It's dead Jim! :cry:
http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/11/14/players-vote-to-reject-offer-disband-union-season-likely-doomed/related/
It doesn't surprise me at all. :rolleyes:
When the owners prefer losing money due to lockout rather than overpaid stars, and players are crying over few bucks they'd lose - compared to what they earn; you know the season will be dead for a year or two.
Start over again. draft the college stars, import foreigners, and offer the chance for the the current NBA players to come back. Those who don't will be inellible to play. or if black listing them is illegal then set up a fine system. any time that hires a old player who didn't initially return will be fine 5 times their salary.
Problem solved. Stupid million dollar cry babies
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 14, 2011, 03:05:24 PM
It's dead Jim! :cry:
Good. Bunch of assholes, the whole lot of them. Good riddance. Grab some humility in the off-season and try the fuck again next year.
The players made the mistake of thinking they are the NBA. I dont think that has been true since Magic/Bird/Jordan played. Imo most fans still watch the NBA despite many of the players.
The NBA management learned valuable lessons watching how the NHL handled their dispute. My prediction is that in the end the owners will get a deal they are happy with.
Quote from: HVC on November 14, 2011, 05:24:20 PM
Start over again. draft the college stars, import foreigners, and offer the chance for the the current NBA players to come back. Those who don't will be inellible to play. or if black listing them is illegal then set up a fine system. any time that hires a old player who didn't initially return will be fine 5 times their salary.
Problem solved. Stupid million dollar cry babies
Problem not quite solved; you need to fix the rest. Cut ticket and concession prices by 50% and cap price increases at the SS COLA rate. Cap the total non-player compensation at 50% of the total player salary. Split TV revenues (all sources) 50-50 and give half to the teams, half to charity. Ban all non-team advertising from sports arenas.
Now you could say "Problem solved." Stupid billion dollar cry babies
:yeah:
Thank You, NBA players.
Yea! :)
The season is not dead! It's just resting. :P
AFAIK the players, which I'm surprised to see getting so much vitriol over here, have been more flexible in the negotiations than the owners (which were dominated in the negotiations by a small group hardliners in them), and finally accepted the 50/50 split in revenues that was the main beef of the negotiations, but the owners didn't back down in the restrictions on player movement that they wanted to impose. Even if it's a case of "a pox in both houses", IMO the owners are more to blame for the final breakdown of the negotiations than the players.
Quote from: crazy canuck on November 14, 2011, 06:00:35 PM
The players made the mistake of thinking they are the NBA. I dont think that has been true since Magic/Bird/Jordan played. Imo most fans still watch the NBA despite many of the players.
They may not be watching because of the personalities of the top stars, but the idea that the league is filled with the top players in the world is still the chief draw. College sports are a much better avenue for civic/regional pride.
This just breaks my heart.
Hopefully, some franchises will fold over this.
Quote from: CountDeMoney on November 15, 2011, 07:29:54 AM
This just breaks my heart.
Hopefully, some franchises will fold over this.
Can the league do without the Sacramento Kings or the New Orleans Hornets? :cry:
Quote from: crazy canuck on November 14, 2011, 06:00:35 PM
Imo most fans still watch the NBA despite many of the players.
Then they're being silly, as the worst offenders from the gangsta age are all gone (Iverson, Rasheed Wallace) or in decadence (Arenas). The younger stars are much more clean-cut and non controversial, just look at Kevin Durant for instance. The only one that comes close at the past crop of stars is Carmelo Anthony, and he's behaved lately, besides getting into Reality TV. :p
Incidentally, if the season is cancelled many veteran players like Jason Kidd, Tim Duncan, Kevin Garnett, Ray Allen or Steve Nash might choose to retire, as they were in the last years of their contracts.
I haven't been following, so I don't know or care too much who is more at fault. Too bad though for all the people who work at the stadiums, businesses inside and outside the stadiums who will take a heavy loss.
Quote from: KRonn on November 15, 2011, 08:19:52 AM
I haven't been following, so I don't know or care too much who is more at fault. Too bad though for all the people who work at the stadiums, businesses inside and outside the stadiums who will take a heavy loss.
Those are already getting thrashed, as well as non essential staff from the teams. AFAIK some Lakers players were ponying the cash to pay some of the club employees during the lockout.
There are also some cities (Memphis and possibly Sacramento at least) threatening to sue the teams and the league, as their arenas were built through bonds that are paid with game revenues that are not taking place, letting the cities on the hook for millions.
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on November 15, 2011, 07:26:17 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on November 14, 2011, 06:00:35 PM
The players made the mistake of thinking they are the NBA. I dont think that has been true since Magic/Bird/Jordan played. Imo most fans still watch the NBA despite many of the players.
They may not be watching because of the personalities of the top stars, but the idea that the league is filled with the top players in the world is still the chief draw. College sports are a much better avenue for civic/regional pride.
Imo college basketball is much more entertaining from a pure basketball pov. The NBA puts on a good show - lots of glitz and glamour which is what I think you are getting at. That has less to do with the players than how it is marketed. If anything the current crop of players and quality of play makes the marketing job more difficult compared to the days when all one had to say is the Lakers are playing the Celtics and the basketball being played on the court did the rest.
The other problem the players have is there is no other league around that will pay anything close to this and there are lot of baskeball players in the US and the rest of the world who would be willing to play for what these players turned down.
As Larch observed a lot of the big names will be leaving soon anyway. The owners have a lot less to lose here than the players. If one wishes to point at blame then one could easily point out that the players badly overplayed their hand this round.
Quote from: crazy canuck on November 15, 2011, 01:54:47 PM
The NBA puts on a good show - lots of glitz and glamour which is what I think you are getting at.
That's not at all what I was getting at. The same thing happens across all sports, regardless of how glitzy the end product- "major" leagues get millions of people watching games on television or paying good money for seats, while "minor" leagues filled with players not quite as good scrape by on a small fraction of the revenue. Fans don't want to watch players who are merely "pretty good" at their sport. So if the NBA owners decided they don't need the players, they can just find new ones... well, they have plenty to lose themselves. Even if they don't quite open the door for a rival league to spring up.
Honest question. What does the average player get paid? Are they all paid millions of dollars? I have no idea. To be honest, I feel sorry for the average guys who work at the stadiums. Concession stand guys, guards, electricians, etc.
Average salary is ~5 million. I'm sure the median is quite a bit lower.
Also note there are 450 roster spots in the NBA, compared to ~1700 in the NFL and about 750 in MLB.
Bummer, I had made a resolution last year to bandwagon on to the Celtics this season since the 76ers suck and I had no particular Knicks affinity growing up. :(
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on November 15, 2011, 10:29:06 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on November 15, 2011, 01:54:47 PM
The NBA puts on a good show - lots of glitz and glamour which is what I think you are getting at.
That's not at all what I was getting at. The same thing happens across all sports, regardless of how glitzy the end product- "major" leagues get millions of people watching games on television or paying good money for seats, while "minor" leagues filled with players not quite as good scrape by on a small fraction of the revenue. Fans don't want to watch players who are merely "pretty good" at their sport. So if the NBA owners decided they don't need the players, they can just find new ones... well, they have plenty to lose themselves. Even if they don't quite open the door for a rival league to spring up.
Do you know how many people watch college basketball/football?
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on November 15, 2011, 11:26:58 PM
Bummer, I had made a resolution last year to bandwagon on to the Celtics this season since the 76ers suck and I had no particular Knicks affinity growing up. :(
Though I did get the autographs of John Starks and Herb Williams at some point in the mid-90s. :w00t:
Quote from: crazy canuck on November 15, 2011, 11:40:10 PM
Do you know how many people watch college basketball/football?
People watching college sports typically have a more personal emotional involvement with the outcome. Or they're junkies and there's no pro games on at that moment(especially true for football as they play most of the games on set days).
Quote from: crazy canuck on November 15, 2011, 01:54:47 PM
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on November 15, 2011, 07:26:17 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on November 14, 2011, 06:00:35 PM
The players made the mistake of thinking they are the NBA. I dont think that has been true since Magic/Bird/Jordan played. Imo most fans still watch the NBA despite many of the players.
They may not be watching because of the personalities of the top stars, but the idea that the league is filled with the top players in the world is still the chief draw. College sports are a much better avenue for civic/regional pride.
Imo college basketball is much more entertaining from a pure basketball pov. The NBA puts on a good show - lots of glitz and glamour which is what I think you are getting at. That has less to do with the players than how it is marketed. If anything the current crop of players and quality of play makes the marketing job more difficult compared to the days when all one had to say is the Lakers are playing the Celtics and the basketball being played on the court did the rest.
The other problem the players have is there is no other league around that will pay anything close to this and there are lot of baskeball players in the US and the rest of the world who would be willing to play for what these players turned down.
As Larch observed a lot of the big names will be leaving soon anyway. The owners have a lot less to lose here than the players. If one wishes to point at blame then one could easily point out that the players badly overplayed their hand this round.
To a certain extent, the players
are the league, but the players probably overestimate the extent to which that's true. Fans tend to be fans of a team, not an individual player, at least in the long term. Lakers fans didn't, in the main, cease to be Lakers fans when Mikan retired, or West, or Kareem, or Magic, or when Shaq got traded, and they won't when Bryant retires.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on November 15, 2011, 11:42:50 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on November 15, 2011, 11:26:58 PM
Bummer, I had made a resolution last year to bandwagon on to the Celtics this season since the 76ers suck and I had no particular Knicks affinity growing up. :(
Though I did get the autographs of John Starks and Herb Williams at some point in the mid-90s. :w00t:
Starks? :w00t:
Quote from: sbr on November 15, 2011, 11:02:32 PM
Average salary is ~5 million. I'm sure the median is quite a bit lower.
Also note there are 450 roster spots in the NBA, compared to ~1700 in the NFL and about 750 in MLB.
The MLB number depends on whether or not you add the farming system, too, no?
Quote from: HVC on November 14, 2011, 05:24:20 PM
Start over again. draft the college stars, import foreigners, and offer the chance for the the current NBA players to come back. Those who don't will be inellible to play. or if black listing them is illegal then set up a fine system. any time that hires a old player who didn't initially return will be fine 5 times their salary.
Problem solved. Stupid million dollar cry babies
Before they get off the ground, the players form an alternative league; they hold their own draft, and while they are at it sue the NBA for all sorts of antitrust kind of violations.
The league's position is less secure than you think.
Quote from: Ed Anger on November 16, 2011, 08:43:54 AM
Starks? :w00t:
He built his house with brick to save energy costs during the long winter to come. :homestar:
Is it just me, or does the tactic that professional sports unions have apparantly adopted of disolving when they don't get what they want in negotiations seem a bit, well, I'm not sure if dishonest is the right word exactly. I mean, the unions seem to be saying, "well, there's no union anymore, nudge-nudge wink-wink, so individual players can now sue the league, but if the owners want to sign a deal that we're willing to agree to, well certainly the union leadership is still here to negotiate the details with them".
Quote from: sbr on November 15, 2011, 11:02:32 PM
Average salary is ~5 million. I'm sure the median is quite a bit lower.
Also note there are 450 roster spots in the NBA, compared to ~1700 in the NFL and about 750 in MLB.
I looked it up. The median is lower. Using the Miami Heat as an example the majority make more then a million. http://hoopshype.com/salaries/miami.htm Maybe the top three guys should give some of their salary to the bottom three. You know, if they really care that much for their fellow players. Still, 300,000 isn't something to sniff at.
Quote from: Razgovory on November 16, 2011, 10:51:28 AM
Quote from: sbr on November 15, 2011, 11:02:32 PM
Average salary is ~5 million. I'm sure the median is quite a bit lower.
Also note there are 450 roster spots in the NBA, compared to ~1700 in the NFL and about 750 in MLB.
I looked it up. The median is lower. Using the Miami Heat as an example the majority make more then a million. http://hoopshype.com/salaries/miami.htm Maybe the top three guys should give some of their salary to the bottom three. You know, if they really care that much for their fellow players. Still, 300,000 isn't something to sniff at.
I don't think that the Heat are the best example, as the Big Three eat up almost all their payroll and they have lots of guys making very little by NBA standards.
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on November 16, 2011, 12:30:23 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on November 15, 2011, 11:40:10 PM
Do you know how many people watch college basketball/football?
People watching college sports typically have a more personal emotional involvement with the outcome. Or they're junkies and there's no pro games on at that moment(especially true for football as they play most of the games on set days).
:lol:
People who watch college are merely homers or junkies with nothing better to do? That is not my experience but maybe that is how it is in the US.
But your low opinion of people who watch college sports aside - do you really think the NBA plays a better game and by better I mean all the intangeables that go into why someone might want to actually watch the game.
Quote from: dps on November 16, 2011, 10:43:21 AM
Is it just me, or does the tactic that professional sports unions have apparantly adopted of disolving when they don't get what they want in negotiations seem a bit, well, I'm not sure if dishonest is the right word exactly. I mean, the unions seem to be saying, "well, there's no union anymore, nudge-nudge wink-wink, so individual players can now sue the league, but if the owners want to sign a deal that we're willing to agree to, well certainly the union leadership is still here to negotiate the details with them".
If it's a legal strategy I can't fault them for using it. If they think that it can help them, why wouldn't they do it. Whether it will really work remains to be seen however.
I think the NFL union failed because the courts ruled that they didn't negotiate in good faith. I don't think the NBA will have that problem since they made a lot concessions during the negotiations. They still could be ruled against for other reasons though.
Not drug junkies...
I haven't paid much attention to basketball in years. But I will watch the occasional NBA finals game. I never watch the Final Four(unless by some miracle Georgia got in it).
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on November 16, 2011, 12:43:23 PM
Not drug junkies...
I haven't paid much attention to basketball in years. But I will watch the occasional NBA finals game. I never watch the Final Four(unless by some miracle Georgia got in it).
Yeah, I knew you were talking about sport junkies.
But I know lots of people who like watching basketball who would much rather watch a good college matchup then any NBA game. And certainly all basketball fans around here watch march madness.
If you dont watch the final four then you are probably not the most representative US basketball fan.
I like the NBA more than College.
Quote from: crazy canuck on November 16, 2011, 01:01:15 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 16, 2011, 12:59:49 PM
I like the NBA more than College.
I rest my case.
New England is a pro sports region. College sports just aren't that popular here.
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 16, 2011, 01:05:01 PM
New England is a pro sports region. College sports just aren't that popular here.
UCONN is wasted on you bastards.
Quote from: Syt on November 16, 2011, 08:53:58 AM
Quote from: sbr on November 15, 2011, 11:02:32 PM
Average salary is ~5 million. I'm sure the median is quite a bit lower.
Also note there are 450 roster spots in the NBA, compared to ~1700 in the NFL and about 750 in MLB.
The MLB number depends on whether or not you add the farming system, too, no?
I was just counting the major league roster spots. There will be a few highly paid players in the minors but the majority don't make sure (relatively). My main point is that the NBA pie is split into much larger pieces. The average NFL salary is under $2 million, less than half of the NBA but the NFL has 4 times as many players to get a cut of the pie.
Quote from: Valmy on November 16, 2011, 03:30:36 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 16, 2011, 01:05:01 PM
New England is a pro sports region. College sports just aren't that popular here.
UCONN is wasted on you bastards.
True -_-
Quote from: Valmy on November 16, 2011, 03:30:36 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 16, 2011, 01:05:01 PM
New England is a pro sports region. College sports just aren't that popular here.
UCONN is wasted on you bastards.
Do you think tim is representative of the whole area?
Quote from: crazy canuck on November 16, 2011, 08:52:33 PM
Quote from: Valmy on November 16, 2011, 03:30:36 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 16, 2011, 01:05:01 PM
New England is a pro sports region. College sports just aren't that popular here.
UCONN is wasted on you bastards.
Do you think tim is representative of the whole area?
New England is very well known as a bastion of pro-sports. I've heard plenty of commenters mention it so you don't have to trust me. Talk sports with a New Englander and they'll all name the big 4 pro teams first before moving down to a college one. Same if they're from NYC, it's a Northeastern thing in general.
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 17, 2011, 12:14:00 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on November 16, 2011, 08:52:33 PM
Quote from: Valmy on November 16, 2011, 03:30:36 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 16, 2011, 01:05:01 PM
New England is a pro sports region. College sports just aren't that popular here.
UCONN is wasted on you bastards.
Do you think tim is representative of the whole area?
New England is very well known as a bastion of pro-sports. I've heard plenty of commenters mention it so you don't have to trust me. Talk sports with a New Englander and they'll all name the big 4 pro teams first before moving down to a college one. Same if they're from NYC, it's a Northeastern thing in general.
Since you are the one telling me, even though you have said I dont have to trust you, dont I have to trust that what you are saying now is accurate?
Tim is right.
UConn basketball maybe, but only in Connecticut. And only because 1) There is nothing else interesting about Connecticut, 2) There are no pro teams there since the Whalers left, and 3) The state is split into NY and Boston fanbases.
From what I could tell, hardly anybody in Philadelphia even gave a shit about Penn State athletics, for instance.
The only exceptions in general are people who went to or whose father went to a big sports college. And they are pretty much on their own, though I think there are a few bars in New York that cater to the bigger constituencies.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on November 17, 2011, 01:13:53 PM
The only exceptions in general are people who went to or whose father went to a big sports college. And they are pretty much on their own, though I think there are a few bars in New York that cater to the bigger constituencies.
There are bars in New York dedicated to most BCS schools. Saw a story about that on GameDay.
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on November 17, 2011, 01:29:21 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on November 17, 2011, 01:13:53 PM
The only exceptions in general are people who went to or whose father went to a big sports college. And they are pretty much on their own, though I think there are a few bars in New York that cater to the bigger constituencies.
There are bars in New York dedicated to most BCS schools. Saw a story about that on GameDay.
And they only exist because lots of people in NY come from all over the place.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on November 17, 2011, 01:39:11 PM
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on November 17, 2011, 01:29:21 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on November 17, 2011, 01:13:53 PM
The only exceptions in general are people who went to or whose father went to a big sports college. And they are pretty much on their own, though I think there are a few bars in New York that cater to the bigger constituencies.
There are bars in New York dedicated to most BCS schools. Saw a story about that on GameDay.
And they only exist because lots of people in NY come from all over the place.
Ok you lost me. Tim is right except for the fact that people come from all over to live in NY and so he is wrong?
Quote from: crazy canuck on November 17, 2011, 01:40:28 PM
Ok you lost me. Tim is right except for the fact that people come from all over to live in NY and so he is wrong?
NYC is full of Midwestern transplants. I mentioned a couple of other exceptions.
I'm just giving my general impressions having lived in the Northeastern US my whole life, I'm not much of a sports fan and might be misjudging people's affinities.
It seems to me that the Big East schools have a lot of support and get a lot of TV coverage. I see a lot of them out here. So it can't just be a few people sitting around some bars in NY that are watching.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on November 17, 2011, 01:13:53 PM
UConn basketball maybe, but only in Connecticut. And only because 1) There is nothing else interesting about Connecticut, 2) There are no pro teams there since the Whalers left, and 3) The state is split into NY and Boston fanbases.
I always find it amusing when Northeasterners describe Connecticut as hicksville. I mean it is like 20 minutes to many major urban areas in virtually every direction.
The strip along the coast until New Haven and heading north to Hartford is fairly urban, but the interior is seriously rural. The north/south hills with a few main roads running east/west mean there's a lot of little towns all over the place surrounded by not much.
Quote from: frunk on November 17, 2011, 02:03:16 PM
The strip along the coast until New Haven and heading north to Hartford is fairly urban, but the interior is seriously rural. The north/south hills with a few main roads running east/west mean there's a lot of little towns all over the place surrounded by not much.
Connecticut is way too small to really be that rural. Suburban maybe.
Quote from: crazy canuck on November 17, 2011, 01:53:04 PM
It seems to me that the Big East schools have a lot of support and get a lot of TV coverage. I see a lot of them out here. So it can't just be a few people sitting around some bars in NY that are watching.
Keep in mind that New York state is not part of New England. Once you get in to New England proper, about the only team with any success is Yukon.
I've always wondered about the demographic at UConn. What kind of person lives in Connecticut, sends their kid(s) to college, but doesn't have money for a private school?
Quote from: Admiral Yi on November 17, 2011, 02:11:37 PM
Keep in mind that New York state is not part of New England. Once you get in to New England proper, about the only team with any success is Yukon.
I wasn't even counting upstate NY or central PA as part of the Northeast for these purposes.
Quote
I've always wondered about the demographic at UConn. What kind of person lives in Connecticut, sends their kid(s) to college, but doesn't have money for a private school?
The state's not totally comprised of WASP gated communities and Puerto Rican ghettos...
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on November 17, 2011, 02:18:03 PM
The state's not totally comprised of WASP gated communities and Puerto Rican ghettos...
Sure, it has immigrant Indian financial engineers too.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on November 17, 2011, 02:19:47 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on November 17, 2011, 02:18:03 PM
The state's not totally comprised of WASP gated communities and Puerto Rican ghettos...
Sure, it has immigrant Indian financial engineers too.
And factory workers, mechanics, managers at big box stores, construction foremen, etc.
Quote from: Valmy on November 17, 2011, 02:08:43 PM
Connecticut is way too small to really be that rural. Suburban maybe.
And yet it is.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fnercrd.psu.edu%2Fland_use%2Fmaps%2Fimages%2FLandUseMapCT.jpg&hash=54b60cff761155a2232b214d7bea02920d3b1137)
Quote from: crazy canuck on November 17, 2011, 01:53:04 PM
It seems to me that the Big East schools have a lot of support and get a lot of TV coverage. I see a lot of them out here. So it can't just be a few people sitting around some bars in NY that are watching.
The population of Eastern cities are big enough that only a small percentage have to care about a college to move ratings. The fandoms can't compare to the ones for the pro teams though.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on November 17, 2011, 02:18:03 PM
The state's not totally comprised of WASP gated communities and Puerto Rican ghettos...
Don't talk smack about my cousins. :mad:
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 17, 2011, 04:00:25 PM
Don't talk smack about my cousins. :mad:
You have cousins with money?
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 17, 2011, 04:00:25 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on November 17, 2011, 02:18:03 PM
The state's not totally comprised of WASP gated communities and Puerto Rican ghettos...
Don't talk smack about my cousins. :mad:
:huh: Conn. has the highest Puerto Rican percentage of state population in the country, so obviously Nutmegger Puerto Ricans do all sorts of things, I'd never demean an ethnicity, etc. But cruise around Bridgeport, New Haven, Hartford, Waterbury enough and you will see areas that are clearly Puerto Rican ghettos.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on November 18, 2011, 02:25:51 AM
:huh: Conn. has the highest Puerto Rican percentage of state population in the country
I hope that changes soon.
Quote from: frunk on November 17, 2011, 02:25:01 PM
And yet it is.
Yeah are there any states out there that are wall to wall city? I mean New Jersey also has forests between its urban sprawl.
Quote from: Valmy on November 18, 2011, 09:22:51 AM
Yeah are there any states out there that are wall to wall city? I mean New Jersey also has forests between its urban sprawl.
New Jersey is much more heavily developed, both with population and agriculture. It doesn't have nearly as much undeveloped land.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fnercrd.psu.edu%2Fland_use%2Fmaps%2Fimages%2FLandUseMapNJ.jpg&hash=7243931fe3f4395f07dfe0994ec99b85cec6d597)
:hmm: I expected more red on this map
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fnercrd.psu.edu%2Fland_use%2Fmaps%2Fimages%2FLandUseMapRI.jpg&hash=daf05a36f36c6e1bfecf114f41f6b0578983b63c)
Quote from: Valmy on November 18, 2011, 09:22:51 AM
Quote from: frunk on November 17, 2011, 02:25:01 PM
And yet it is.
Yeah are there any states out there that are wall to wall city? I mean New Jersey also has forests between its urban sprawl.
All that green in CT and RI is "Swamp Yankee" territory... :ph34r:
Quote from: frunk on November 18, 2011, 11:01:28 AM
Quote from: Valmy on November 18, 2011, 09:22:51 AM
Yeah are there any states out there that are wall to wall city? I mean New Jersey also has forests between its urban sprawl.
New Jersey is much more heavily developed, both with population and agriculture. It doesn't have nearly as much undeveloped land.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fnercrd.psu.edu%2Fland_use%2Fmaps%2Fimages%2FLandUseMapNJ.jpg&hash=7243931fe3f4395f07dfe0994ec99b85cec6d597)
And yet it's still around 50% forested. I think every other state is higher than that in the percentage of forest, except some of the plains states with are mostly grasslands that have never been forested in historical times, and Alaska, which has a lot of area that are too cold to be forested. Though all that could be data that's no longer current.
Quote from: dps on November 18, 2011, 07:30:58 PM
Quote from: frunk on November 18, 2011, 11:01:28 AM
Quote from: Valmy on November 18, 2011, 09:22:51 AM
Yeah are there any states out there that are wall to wall city? I mean New Jersey also has forests between its urban sprawl.
New Jersey is much more heavily developed, both with population and agriculture. It doesn't have nearly as much undeveloped land.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fnercrd.psu.edu%2Fland_use%2Fmaps%2Fimages%2FLandUseMapNJ.jpg&hash=7243931fe3f4395f07dfe0994ec99b85cec6d597)
And yet it's still around 50% forested. I think every other state is higher than that in the percentage of forest, except some of the plains states with are mostly grasslands that have never been forested in historical times, and Alaska, which has a lot of area that is too cold to be forested. Though all that could be data that's no longer current.
It was not dead, it was just resting!
QuoteNBA owners, players reach tentative deal
NEW YORK (AP)—After nearly two years of bickering, NBA players and owners are back on the same side.
"We want to play basketball," Commissioner David Stern said.
Come Christmas Day, they should be.
The sides reached a tentative agreement early Saturday to end the 149-day lockout and hope to begin the delayed season with a marquee tripleheader Dec. 25. Most of a season that seemed in jeopardy of being lost entirely will be salvaged if both sides approve the handshake deal.
Barring a change in scheduling, the 2011-12 season will open with the Boston Celtics at New York Knicks, followed by Miami at Dallas in an NBA finals rematch before MVP Derrick Rose(notes) and Chicago visiting Kobe Bryant(notes) and the Lakers.
Neither side provided many specifics about the deal, and there are still legal hurdles that must be cleared before gymnasiums are open again.
I'm so happy to be wrong! :)
Fuck Danny Ainge and Paul Pierce.
:) Great, my plan to bandwagon on Timmy's bandwagon can still be implemented. GO CELTICS!!! :showoff:
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on November 26, 2011, 06:08:15 PM
:) Great, my plan to bandwagon on Timmy's bandwagon can still be implemented. GO CELTICS!!! :showoff:
They're quite old for an NBA team, so I'm not that hopeful of us getting past the 2nd round of the playoffs, especially with the condensed season, but I'm glad to have you aboard. :)
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 26, 2011, 11:37:45 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on November 26, 2011, 06:08:15 PM
:) Great, my plan to bandwagon on Timmy's bandwagon can still be implemented. GO CELTICS!!! :showoff:
They're quite old for an NBA team, so I'm not that hopeful of us getting past the 2nd round of the playoffs, especially with the condensed season, but I'm glad to have you aboard. :)
Actually, I think that a shorter season will suit the older players better, as they'll arrive at the playoffs with many less miles on their aging legs than in a normal season.
The Celtics are also bitches, and have been ever since Bird retired.
:weep: :weep:
No :( :(
Dang I thought I finally found a sure way to deny the Lakers the 2012 championship. Ah well now I have to wait to see if an actual NBA team can stop them.
Quote from: Valmy on November 28, 2011, 10:33:10 AM
Dang I thought I finally found a sure way to deny the Lakers the 2012 championship. Ah well now I have to wait to see if an actual NBA team can stop them.
No faith in your Mavericks?
Too bad. I enjoyed not having to go out of my way to ignore basketball. :(
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 28, 2011, 11:04:13 AM
No faith in your Mavericks?
Generally in the NBA I am am an anti-fan. I root against the Lakers plus whoever else seems particularly loathsome, like the Heat.
The team I was a fan of ceased to exist in 1997. Though I do have a soft spot for the Spurs.
Quote from: Valmy on November 28, 2011, 11:09:24 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 28, 2011, 11:04:13 AM
No faith in your Mavericks?
Generally in the NBA I am am an anti-fan. I root against the Lakers plus whoever else seems particularly loathsome, like the Heat.
The team I was a fan of ceased to exist in 1997. Though I do have a soft spot for the Spurs.
Who? :hmm:
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 28, 2011, 11:14:52 AM
Who? :hmm:
A team brutally murdered in the name of political correctness. Knowing the other pro teams I root for it shouldn't be too hard to puzzle it out.
Quote from: Valmy on November 28, 2011, 11:18:00 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 28, 2011, 11:14:52 AM
Who? :hmm:
A team brutally murdered in the name of political correctness. Knowing the other pro teams I root for it shouldn't be too hard to puzzle it out.
The name changed but the team didn't. Don't be such a wuss, get up and rub some dirt on it! :angry:
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 28, 2011, 11:26:29 AM
The name changed but the team didn't. Don't be such a wuss, get up and rub some dirt on it! :angry:
"Wizards" is a
super lame name, especially coming from something like the "Bullets."
What's with you & Washington based team?
Quote from: jimmy olsen on November 28, 2011, 11:26:29 AM
The name changed but the team didn't. Don't be such a wuss, get up and rub some dirt on it! :angry:
Um everything about the team changed except the city it was located in. I mean the only cool thing about Bullets was their name, colors, and the glorious legacy of Wes Unseld and Elvin Hayes. That was all thrown on the garbage heap. Screw that crap. The team is dead to me. But to be fair they have been pretty dead in general since then despite the Michael Jordan black comedy they put on.
Quote from: Grey Fox on November 28, 2011, 11:33:24 AM
What's with you & Washington based team?
My family lived in that area from 1695 until 1969. It is my father he raised me to be a Washington fan. The Orioles thing I did myself though.
Quote from: MadBurgerMaker on November 28, 2011, 11:30:54 AM
"Wizards" is a super lame name, especially coming from something like the "Bullets."
Not to mention changing the colors to their weird teal and gold shit.
Quote from: Valmy on November 28, 2011, 11:35:58 AM
Quote from: Grey Fox on November 28, 2011, 11:33:24 AM
What's with you & Washington based team?
My family lived in that area from 1695 until 1969. It is my father he raised me to be a Washington fan. The Orioles thing I did myself though.
4 years before you were born? Dude, move on. Embrace Texas.
Quote from: Grey Fox on November 28, 2011, 11:41:05 AM
4 years before you were born? Dude, move on. Embrace Texas.
Eight years. I have embraced Texas. But not Dallas and Houston. Have you never heard of civic rivalry? I am an Austin guy. I would sooner root for the Gypsy Nazi team before I would root for a Dallas or Houston team.
That's crazy if your city doesn't also have a team in a given sport.
Quote from: Grey Fox on November 28, 2011, 11:52:25 AM
That's crazy if your city doesn't also have a team in a given sport.
Why? I have spent about a 100 days in DC for every day in my life I have ever been in Dallas or Houston. I know about 50 people in DC for every 1 I know in Dallas or Houston. Why do I need to be loyal to those places just because they are closer?
Quote from: Valmy on November 28, 2011, 11:54:22 AM
Quote from: Grey Fox on November 28, 2011, 11:52:25 AM
That's crazy if your city doesn't also have a team in a given sport.
Why? I have spent about a 100 days in DC for every day in my life I have ever been in Dallas or Houston. I know about 50 people in DC for every 1 I know in Dallas or Houston. Why do I need to be loyal to those places just because they are closer?
Because then you don't have to buy the out of market package to watch them play?
I don't know. I guess it's the same thing here with NFL team. Pick one, it doesn't really matter which one you like.
Quote from: Barrister on November 28, 2011, 11:05:39 AM
Too bad. I enjoyed not having to go out of my way to ignore basketball. :(
Your current residence is out of the way enough already.
Lol, fuck you Lakers!
After that first, automatic vindictive reaction though, I've got to agree with this guy. This was a foolish move by Stern.
http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/12/08/league-finds-way-to-make-bad-pr-situation-worse-by-killing-trade