Greece angers Germany in gold row (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/8536862.stm)
QuoteGreek Deputy Prime Minister Theodoros Pangalos has accused Germany of failing to compensate Greece for Nazi occupation during World War II.
Mr Pangalos made the remarks during a wide-ranging BBC interview about Greece's financial difficulties.
"They [the Nazis] took away the Greek gold that was in the Bank of Greece, they took away the Greek money and they never gave it back," he said.
Germany has rejected the allegations, describing them as "not helpful".
Germany has been one of the harshest critics of Greece since it announced that its budget deficit was four times the eurozone limits.
Icy response
Mr Pangalos told the BBC: "This is an issue that has to be faced sometime in the future.
"I don't say they have to give back the money necessarily, but they have to say thanks. And they [the German government] shouldn't complain much about stealing and not being very specific about economic dealings."
Mr Pangalos' comments elicited an icy response from German Foreign Ministry spokesman Andreas Peschke.
"I must reject these accusations," he said.
"A discussion about the past is not helpful at all to solve the problems facing us in Europe today."
In 1960, Germany paid Athens 115m German marks in compensation for the four year long occupation, in which 300,000 Greeks died.
Mr Peschke added: "I'd like to mention that parallel to this, since 1960 Germany has paid around 33bn Deutsche marks in aid to Greece both bilaterally and in the context of the EU."
Earlier this month, an article in Germany's Stern magazine outraged Greece.
The author accused Greeks of frittering away German taxpayers' savings.
Then another German magazine, Focus, further antagonised Athens with a front cover that depicted a statue of the Venus de Milo making an obscene gesture under the title "Greek cheats."
'Offensive' coverage
Following publication of the articles, the German ambassador to Athens, Wolfgang Schultheiss, was summoned to Parliament for a dressing down by the speaker, Filippos Petsalnikos.
The speaker described the German coverage as "offensive" and "surpassing all limits".
The Mayor of Athens, Nikitas Kaklamanis, has also waded into the dispute. "You [Germany] owe us 70bn euros for the ruins you left behind," he said.
The Greek Consumers' Federation has called on shoppers to boycott German goods.
A former foreign minister, Mr Pangalos has a reputation for using undiplomatic language.
His comments are the antithesis of the charm offensive mounted by the Prime Minister, George Papandreou, and his Finance Minister, George Papaconstantinou, in a bid to win European support for Greece.
But Mr Pangalos has his finger on the pulse of Greeks who blame the country's predicament on outside forces such as the financial markets and the European Union.
The title of Focus, "Frauds within the Euro-Family":
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmagazine.web.de%2Fimages%2F956%2F9948956.jpg&hash=2e0c82e8c1b536dbe435f487f0f7b74efe0ef8b8)
The Persians should have won.
Maybe they should ask Iran for war reparations as well.
ENJOY YOUR EU.
:lol:
I hope the Greek people are facepalming and feeling embarassed here.
Basically the condition that Germany gave for joining the Euro was that everybody else kept germany's standards for economic sensibleness when it comes to government debt and inflation. Greece says yes, we'll accept that and we'll benefit from having a sensible currency and then greece spends as normal and lies about it.
If the Euro is going to have future stability then they need to screw over greece and kick them out of the Euro.
Quote from: Viking on February 25, 2010, 01:54:45 PM
Basically the condition that Germany gave for joining the Euro was that everybody else kept germany's standards for economic sensibleness when it comes to government debt and inflation. Greece says yes, we'll accept that and we'll benefit from having a sensible currency and then greece spends as normal and lies about it.
If the Euro is going to have future stability then they need to screw over greece and kick them out of the Euro.
To be fair, both Germany and France were in breach of the Stability and Growth pact.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stability_and_Growth_Pact#Member_states_by_SGP_criteria
Quote from: Viking on February 25, 2010, 01:54:45 PM
Basically the condition that Germany gave for joining the Euro was that everybody else kept germany's standards for economic sensibleness when it comes to government debt and inflation. Greece says yes, we'll accept that and we'll benefit from having a sensible currency and then greece spends as normal and lies about it.
If the Euro is going to have future stability then they need to screw over greece and kick them out of the Euro.
Wouldn't Greece have to have acted in good faith to be "screwed over" in the first place? Sounds to me like kicking them out would be an appropriate measure.
Quote from: Syt on February 25, 2010, 01:29:27 PM
The Mayor of Athens, Nikitas Kaklamanis, has also waded into the dispute. "You [Germany] owe us 70bn euros for the ruins you left behind," he said.
You owe the real Greeks even more for the ruins they left behind
Can't stop looking at Vikings avatar.
They should never have been let in. Yuo know a country is in trouble when it makes italy look good.
Germany does a poor Captain Renault impression.
Hard to take seriously anyone who expresses surprise and outrage in learning that Greek public financial accounts were less than 100% Grade A kosher. This is far from news. At the time of Greece's accession to the Euro, no one seriously thought that they actually were ready. They were let in to help paint the map more Euro and on the assumption that their economy was sufficiently small and peripheral that their inclusion could do no real damage.
the underlying problem here is that the Greek economy is fundamentally weak; forcing crushing austerity measures on the country is not going to fix that problem.
Quote from: Razgovory on February 25, 2010, 02:16:37 PM
Can't stop looking at Vikings avatar.
Looks at first glance like a woman perfoming oral sex on a
spectacularly under-endowed man. :lol:
Quote from: Malthus on February 25, 2010, 05:15:33 PM
Looks at first glance like a woman perfoming oral sex on a spectacularly under-endowed man. :lol:
And here's the masculine equivalent - great add campaign in France that.
G.
Quote from: Grallon on February 25, 2010, 05:17:15 PM
Quote from: Malthus on February 25, 2010, 05:15:33 PM
Looks at first glance like a woman perfoming oral sex on a spectacularly under-endowed man. :lol:
And here's the masculine equivalent - great add campaign in France that.
G.
What's it advertising?
It's the response a child would give when caught doing something wrong. The next one will be Greece pointing at Italy and screaming "but they do it too!".
Quote from: Malthus on February 25, 2010, 05:20:29 PM
Quote from: Grallon on February 25, 2010, 05:17:15 PM
Quote from: Malthus on February 25, 2010, 05:15:33 PM
Looks at first glance like a woman perfoming oral sex on a spectacularly under-endowed man. :lol:
And here's the masculine equivalent - great add campaign in France that.
G.
What's it advertising?
Smoking is bad. The theory being that if you tell teens not to do something they'll ignore you, but by telling them that they're under the power and influence of "da man" (big tobacco/suited man in the ad) they'll rebel and stop smoking. Thats what the newpaper quoted the ad's brain trust as saying... more or less :lol:
LOL how retarded. Who do these Greeks think they are? Jews?
Quote from: HVC on February 25, 2010, 05:38:19 PM
Smoking is bad. The theory being that if you tell teens not to do something they'll ignore you, but by telling them that they're under the power and influence of "da man" (big tobacco/suited man in the ad) they'll rebel and stop smoking. Thats what the newpaper quoted the ad's brain trust as saying... more or less :lol:
So, they plan to convince teens that smoking is bad - by associating it with hott oral sex?
I detect a flaw in this plan ... :hmm:
Quote from: Martinus on February 25, 2010, 06:03:00 PM
LOL how retarded. Who do these Greeks think they are? Jews?
Well, if they were, they'd hardly be in such financial trouble now, would they? :D
Quote from: Malthus on February 25, 2010, 06:10:30 PM
Quote from: HVC on February 25, 2010, 05:38:19 PM
Smoking is bad. The theory being that if you tell teens not to do something they'll ignore you, but by telling them that they're under the power and influence of "da man" (big tobacco/suited man in the ad) they'll rebel and stop smoking. Thats what the newpaper quoted the ad's brain trust as saying... more or less :lol:
So, they plan to convince teens that smoking is bad - by associating it with hott oral sex?
I detect a flaw in this plan ... :hmm:
Looks like the French have been taking cues from The Onion:
http://www.theonion.com/content/video/new_anti_smoking_ads_warn_teens
Quote from: Malthus on February 25, 2010, 06:10:30 PM
So, they plan to convince teens that smoking is bad - by associating it with hott oral sex?
I detect a flaw in this plan ... :hmm:
No. The idea is to show how smoking makes one addicted - a slave - an object Something shocking for a demographic who pisses all over moral lessons. Though they should have kept to the boy image since we all know a girl kneeling and submissive is every hetero's fantasy; but for guys to imagine themselves as being subjected to submissive oral sex is repellent.
G.
Quote from: Malthus on February 25, 2010, 06:11:58 PM
Quote from: Martinus on February 25, 2010, 06:03:00 PM
LOL how retarded. Who do these Greeks think they are? Jews?
Well, if they were, they'd hardly be in such financial trouble now, would they? :D
:lol:
Quote from: Viking on February 25, 2010, 01:54:45 PM
Basically the condition that Germany gave for joining the Euro was that everybody else kept germany's standards for economic sensibleness when it comes to government debt and inflation. Greece says yes, we'll accept that and we'll benefit from having a sensible currency and then greece spends as normal and lies about it.
If the Euro is going to have future stability then they need to screw over greece and kick them out of the Euro.
One of the agreed upon indicators for economic sensibleness was to have about 2% inflation per year. IIRC, Germany only had that for about one of the ten Euro years so far and always less than that in the other years. Mainly thanks to continued wage depression. That has eroded competitiveness of the other European countries a lot, whereas Germany has become the biggest exporter in the world. So Germany did not keep to the promised economic targets either.
Quote from: The Minsky Moment
Hard to take seriously anyone who expresses surprise and outrage in learning that Greek public financial accounts were less than 100% Grade A kosher.
I'm not sure about the Germans. They seem to be forming some kind of new army lately...
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dakkadakka.com%2Fs%2Fi%2Fat%2F2009%2F12%2F6%2F54ec0c706366ad706ea3872f364fe124_17210.png__thumb&hash=a2aa8af101edf103ec71fd571aa41585970c729e)
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on February 25, 2010, 05:04:00 PM
the underlying problem here is that the Greek economy is fundamentally weak; forcing crushing austerity measures on the country is not going to fix that problem.
Weakness (as in low growth and/or low per capita GDP) does not in and of itself lead to huge national debt.
Quote from: Cerr on February 25, 2010, 02:08:56 PM
To be fair, both Germany and France were in breach of the Stability and Growth pact.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stability_and_Growth_Pact#Member_states_by_SGP_criteria
Agreed, but you don't have Angela Merkel huffing and puffing and demanding 70 bn Euros for somebody who invaded them 65 years ago. The Greeks were particularly devious in their circumventing of the Stability and Growth pact. The breach of the pact can be said to be one of the main causes for the present greek problems, along with explaining why the problems have landed on greece and not on germany.
As a Pro-EU scandinavian (yes they exist) I see the best argument AGAINST joining the EURO that Greece, Italy, Spain and Portugal are in it. I want to hitch up to the german and dutch economies, not the runts of the litter.
A PASOK prime minister pulling a Kaczynski is very sad, yet not very surprising. On the other hand, it wouldn't work to blame Turkey, no money there...
Quote from: Grallon on February 25, 2010, 06:44:01 PM
Quote from: Malthus on February 25, 2010, 06:10:30 PM
So, they plan to convince teens that smoking is bad - by associating it with hott oral sex?
I detect a flaw in this plan ... :hmm:
No. The idea is to show how smoking makes one addicted - a slave - an object Something shocking for a demographic who pisses all over moral lessons. Though they should have kept to the boy image since we all know a girl kneeling and submissive is every hetero's fantasy; but for guys to imagine themselves as being subjected to submissive oral sex is repellent.
G.
Don't you find this homophobic, though (serious question). It's not that much different from the conservative US politician who caused outrage recently by saying that we should tell teenage boys that porn will make them gay, because teenage boys hate nothing more than gays.
The Onion's material I posted was meant to satirize that actually. Now it seems the French are going down that route, but rather than protesting (since it essentially portrays gay people, or at least the active party in oral sex, as inferior/detestable), you are praising this as a great ad campaign.
Quote from: Grallon on February 25, 2010, 06:44:01 PM
Quote from: Malthus on February 25, 2010, 06:10:30 PM
So, they plan to convince teens that smoking is bad - by associating it with hott oral sex?
I detect a flaw in this plan ... :hmm:
No. The idea is to show how smoking makes one addicted - a slave - an object Something shocking for a demographic who pisses all over moral lessons. Though they should have kept to the boy image since we all know a girl kneeling and submissive is every hetero's fantasy; but for guys to imagine themselves as being subjected to submissive oral sex is repellent.
G.
Funny, I interpreted it as that having the chick appeals to the straights and having the dude appeals to the gays. :lol:
Can't do reverse-gender, for the obvious reason that a ciggy is a phallic substitute. Perhaps that young dude blowing a smoke-ring up a business casual skirt?
Anyway, problem here is that more folks associate oral with "hott!" than "OMG humiliating!"
What about people who associate oral with "OMG humiliating i.e. HOTT"? :unsure:
Btw, grallon, the version of the ad posted on Advocate.com has a hotter dude:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.advocate.com%2FuploadedImages%2FSMOKEXLRG.jpg&hash=2ae98efc663dfb4f8101bfd0d0e993e1a685fb91)
Btw, does it mean that if you work for a tobacco company, you get a male sex slave in his early 20s? :hmm:
Quote from: Martinus on February 26, 2010, 12:58:19 PM
What about people who associate oral with "OMG humiliating i.e. HOTT"? :unsure:
They'll start smoking, obviously.
Quote from: Martinus on February 26, 2010, 01:03:31 PM
Btw, does it mean that if you work for a tobacco company, you get a male sex slave in his early 20s? :hmm:
Seems you get your choice - male or female. Two differen males, even. :lol:
I wouldn't be surprised if a cigarette company couldn't use this sort of add to sell its products (imagine the outrage if they tried! :D )
Quote from: Martim Silva on February 25, 2010, 08:25:57 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment
Hard to take seriously anyone who expresses surprise and outrage in learning that Greek public financial accounts were less than 100% Grade A kosher.
I'm not sure about the Germans. They seem to be forming some kind of new army lately...
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dakkadakka.com%2Fs%2Fi%2Fat%2F2009%2F12%2F6%2F54ec0c706366ad706ea3872f364fe124_17210.png__thumb&hash=a2aa8af101edf103ec71fd571aa41585970c729e)
I wonder where did they park the Chimera ...
Quote from: Viking on February 25, 2010, 11:51:04 PM
Quote from: Cerr on February 25, 2010, 02:08:56 PM
To be fair, both Germany and France were in breach of the Stability and Growth pact.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stability_and_Growth_Pact#Member_states_by_SGP_criteria
As a Pro-EU scandinavian (yes they exist) I see the best argument AGAINST joining the EURO that Greece, Italy, Spain and Portugal are in it. I want to hitch up to the german and dutch economies, not the runts of the litter.
You shouldn't. The PIGS have no say in how the ECB is run, and excepting Spain and Italy* none are big enough to worry about that much. It is precisely Germany and France who have the power and willingness to fuck you up the most. I still think the Euro is worth it. If nothing else it will hopefully force us to reform our ways ...
* Which are not doing as bad as many think. Spain, while being in the midst of a tremendous housing-bubble collapse, has paid off a lot of debt in the last decade and will be able to withstand the crisis if panic by association is contained. Italy doesn't seem to suffering much. Maybe they are used to it.
On the surface, it looks like Italy is in worse shape than Greece. Is that not the case?
Quote from: MadImmortalMan on February 26, 2010, 02:57:12 PM
On the surface, it looks like Italy is in worse shape than Greece. Is that not the case?
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fnewsimg.bbc.co.uk%2Fmedia%2Fimages%2F46891000%2Fgif%2F_46891454_govts_in_debt02_466gr.gif&hash=e67ba1bb449f7bb272f32efa23219b9436409f3a)
Quote from: Martinus on February 26, 2010, 01:00:34 PM
Btw, grallon, the version of the ad posted on Advocate.com has a hotter dude:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.advocate.com%2FuploadedImages%2FSMOKEXLRG.jpg&hash=2ae98efc663dfb4f8101bfd0d0e993e1a685fb91)
You're absolutely right Marty! He looks more angelic (like you I have a thing for red heads) - thus the pleasure of submitting him to unmentionable acts is enhanced. ^_^
G.
Quote from: Martinus on February 26, 2010, 03:06:03 AM
Don't you find this homophobic, though (serious question).
...
you are praising this as a great ad campaign.
Marty, you will have to come to terms with your minority status. Gays are a minority and will always be one. As such they'll always be discriminated against. Whether subtly, as we see now in the West - or harshly, as we see elsewhere in non civilized places - gays will continue to be an object of ridicule. So it is up to you to transform this from a handicap into a source of strenght.
You have to start thinking of yourself as member of an elite group of males - one that isn't enslaved to females - those alien creatures who transform human men into lapdogs bending and twisting at their every whims (they call it 'commitment' and 'compromise'). Those poor souls are so consumed by their need for uterine comfort that they'll agree to anything, sign everything, to fall back into their dependancy upon the first mother figure passing by (see Cal and his 'bovine tits' fetish for reference).
Homosexuality is the last redoubt of free men. Knowing this, one can endure all the Neil-esque jibes in the world since the mockery of a cuntslave is like a paean to our own superiority.
G.
I can't recall the last time I came face to face with ridicule here in SF.
Why is it that 'free men' always behave like junior high girls?
Quote from: Neil on February 26, 2010, 09:05:09 PM
Why is it that 'free men' always behave like junior high girls?
Do high school girls go fucking around with abandon? (I've no idea.)
Quote from: garbon on February 26, 2010, 09:09:50 PM
Quote from: Neil on February 26, 2010, 09:05:09 PM
Why is it that 'free men' always behave like junior high girls?
Do high school girls go fucking around with abandon? (I've no idea.)
Probably. Kids these days.