.
Quote from: Martinus on November 24, 2011, 01:03:19 PM
It's idiotic and cretinous beyond belief to find racism in that. There is no history of lynching blacks in the UK, so the symbolism is not there to make it racist (even if he was hanged, rather than burned, in effigy). On the other hand, there is a long traidition of burning/hanging politicial figures in effigy.
The only racists here are the morons who think this, otherwise politically clear, message has a different meaning because Obama is black.
QuoteIn Britain, a series of race riots broke out in several cities in 1919 between whites and black sailors. In Liverpool, after a black sailor had been stabbed by two whites in a pub, his friends attacked the pub in revenge. In response, the police raided lodging houses with black occupants, accompanied by an "enraged lynch mob". Charles Wootton, a young black seaman who had not been involved in the attacks, was chased into the river Mersey and drowned after being pelted with missiles thrown by the mob, who chanted "Let him drown!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynching#Europe
Quote from: Martinus on November 24, 2011, 01:03:19 PM
It's idiotic and cretinous beyond belief to find racism in that. There is no history of lynching blacks in the UK, so the symbolism is not there to make it racist (even if he was hanged, rather than burned, in effigy). On the other hand, there is a long traidition of burning/hanging politicial figures in effigy.
The only racists here are the morons who think this, otherwise politically clear, message has a different meaning because Obama is black.
Here's a more complete article. http://www.questia.com/googleScholar.qst?docId=5001241867
Raz, you should know by now not to bother engaging Marti on something like this. Unless the victim has a cock in his mouth or up his ass, it doesn't count.
Being so sensitive to racism is a form of racism.
Real liberated people do not notice skin colour or ethnicity.
Quote from: Richard Hakluyt on November 24, 2011, 11:02:29 AM
They used to burn Reagan in effigy over at Lewes Bonfire with monotonous regularity. The Pope as well of course and the Prime Minister.
Lewes burned effigies of Obama and Alastair Darling a couple of years ago. I think they still do the Pope every year. But then Lewes have habits that probably look quite racist to Americans. For example they walk through the streets with burning crosses to remember the Protestant martyrs. It's a bit like Seville Easter celebrations.
QuoteIt's idiotic and cretinous beyond belief to find racism in that. There is no history of lynching blacks in the UK, so the symbolism is not there to make it racist (even if he was hanged, rather than burned, in effigy). On the other hand, there is a long traidition of burning/hanging politicial figures in effigy.
I'm not sure. I think Raz's link to a site that actually has very few examples a lynch mob in England demonstrates your point. Which isn't to say race riots and racially motivated murders haven't happened often with alarming regularity but lynchings aren't really a major part of Britain's history with race.
However I think hanging the effigy could be a bit different. People know about lynchings in the US and I think would be aware of specific associations involved. Especially given that these guys are at a decent university and I bet about 50% of them are history students, so I don't think they can plead ignorance.
Having said that university Tory groups do seem to attract a certain sort of person. In the 80s they wore 'Hang Nelson Mandela' t-shirts. At my uni the Tory chair had to resign, I think over absurdly sexist and homophobic remarks - though I can't remember what exactly.
I'm not a fan of it myself, I prefer the burning of Guy Fawkes in effigy........that is more or less play-acting nowadays. If you must burn someone's effigy then surely Assad would be a shoo-in right now, rather than the democratically elected US president. On the other hand, most US presidents have been burnt in effigy by some bunch or another in England, if anything it would be racist if Obama got a pass due to his skin colour.
Quote from: Razgovory on November 24, 2011, 11:06:29 AM
Quote from: Richard Hakluyt on November 24, 2011, 11:02:29 AM
They used to burn Reagan in effigy over at Lewes Bonfire with monotonous regularity. The Pope as well of course and the Prime Minister.
They used to hang the Pope in effigy on Guy Fawkes day in America. Then George Washington told them to stop. So they did. :wub:
Source/wiki/whatever?
Quote from: Richard Hakluyt on November 25, 2011, 02:36:04 AM
If you must burn someone's effigy then surely Assad would be a shoo-in right now, rather than the democratically elected US president.
ZOMG, you are such a reactionary!
Quote from: chipwich on November 25, 2011, 03:04:39 AM
Quote from: Razgovory on November 24, 2011, 11:06:29 AM
Quote from: Richard Hakluyt on November 24, 2011, 11:02:29 AM
They used to burn Reagan in effigy over at Lewes Bonfire with monotonous regularity. The Pope as well of course and the Prime Minister.
They used to hang the Pope in effigy on Guy Fawkes day in America. Then George Washington told them to stop. So they did. :wub:
Source/wiki/whatever?
I've been giving sources for hangings all week. Go find it yourself.
Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on November 24, 2011, 08:41:32 PM
Lot's of people do. Saying Oriental at the Uni I work for would result in a trip to the Sensitivity Enforcement Camp.
Yes, I allowed for people like those at "Uni"s in my statement.
Quote from: Richard Hakluyt on November 25, 2011, 02:36:04 AM
If you must burn someone's effigy then surely Assad would be a shoo-in right now, rather than the democratically elected US president. On the other hand, most US presidents have been burnt in effigy by some bunch or another in England, if anything it would be racist if Obama got a pass due to his skin colour.
+1