Languish.org

My vote:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmydisguises.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2009%2F12%2Fhank-the-bat-venture.jpg&hash=09926984119cb5b4bb76a847fe31137ab01d57db)

Well Batman is certainly a contender.  He has by far the strongest rogue's gallery in DC.  Villains like Catwoman, Ras Al-Ghul, Penguin, Riddler, Poison Ivy and Two-Face are all good characters that have received development and love from their storytellers, and the Joker is a fucking institution to a degree that only Lex Luthor or Magneto comes close to.

If somebody was going to beat Batman, it would have to be either Spiderman (Green Goblin, Electro, Rhino, Venom, Hobgoblin, Doctor Octopus, Kraven and Sandman) or the X-Men (Magneto, Apocalypse, Dark Phoenix, Mr. Sinister, Sabretooth, Mystique, the Sentinels, the Hellfire Club).  Green Lantern (Parallax, Sinestro, Star Sapphire, the Manhunters, the Qwardians, Dr. Polaris) and the Fantastic Four (Dr. Doom, Namor, Maximus, Psycho Man, Mole Man, the Wizard, the Mad Thinker) are probably a step down from there, and Captain America a step below that provided that you give him all the old Nazi groups, Stucker, Zemo and Red Skull.  Iron Man has an incredibly weak rogue's gallery in his own right (the Mandarin and a bunch of retards in armour), but he does alright as an Avenger.  Superman sucks in this regard because he's hard to challenge and you end up devaluing a character who should be a total monster of a world-beater like General Zod or Doomsday.  He's got Lex Luthor and then a bunch of scrubs.  Wonder Woman is pretty awful, because although Cheetah is kinda cool and Circe isn't bad, she's got a million goofs like the Silver Swan.

Quote from: Neil on September 24, 2011, 08:23:20 AM
Well Batman is certainly a contender.  He has by far the strongest rogue's gallery in DC.  Villains like Catwoman, Ras Al-Ghul, Penguin, Riddler, Poison Ivy and Two-Face are all good characters that have received development and love from their storytellers, and the Joker is a fucking institution to a degree that only Lex Luthor or Magneto comes close to.

If somebody was going to beat Batman, it would have to be either Spiderman (Green Goblin, Electro, Rhino, Venom, Hobgoblin, Doctor Octopus, Kraven and Sandman) or the X-Men (Magneto, Apocalypse, Dark Phoenix, Mr. Sinister, Sabretooth, Mystique, the Sentinels, the Hellfire Club).  Green Lantern (Parallax, Sinestro, Star Sapphire, the Manhunters, the Qwardians, Dr. Polaris) and the Fantastic Four (Dr. Doom, Namor, Maximus, Psycho Man, Mole Man, the Wizard, the Mad Thinker) are probably a step down from there, and Captain America a step below that provided that you give him all the old Nazi groups, Stucker, Zemo and Red Skull.  Iron Man has an incredibly weak rogue's gallery in his own right (the Mandarin and a bunch of retards in armour), but he does alright as an Avenger.  Superman sucks in this regard because he's hard to challenge and you end up devaluing a character who should be a total monster of a world-beater like General Zod or Doomsday.  He's got Lex Luthor and then a bunch of scrubs.  Wonder Woman is pretty awful, because although Cheetah is kinda cool and Circe isn't bad, she's got a million goofs like the Silver Swan.

:nerd:

X-Men, if only because the bad guys often aren't evil, only have severe differences of opinion with the good guys.

Neil's right about Wonder Woman's villains.  I mean, I like Giganta and Dr. Psycho alright, but they're all pretty B-list.  Maybe Ares, I guess.

The Flash has an outstanding rogue's gallery, from literal antithesis Eobard Thawne to a loser like Heatwave, who is basically an idiot with a flamethrower.  At the same time, they're often poorly handled, because Geoff Johns has pretty much defined the Flash for a decade and doesn't write very well.  He does a good Captain Cold, though, who's actually one of my favorite villains.

I'd actually probably say Superman.  He doesn't have enough really good enemies, but between Lex Luthor and Brainiac, he has the best; also, you can include Legion of Super-Heroes enemies if you want.  I also like the Cyborg, even if his origin is sort of lazy and he can come off as whiny and sometimes undermotivated.  Doomsday himself is also a really good antagonist, but truly could only be used effectively once, so all his appearances subsequent to The Death of Superman actually undermine the quality of Supes' rogues gallery.

The point is, though, that Lex Luthor is worth a thousand Jokers.  Luthor, especially after John Byrne redefined him, never really got old, and in a good writer's hands, like Grant Morrison or Paul Cornell, is endlessly entertaining; the Joker got old a long, long time ago, and even a good writer has trouble saving him from being boring (if not outright unbelievable, e.g. The Dark Knight).  Batman's villains suffer from almost unanimously having severe mental disorders, which tend to limit their personalities to pretty narrow confines.  The exception is Ra's and Talia, but they've been badly handled for years too.

However, if you cast the net on Batman's rogues gallery wide enough to include Catman and Deadshot, I guess he might win by technicality, at least in the DC universe.

I'd also like to mention Adam Warlock, though: if you've got Thanos and the Magus, I don't see how anyone could beat that.

Quote from: Martinus on September 24, 2011, 08:37:22 AM

Quote from: Neil on September 24, 2011, 08:23:20 AM
Well Batman is certainly a contender.  He has by far the strongest rogue's gallery in DC.  Villains like Catwoman, Ras Al-Ghul, Penguin, Riddler, Poison Ivy and Two-Face are all good characters that have received development and love from their storytellers, and the Joker is a fucking institution to a degree that only Lex Luthor or Magneto comes close to.

If somebody was going to beat Batman, it would have to be either Spiderman (Green Goblin, Electro, Rhino, Venom, Hobgoblin, Doctor Octopus, Kraven and Sandman) or the X-Men (Magneto, Apocalypse, Dark Phoenix, Mr. Sinister, Sabretooth, Mystique, the Sentinels, the Hellfire Club).  Green Lantern (Parallax, Sinestro, Star Sapphire, the Manhunters, the Qwardians, Dr. Polaris) and the Fantastic Four (Dr. Doom, Namor, Maximus, Psycho Man, Mole Man, the Wizard, the Mad Thinker) are probably a step down from there, and Captain America a step below that provided that you give him all the old Nazi groups, Stucker, Zemo and Red Skull.  Iron Man has an incredibly weak rogue's gallery in his own right (the Mandarin and a bunch of retards in armour), but he does alright as an Avenger.  Superman sucks in this regard because he's hard to challenge and you end up devaluing a character who should be a total monster of a world-beater like General Zod or Doomsday.  He's got Lex Luthor and then a bunch of scrubs.  Wonder Woman is pretty awful, because although Cheetah is kinda cool and Circe isn't bad, she's got a million goofs like the Silver Swan.

:nerd:

No shit. Posts like these consistently reinforce the notion that Neil is, in reality, nothing more than Comic Book Store Guy from The Simpsons.

Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 24, 2011, 09:44:42 AM

Quote from: Martinus on September 24, 2011, 08:37:22 AM

Quote from: Neil on September 24, 2011, 08:23:20 AM
Well Batman is certainly a contender.  He has by far the strongest rogue's gallery in DC.  Villains like Catwoman, Ras Al-Ghul, Penguin, Riddler, Poison Ivy and Two-Face are all good characters that have received development and love from their storytellers, and the Joker is a fucking institution to a degree that only Lex Luthor or Magneto comes close to.

If somebody was going to beat Batman, it would have to be either Spiderman (Green Goblin, Electro, Rhino, Venom, Hobgoblin, Doctor Octopus, Kraven and Sandman) or the X-Men (Magneto, Apocalypse, Dark Phoenix, Mr. Sinister, Sabretooth, Mystique, the Sentinels, the Hellfire Club).  Green Lantern (Parallax, Sinestro, Star Sapphire, the Manhunters, the Qwardians, Dr. Polaris) and the Fantastic Four (Dr. Doom, Namor, Maximus, Psycho Man, Mole Man, the Wizard, the Mad Thinker) are probably a step down from there, and Captain America a step below that provided that you give him all the old Nazi groups, Stucker, Zemo and Red Skull.  Iron Man has an incredibly weak rogue's gallery in his own right (the Mandarin and a bunch of retards in armour), but he does alright as an Avenger.  Superman sucks in this regard because he's hard to challenge and you end up devaluing a character who should be a total monster of a world-beater like General Zod or Doomsday.  He's got Lex Luthor and then a bunch of scrubs.  Wonder Woman is pretty awful, because although Cheetah is kinda cool and Circe isn't bad, she's got a million goofs like the Silver Swan.

:nerd:

No shit. Posts like these consistently reinforce the notion that Neil is, in reality, nothing more than Comic Book Store Guy from The Simpsons.

Right.  Let's talk about the fucking seasons or appropriate dress codes at the opera.  Nothing's cooler than sitting in a dark room with old people watching Tristan und Isolde for five hours, and then discussing our feelings about autumn during the intermission while the life support system for our fetish keeps checking his watch and telling himself it's worth the money.

Quote from: Ideologue on September 24, 2011, 09:48:26 AM
Right.  Let's talk about the fucking seasons or appropriate dress codes at the opera.  Nothing's cooler than sitting in a dark room with old people watching Tristan und Isolde for five hours, and then discussing our feelings about autumn during the intermission while the life support system for our fetish keeps checking his watch and telling himself it's worth the money.

But then it's art.  That's the difference.

Quote from: Ideologue on September 24, 2011, 09:43:04 AM
I'd actually probably say Superman.  He doesn't have enough really good enemies, but between Lex Luthor and Brainiac, he has the best; also, you can include Legion of Super-Heroes enemies if you want.  I also like the Cyborg, even if his origin is sort of lazy and he can come off as whiny and sometimes undermotivated.  Doomsday himself is also a really good antagonist, but truly could only be used effectively once, so all his appearances subsequent to The Death of Superman actually undermine the quality of Supes' rogues gallery.

How can you not mention Darksied?

Quote
The point is, though, that Lex Luthor is worth a thousand Jokers.  Luthor, especially after John Byrne redefined him, never really got old, and in a good writer's hands, like Grant Morrison or Paul Cornell, is endlessly entertaining; the Joker got old a long, long time ago, and even a good writer has trouble saving him from being boring (if not outright unbelievable, e.g. The Dark Knight). 

I completely disagree, the Joker is far more interesting than Luthor, and I voted for Batman because of him.

Quote from: Ideologue on September 24, 2011, 09:43:04 AM
I'd also like to mention Adam Warlock, though: if you've got Thanos and the Magus, I don't see how anyone could beat that.

Silver Surfer's pretty good too.  I like the Elders of the Universe and the other heralds, but Thanos and Galactus are an awesome one-two punch.

I'll give you a little bit of credit on Superman's gallery, as Brainiac is a good villain and Darkseid is generally impressive, but I don't think that it's on the same level as the top tier, and all of his villains require very careful usage to avoid becoming humdrum, even moreso than other characters.  Luthor the anti-Superman industrialist is much, much better than the old Luthor the archcriminal, I'll give you that.  At the same time, I don't think he has the gravitas and compelling origin of Magneto, nor the same cultural resonance of the Joker.

We don't really see much of the Joker these days, do we?  The last time I remember seeing him was when he was in Total Monster mode in Birds of Prey.  Then again, I don't read a lot of DC right now, since they've decided to suck for the next couple of years.

Quote from: jimmy olsen on September 24, 2011, 10:08:28 AM
How can you not mention Darksied?

It could be because he considers him to be more of a New Gods enemy than a Superman enemy.

And no, I would never consider the Legion villains to also be Superman villains, just because to me the Legion was something greater than Superman, and Superman was just passing through.

Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 24, 2011, 09:44:42 AM

Quote from: Martinus on September 24, 2011, 08:37:22 AM
:nerd:

No shit. Posts like these consistently reinforce the notion that Neil is, in reality, nothing more than Comic Book Store Guy from The Simpsons.

Great.  You and Martinus can get together and talk about what flavour of cock you like best and you can teach him how not to play wargames.

Fag.

Quote from: Neil on September 24, 2011, 10:26:17 AM

Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 24, 2011, 09:44:42 AM

Quote from: Martinus on September 24, 2011, 08:37:22 AM
:nerd:

No shit. Posts like these consistently reinforce the notion that Neil is, in reality, nothing more than Comic Book Store Guy from The Simpsons.

Great.  You and Martinus can get together and talk about what flavour of cock you like best and you can teach him how not to play wargames.

Fag.

Do you have enough tacos to provide adequate sustanance for the Dr Who marathon?

I have to side with CdM here.

Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 24, 2011, 10:47:16 AM

Quote from: Neil on September 24, 2011, 10:26:17 AM

Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 24, 2011, 09:44:42 AM

Quote from: Martinus on September 24, 2011, 08:37:22 AM
:nerd:

No shit. Posts like these consistently reinforce the notion that Neil is, in reality, nothing more than Comic Book Store Guy from The Simpsons.

Great.  You and Martinus can get together and talk about what flavour of cock you like best and you can teach him how not to play wargames.

Fag.

Do you have enough tacos to provide adequate sustanance for the Dr Who marathon?

Tacos?  This is Alberta.  We don't truck with your filthy Tim-food.

Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 24, 2011, 10:47:16 AM


Do you have enough tacos to provide adequate sustanance for the Dr Who marathon?

What's the deal with Tacos and Dr. Who?  I've heard that before...

I would think bangers & mash or fish & chips would be the proper food to accompany Dr Who viewing.   :bowler:

Quote from: Ideologue on September 24, 2011, 09:48:26 AM

Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 24, 2011, 09:44:42 AM

Quote from: Martinus on September 24, 2011, 08:37:22 AM

Quote from: Neil on September 24, 2011, 08:23:20 AM
Well Batman is certainly a contender.  He has by far the strongest rogue's gallery in DC.  Villains like Catwoman, Ras Al-Ghul, Penguin, Riddler, Poison Ivy and Two-Face are all good characters that have received development and love from their storytellers, and the Joker is a fucking institution to a degree that only Lex Luthor or Magneto comes close to.

If somebody was going to beat Batman, it would have to be either Spiderman (Green Goblin, Electro, Rhino, Venom, Hobgoblin, Doctor Octopus, Kraven and Sandman) or the X-Men (Magneto, Apocalypse, Dark Phoenix, Mr. Sinister, Sabretooth, Mystique, the Sentinels, the Hellfire Club).  Green Lantern (Parallax, Sinestro, Star Sapphire, the Manhunters, the Qwardians, Dr. Polaris) and the Fantastic Four (Dr. Doom, Namor, Maximus, Psycho Man, Mole Man, the Wizard, the Mad Thinker) are probably a step down from there, and Captain America a step below that provided that you give him all the old Nazi groups, Stucker, Zemo and Red Skull.  Iron Man has an incredibly weak rogue's gallery in his own right (the Mandarin and a bunch of retards in armour), but he does alright as an Avenger.  Superman sucks in this regard because he's hard to challenge and you end up devaluing a character who should be a total monster of a world-beater like General Zod or Doomsday.  He's got Lex Luthor and then a bunch of scrubs.  Wonder Woman is pretty awful, because although Cheetah is kinda cool and Circe isn't bad, she's got a million goofs like the Silver Swan.

:nerd:

No shit. Posts like these consistently reinforce the notion that Neil is, in reality, nothing more than Comic Book Store Guy from The Simpsons.

Right.  Let's talk about the fucking seasons or appropriate dress codes at the opera.  Nothing's cooler than sitting in a dark room with old people watching Tristan und Isolde for five hours, and then discussing our feelings about autumn during the intermission while the life support system for our fetish keeps checking his watch and telling himself it's worth the money.

Fucking bitch. I loled. Good one.  :D

Venture Brothers

Quote from: Razgovory on September 24, 2011, 12:37:20 PM

Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 24, 2011, 10:47:16 AM


Do you have enough tacos to provide adequate sustanance for the Dr Who marathon?

What's the deal with Tacos and Dr. Who?  I've heard that before...

It's a line from CBG from Simpsons.

I think Batman pretty much wins by default.  Superman is too overpowered to leave his villians much room to shine.  the Flash has a good rogue's gallery, but to most people they're just too obscure.  Spiderman's enemies can give Batman's villians a run for their money until the Joker shows up--nobody else has a villian that iconic.

Quote from: Barrister on September 24, 2011, 03:57:12 PM


It's a line from CBG from Simpsons.

Ah, okay.  When a friend of mine found out my dad taped all those old Dr. Who's on PBS back in the 1980's and wanted to order a 50 taco deal from Taco Bell and watch them all.  Struck me as very strange.  Usually I'm pretty good at spotting Simpson quotes.

Oh and incidentally, the guy is now a nuclear engineer and works at the local power plant.

Quote from: Ideologue on September 24, 2011, 09:43:04 AM
the Joker got old a long, long time ago, and even a good writer has trouble saving him from being boring (if not outright unbelievable, e.g. The Dark Knight).

What was wrong with the Dark Knight's Joker? Too few sight-gag weapons and puns?

Quote from: Martinus on September 24, 2011, 01:37:32 PM

Quote from: Ideologue on September 24, 2011, 09:48:26 AM

Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 24, 2011, 09:44:42 AM

Quote from: Martinus on September 24, 2011, 08:37:22 AM

Quote from: Neil on September 24, 2011, 08:23:20 AM
Well Batman is certainly a contender.  He has by far the strongest rogue's gallery in DC.  Villains like Catwoman, Ras Al-Ghul, Penguin, Riddler, Poison Ivy and Two-Face are all good characters that have received development and love from their storytellers, and the Joker is a fucking institution to a degree that only Lex Luthor or Magneto comes close to.

If somebody was going to beat Batman, it would have to be either Spiderman (Green Goblin, Electro, Rhino, Venom, Hobgoblin, Doctor Octopus, Kraven and Sandman) or the X-Men (Magneto, Apocalypse, Dark Phoenix, Mr. Sinister, Sabretooth, Mystique, the Sentinels, the Hellfire Club).  Green Lantern (Parallax, Sinestro, Star Sapphire, the Manhunters, the Qwardians, Dr. Polaris) and the Fantastic Four (Dr. Doom, Namor, Maximus, Psycho Man, Mole Man, the Wizard, the Mad Thinker) are probably a step down from there, and Captain America a step below that provided that you give him all the old Nazi groups, Stucker, Zemo and Red Skull.  Iron Man has an incredibly weak rogue's gallery in his own right (the Mandarin and a bunch of retards in armour), but he does alright as an Avenger.  Superman sucks in this regard because he's hard to challenge and you end up devaluing a character who should be a total monster of a world-beater like General Zod or Doomsday.  He's got Lex Luthor and then a bunch of scrubs.  Wonder Woman is pretty awful, because although Cheetah is kinda cool and Circe isn't bad, she's got a million goofs like the Silver Swan.

:nerd:

No shit. Posts like these consistently reinforce the notion that Neil is, in reality, nothing more than Comic Book Store Guy from The Simpsons.

Right.  Let's talk about the fucking seasons or appropriate dress codes at the opera.  Nothing's cooler than sitting in a dark room with old people watching Tristan und Isolde for five hours, and then discussing our feelings about autumn during the intermission while the life support system for our fetish keeps checking his watch and telling himself it's worth the money.

Fucking bitch. I loled. Good one.  :D

:hug: At least you can afford one.

I'd have done CdM too but I forgot about the unwrapped wargames.  What a dork. :P

Quote from: KlevesWhat was wrong with the Dark Knight's Joker? Too few sight-gag weapons and puns?

The apparent ability to make himself and large containers of explosives invisible bugged me.

TDK was only problematic, though, not bad.  It's difficult to say how much of this was Goyer's good material and how much was Ledger's transcendent performance.

Quote from: Ideologue on September 24, 2011, 07:09:45 PM
I'd have done CdM too but I forgot about the unwrapped wargames.  What a dork. :P

Fuck you, pal.  If they're wrapped, I can't roll around in the maps and let the counters stick to my sweaty body.

I like Harley Quinn. And women who dress up as Harley Quinn on Halloween.

Batman.  The X-Men are a very close second.  Watching Batman:  The Animated Series on The Hub just reinforces how awesome Batman's Rogue's Gallery can be when done properly though.  Amazing stuff.

Totally Batman.
Superman has Lex Luthor and I guess Spiderman has the Green Goblin and Dr Octopus (hurray for movies) but otherwise they're quite lacking in mainstream famous enemies. The X-Men's enemies too seem rather a mess with there just being Mageneto as very famous and those big roboty things somewhat known.
Batman has Catwoman, the Joker and the Penguin at least. A few lesser villains are quite well known too.

Whether most famous means best is of course very debatable but in lieu of any other way to decide its what I went with.

Batman's Rouge Gallery is the most famous because it is the best.  Batman's enemies are more interesting than Batman himself, which is pretty rare in the Superhero world.

Batman, but I'd rate Spiderman a close second.

Quote from: sbr on September 27, 2011, 11:29:52 AM
Batman's Rouge Gallery is the most famous because it is the best.  Batman's enemies are more interesting than Batman himself, which is pretty rare in the Superhero world.

Red Robin, Red Hood.  The list is endless.

Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on September 27, 2011, 12:42:49 PM

Quote from: sbr on September 27, 2011, 11:29:52 AM
Batman's Rouge Gallery is the most famous because it is the best.  Batman's enemies are more interesting than Batman himself, which is pretty rare in the Superhero world.

Red Robin, Red Hood.  The list is endless.

Yeah, it endlessly sucks.

Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on September 27, 2011, 12:42:49 PM

Quote from: sbr on September 27, 2011, 11:29:52 AM
Batman's Rouge Gallery is the most famous because it is the best.  Batman's enemies are more interesting than Batman himself, which is pretty rare in the Superhero world.

Red Robin, Red Hood.  The list is endless.

I don't think I understand your point.

Quote from: sbr on September 27, 2011, 02:54:47 PM

Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on September 27, 2011, 12:42:49 PM

Quote from: sbr on September 27, 2011, 11:29:52 AM
Batman's Rouge Gallery is the most famous because it is the best.  Batman's enemies are more interesting than Batman himself, which is pretty rare in the Superhero world.

Red Robin, Red Hood.  The list is endless.

I don't think I understand your point.

Perhaps some meditation on the meanings of "rouge" and "rogue" would help.

Quote from: Ideologue on September 24, 2011, 09:48:26 AM
Right.  Let's talk about the fucking seasons or appropriate dress codes at the opera.  Nothing's cooler than sitting in a dark room with old people watching Tristan und Isolde for five hours, and then discussing our feelings about autumn during the intermission while the life support system for our fetish keeps checking his watch and telling himself it's worth the money.

Sound pretty good.  I assume champagne is available at the intermissions.

Quote from: ulmont on September 27, 2011, 05:51:03 PM

Quote from: sbr on September 27, 2011, 02:54:47 PM

Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on September 27, 2011, 12:42:49 PM

Quote from: sbr on September 27, 2011, 11:29:52 AM
Batman's Rouge Gallery is the most famous because it is the best.  Batman's enemies are more interesting than Batman himself, which is pretty rare in the Superhero world.

Red Robin, Red Hood.  The list is endless.

I don't think I understand your point.

Perhaps some meditation on the meanings of "rouge" and "rogue" would help.

:lol: