Wow, that's fucked up!
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-32816454
QuotePolice could seize illegal workers' wages under Tory plans
6 hours ago
Police would be able to seize the wages of illegal workers as proceeds of crime under government plans to be set out in next week's Queen's Speech.
PM David Cameron will say on Thursday that it has become "too easy" for migrants not entitled to be in the country to exploit loopholes.
Working illegally in the UK will also become a criminal offence as part of the proposed crackdown.
Labour said not enough was being done to protect the country's borders.
At the moment, firms can be fined up to £20,000 for employing illegal workers.
In future, ministers want anyone who has entered the UK illegally or overstayed their visas to be liable to face prosecution if they seek work, and to have their pay confiscated.
The proposal forms part of what the prime minister will say is a "tougher but fairer" approach to immigration that will be adopted by the Conservative government.
However, the scale of the challenge facing ministers in reducing levels of legal immigration will be highlighted again on Thursday when the latest official figures on net migration are published.
'Control and reduce'
Net migration rose to 298,000 in the year to September 2014, well above the levels anticipated by the Conservatives - who set a goal before the 2010 election of reducing numbers to less than 100,000, a target they acknowledge they have failed to meet.
Mr Cameron will see first-hand efforts to combat illegal immigration on Thursday when he visits a premises in London shortly after it has been raided by immigration officials.
He will say the government is determined to "control and reduce" immigration, saying criminalising illegal workers must go hand-in-hand with other measures to lower demand for migrant labour, such as boosting the skills of UK workers.
The government says depriving illegal migrants of their wages will make it harder for them to remain in the UK.
The new criminal offence of illegal working will apply to migrants who have entered the country illegally and also those who came to the country legally but are in breach of their conditions or have overstayed.
At the moment, migrants with current leave to remain who are working illegally in breach of their conditions may be prosecuted and are liable, if convicted, to a six months' custodial sentence and-or an unlimited fine.
But migrants who entered the UK illegally or have overstayed their leave are not subject to the same sanctions, and the police do not have the same powers of confiscation in all cases.
'Less attractive'
Mr Cameron will say that "making Britain a less attractive place to come and work illegally" is a crucial part of a fair immigration policy - adding that a "strong country is one that controls immigration... not one that pulls up the drawbridge".
"The truth is it has been too easy to work illegally and employ illegal workers here," he will say in a speech in London.
"So we'll take a radical step - we'll make illegal working a criminal offence in its own right.
"That means wages paid to illegal migrants will be seized as proceeds of crime... and businesses will be told when their workers' visas expire... So if you're involved in illegal working - employer or employee - you're breaking the law."
Among other measures set to feature in a forthcoming Immigration Bill, the "deport first, appeal later" principle will be extended to all non-asylum cases, there will be new powers for councils to deal with unscrupulous landlords and to evict illegal migrants more quickly, while all foreign criminals awaiting deportation will be fitted with satellite tracking tags.
It will also become an offence for businesses and recruitment agencies to hire abroad without first advertising in the UK - a policy which featured prominently in Labour's election manifesto.
'Tackling exploitation'
Ministers say the package builds on the progress made over the past five years but critics say the Conservatives' tough rhetoric has not been matched by action on the ground, either in tackling illegal immigration or curbing legal immigration.
Labour welcomed the action but said it did not go far enough.
"A lot of this will look very familiar to anyone who read Labour's manifesto," shadow immigration minister David Hanson said.
"After five years of opposing action to tackle exploitation, which can affect wages and act as a driver for low-skilled labour, the prime minister is now offering policies he said were unnecessary, such as banning agencies from only recruiting from abroad.
"It is clear the measures outlined here will not be sufficient to tackle exploitation. There needs to be a clear offence of exploitation that undercuts local jobs and wages, which the police and other experts have called for."
Figures published in February showed that not only is net migration 50,000 higher than when Mr Cameron came to power, but even non-EU migration - which ministers had claimed to have brought under control - has been increasing rapidly.
I agree with Tim. I guess Tories are keen to prove their are the nasty party after all.
By the way, does Britain really have a problem with illegal workers/illegal immigration? If so, where do they come from?
Incidentally, I also think it is pretty fucked up that British liberal centre-left punished Lib Dems the way they did for trying to seek compromise and curb Tory excesses. I guess this is why we can't have nice things - too many leftist voters are morons. Same thing happening in Poland too - leftists think it is better to act like a virgin in a brothel, get no influence on policy whatsoever but stay ideologically pure - then to compromise and get 50% of your goals achieved.
The way our government has handled immigration over the last five years is one of the things that gets me genuinely angry, not least because it helped destroy one of my previous relationships.
We've closed our doors even to precisely the kind of highly educated, highly skilled types that would do the economy a lot of good. I'm not talking about history grads - I'm talking about people with advanced degrees in the STEM subjects we have such trouble producing domestically.
We do not just close our doors - we also make the legal process for acquiring residency or citizenship highly arbitrary, extremely expensive, and needlessly complicated.
To give you one example - the Canadian partner of a good friend of mine was, a month ago, told that his appeal hearing date for his Indefinite Leave to Remain scheduled for April was postponed for six months because of 'insufficient capacity in the appeals body'.
This means that the Home Office holds his passport for the entire duration of the appeals process, so he cannot leave the country for work or pleasure or bereavement. Even better, the acceptance of his application now hinges - and I am not making this up - on how able HIS PARTNER is to set up a new life in Canada.
So she - a British citizen from birth - is now having her family history and financial records combed through in order to assess whether he can stay. So the Home Office might decide that because they could just as easily set up life in Canada, he can fuck off.
Needless to say, there are large fees at each stage of this process.
Just one episode of the lunacy of the British immigration system.
Agree with Warspite; the behaviour over immigration is utterly contemptible, counter-productive and moronic.
Cool.
@warspite: Dafuq?
They should let the workers keep their money but undo all the work they did.
Man so no special sort of arrangement for citizens of Commonwealth countries? Huh. Where is the love for the colonials?
Quote from: Valmy on May 21, 2015, 02:41:08 PM
Man so no special sort of arrangement for citizens of Commonwealth countries? Huh. Where is the love for the colonials?
As part of joining the EC they had to get rid of any colonial preferences.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on May 21, 2015, 02:35:54 PM
They should let the workers keep their money but undo all the work they did.
How Sisyphian
Quote from: The Brain on May 21, 2015, 01:52:20 PM
In Sweden we'd be thrilled if foreigners worked.
I thought they worked for the social-democrats as voters? :unsure:
Quote from: The Brain on May 21, 2015, 04:22:42 PM
Quote from: Duque de Bragança on May 21, 2015, 04:16:54 PM
Quote from: The Brain on May 21, 2015, 01:52:20 PM
In Sweden we'd be thrilled if foreigners worked.
I thought they worked for the social-democrats as voters? :unsure:
No foreigners are weak in voting.
Well, I'm glad they are all strong in that area.
Quote from: The Brain on May 21, 2015, 04:22:42 PM
Quote from: Duque de Bragança on May 21, 2015, 04:16:54 PM
Quote from: The Brain on May 21, 2015, 01:52:20 PM
In Sweden we'd be thrilled if foreigners worked.
I thought they worked for the social-democrats as voters? :unsure:
No foreigners are weak in voting.
Local or national elections?
Quote from: derspiess on May 21, 2015, 02:30:13 PM
Cool.
Really? Would you support similar legislation in the United States?
Quote from: Barrister on May 21, 2015, 02:44:46 PM
Quote from: Valmy on May 21, 2015, 02:41:08 PM
Man so no special sort of arrangement for citizens of Commonwealth countries? Huh. Where is the love for the colonials?
As part of joining the EC they had to get rid of any colonial preferences.
Are you sure? We do keep the preferences for ours.
Quote from: celedhring on May 21, 2015, 06:39:58 PM
Quote from: Barrister on May 21, 2015, 02:44:46 PM
Quote from: Valmy on May 21, 2015, 02:41:08 PM
Man so no special sort of arrangement for citizens of Commonwealth countries? Huh. Where is the love for the colonials?
As part of joining the EC they had to get rid of any colonial preferences.
Are you sure? We do keep the preferences for ours.
Yep. Former subjects of the Crown such as Latinamericans and Sephardi Jews have much easier access to citizenship.
Quote from: The Brain on May 22, 2015, 12:23:41 PM
Quote from: Duque de Bragança on May 21, 2015, 05:07:47 PM
Quote from: The Brain on May 21, 2015, 04:22:42 PM
Quote from: Duque de Bragança on May 21, 2015, 04:16:54 PM
Quote from: The Brain on May 21, 2015, 01:52:20 PM
In Sweden we'd be thrilled if foreigners worked.
I thought they worked for the social-democrats as voters? :unsure:
No foreigners are weak in voting.
Local or national elections?
National elections.
I thought it would be the opposite but I'll take your word for it. Depends on the naturalisation laws as well.
Quote from: Warspite on May 21, 2015, 02:57:06 AM
Just one episode of the lunacy of the British immigration system.
This was not on my radar screen until I read about Cameron's speech in today's paper. At first I thought it was some kind of joke - then I read the actual speech and no it's really what he said. A country that is near full employment but is suffering from productivity shortfalls actually sets as a policy goal to LOWER the amount of skilled immigrants ?! Artificially limiting the time professions can be classified as having skills shortage ?! Attacking sectors for being "over-reliant" on skilled immigrants ?! Seeking to shut down skilled immigrants from outside the EU -- i,e. telling a giant FU to all those Indian STEM grads ?!
WTF is a country of 64 million people doing fretting about a net migration rate of 300K (less than 1/2 a percent), and who in his right mind would respond to such a fake "problem" by cracking down and harassing HIGHLY SKILLED IMMIGRANTS?
:huh:
Is this some English self-deprecation thing, where having won an unexpectedly strong electoral triumph, Cameron feels the need to humble himself by making the single most idiotic speech by a first world leader in the last decade (not named George Bush)?
As an American all I can say is great - we'll take 'em.
Well there goes Tamas's nest egg.
Quote from: Razgovory on May 22, 2015, 06:54:28 PM
Well there goes Tamas's nest egg.
6 beets and a ball of yarn.
Quote from: Barrister on May 21, 2015, 02:44:46 PM
Quote from: Valmy on May 21, 2015, 02:41:08 PM
Man so no special sort of arrangement for citizens of Commonwealth countries? Huh. Where is the love for the colonials?
As part of joining the EC they had to get rid of any colonial preferences.
As the Spanish posters said above, that's just not true. Not having a common immigration policy in the EU is one of the current issues we have with those boats in the Med.
Each country regulates it however it wants. Britain could still have Imperial preference in immigration.
Germany immediately gives citizenship to people whose ancestors were deprived of their German citizenship by the Nazis for example. You don't even have to ever set foot in Germany for that.
I believe Britain still does give some lead to citizens in Commonwealth nations who had a grandparent who was a British citizen.
Quote from: garbon on May 23, 2015, 02:37:10 AM
I believe Britain still does give some lead to citizens in Commonwealth nations who had a grandparent who was a British citizen.
I have a British grandparent! That's discriminatory! :mad:
QuoteAs part of joining the EC they had to get rid of any colonial preferences.
That seems unusual.
Don't latin Americans still get special treatment in Iberia?
Quote from: The Brain on May 21, 2015, 01:52:20 PM
In Sweden we'd be thrilled if foreigners worked.
They would be thrilled if you would employ them.
Europe and immigration seem to cause a chemical reaction that leads to brownshirts/blackshirts.
Quote from: Tyr on May 23, 2015, 05:46:10 AM
QuoteAs part of joining the EC they had to get rid of any colonial preferences.
That seems unusual.
Don't latin Americans still get special treatment in Iberia?
Brazilians got the treaty of Porto Seguro which gaves them an almost-Portuguese citizen status in Portugal, but that does not include the free travel rights in the EEA.
Quote from: garbon on May 23, 2015, 02:37:10 AM
I believe Britain still does give some lead to citizens in Commonwealth nations who had a grandparent who was a British citizen.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.treefrogtreasures.com%2Fforum%2Fattachment.php%3Fattachmentid%3D25386%26amp%3Bstc%3D1%26amp%3Bd%3D1232987474&hash=62ef216a54e8b33347df20eed3cc84dfafc77b84)
Quote from: The Brain on May 23, 2015, 08:03:14 AM
Quote from: Tyr on May 23, 2015, 05:46:10 AM
QuoteAs part of joining the EC they had to get rid of any colonial preferences.
That seems unusual.
Don't latin Americans still get special treatment in Iberia?
Quote from: The Brain on May 21, 2015, 01:52:20 PM
In Sweden we'd be thrilled if foreigners worked.
They would be thrilled if you would employ them.
They are gypsy beggars. They don't seek employment.
All of them? :yeahright:
I see. :hmm:
I can see the logic of making it less advantageous to immigrate illegally then to come legally and then work illegally, but British immigration laws seem more fucked up even than those of the US, and that's saying something.
The US has the problem with insufficient H2B visas and the use of that program as a political football. So we have this ridiculous situation where the country hosting the best universities on the planet educates the best students and then chucks a good portion of them out. But at least the President pays lip service to the idea that having high skilled immigrants is good.
Every now and then you hear rumblings in the UK about building a strong tech industry, and having Cambridge as a mini-silicon valley and such. Then you see the PM giving a speech threatening industries "over-reliant" on skilled furriners. Hmm ... wonder what those industries might be?
That's a good thing though surely?
The point of foreign students should be they gain the advantage of education here then take that knowledge home to make their country a better place.
Going to university in a other country shouldn't be thought of just in terms of a quick immigration cheat - though that is definitely in large part how a lot of foreign students view it. Those ones need discouraging so they don't steal places from the actually dedicated.
Anyway. Don't see this taking immigrants wages thing working out at all. Illegals don't exactly have great intel about how things actually are in the uk and even if they did know about this they would still think it worth trying .
This is totally the wrong direction to go in for dealing with illegals. Treating them as criminals just pushes them underground. A lot of illegals head to the uk thinking they will get a job easily and be living In a lovely house within a year or two, ready for their family to come over and join them. They instead often end up borderline homeless occasionally casual workers who are worse off than at home.
We need to create an environment where they feel comfortable to come forward, pass on Intel about the scum bags who brought them over and be sent home.
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on May 22, 2015, 04:09:15 PM
Quote from: Warspite on May 21, 2015, 02:57:06 AM
Just one episode of the lunacy of the British immigration system.
This was not on my radar screen until I read about Cameron's speech in today's paper. At first I thought it was some kind of joke - then I read the actual speech and no it's really what he said. A country that is near full employment but is suffering from productivity shortfalls actually sets as a policy goal to LOWER the amount of skilled immigrants ?! Artificially limiting the time professions can be classified as having skills shortage ?! Attacking sectors for being "over-reliant" on skilled immigrants ?! Seeking to shut down skilled immigrants from outside the EU -- i,e. telling a giant FU to all those Indian STEM grads ?!
WTF is a country of 64 million people doing fretting about a net migration rate of 300K (less than 1/2 a percent), and who in his right mind would respond to such a fake "problem" by cracking down and harassing HIGHLY SKILLED IMMIGRANTS?
:huh:
Is this some English self-deprecation thing, where having won an unexpectedly strong electoral triumph, Cameron feels the need to humble himself by making the single most idiotic speech by a first world leader in the last decade (not named George Bush)?
As an American all I can say is great - we'll take 'em.
You are, of course, entirely correct.
The problem, however, with collective madness, once it has seized an electorate, is that it is very difficult to eradicate, and the use of facts and reason often have the opposite effect to that intended.
It is a malady that appears to be spreading. Here in Canada we used to have a robust foreign worker program that made it relatively easy for workers (both skilled and unskilled) to be employed in Canada. Many go on to apply for citizenship. But last year the Federal Government effectively ended the program because of a controversy over fast food restaurants hiring through the foreign workers program. The problem is the government didn't replace the program with anything. And so now everyone from high tech companies and universities to restaurants and people looking for nannies are affected.
This is a country that depends on attracting immigrants and foreign workers to grow our economy. It is, to borrow Warspite's phrase, collective madness.
Quote from: crazy canuck on May 25, 2015, 11:29:26 AM
It is a malady that appears to be spreading. Here in Canada we used to have a robust foreign worker program that made it relatively easy for workers (both skilled and unskilled) to be employed in Canada. Many go on to apply for citizenship. But last year the Federal Government effectively ended the program because of a controversy over fast food restaurants hiring through the foreign workers program. The problem is the government didn't replace the program with anything. And so now everyone from high tech companies and universities to restaurants and people looking for nannies are affected.
This is a country that depends on attracting immigrants and foreign workers to grow our economy. It is, to borrow Warspite's phrase, collective madness.
I don't think that's quite right.
They did end/merge the temporary foreign worker program, which I do think was being abused. You would walk into, say, a Tim Horton's, and realize that every single person working there was from the Phillipines. The government also made in rather clear they didn't like the live-in caregiver program, and folded that into the general program as well (I just read today that apparently the government is rejecting 97% of caregiver visa requests).
But that's only the temporary foreign worker program. My understanding is that the regular, points based system continues to admit large numbers of new immigrants - and why wouldn't it, as appealing to new immigrants is a huge part of the Conservatives overall electoral strategy.
BB, universities are now finding it much more difficult to obtain working permits for foreign professors, visiting chairs etc. High tech companies are finding it very difficult to now bring in people on contracts (executives and employees) etc. Restaurants in this area are crying out for employees because they can't fill the void left by the cancellation of the program.
The system is a mess right now. The government didn't think before it reacted to what they perceived to be a political advantage of going anti-immigrant.
Put it this way, our immigration system is terrible at bringing in needed people in a timely way. The foreign worker program covered up a lot of those problems. And now it is gone.
Joan, surely you can see the potential for abuse under a program that grants a visa for the price of tuition.
Quote from: Tyr on May 25, 2015, 03:03:05 AM
That's a good thing though surely?
The point of foreign students should be they gain the advantage of education here then take that knowledge home to make their country a better place.
Going to university in a other country shouldn't be thought of just in terms of a quick immigration cheat - though that is definitely in large part how a lot of foreign students view it. Those ones need discouraging so they don't steal places from the actually dedicated.
Anyway. Don't see this taking immigrants wages thing working out at all. Illegals don't exactly have great intel about how things actually are in the uk and even if they did know about this they would still think it worth trying .
This is totally the wrong direction to go in for dealing with illegals. Treating them as criminals just pushes them underground. A lot of illegals head to the uk thinking they will get a job easily and be living In a lovely house within a year or two, ready for their family to come over and join them. They instead often end up borderline homeless occasionally casual workers who are worse off than at home.
We need to create an environment where they feel comfortable to come forward, pass on Intel about the scum bags who brought them over and be sent home.
I dislike
forcing our guest student out. If they want to return to dumbfuckistan, by all means that should be their choice. But letting the best and brightest of them experience 1st world living only to toss them back to the desperate poverty and joblessness of Shrewsbury seems cruel.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on May 25, 2015, 02:22:19 PM
Joan, surely you can see the potential for abuse under a program that grants a visa for the price of tuition.
But that isn't what is being advocated. If a foreign student excels at the finest universities in the US and obtains a job offer in the US after that training, what interest is served by turning them away?
Quote from: crazy canuck on May 25, 2015, 05:05:44 PM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on May 25, 2015, 02:22:19 PM
Joan, surely you can see the potential for abuse under a program that grants a visa for the price of tuition.
But that isn't what is being advocated. If a foreign student excels at the finest universities in the US and obtains a job offer in the US after that training, what interest is served by turning them away?
A less talented domestic graduate has a better shot at that job.
Quote from: Warspite on May 25, 2015, 05:23:10 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on May 25, 2015, 05:05:44 PM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on May 25, 2015, 02:22:19 PM
Joan, surely you can see the potential for abuse under a program that grants a visa for the price of tuition.
But that isn't what is being advocated. If a foreign student excels at the finest universities in the US and obtains a job offer in the US after that training, what interest is served by turning them away?
A less talented domestic graduate has a better shot at that job.
Sure, the lesser talented person loses out. But I was wondering what sort of abuses Yi has in mind.
Quote from: crazy canuck on May 25, 2015, 11:45:39 AM
BB, universities are now finding it much more difficult to obtain working permits for foreign professors, visiting chairs etc. High tech companies are finding it very difficult to now bring in people on contracts (executives and employees) etc. Restaurants in this area are crying out for employees because they can't fill the void left by the cancellation of the program.
The system is a mess right now. The government didn't think before it reacted to what they perceived to be a political advantage of going anti-immigrant.
Put it this way, our immigration system is terrible at bringing in needed people in a timely way. The foreign worker program covered up a lot of those problems. And now it is gone.
Maybe they could hire Canadian citizens instead.
Quote from: Ancient Demon on May 25, 2015, 10:06:56 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on May 25, 2015, 11:45:39 AM
BB, universities are now finding it much more difficult to obtain working permits for foreign professors, visiting chairs etc. High tech companies are finding it very difficult to now bring in people on contracts (executives and employees) etc. Restaurants in this area are crying out for employees because they can't fill the void left by the cancellation of the program.
The system is a mess right now. The government didn't think before it reacted to what they perceived to be a political advantage of going anti-immigrant.
Put it this way, our immigration system is terrible at bringing in needed people in a timely way. The foreign worker program covered up a lot of those problems. And now it is gone.
Maybe they could hire Canadian citizens instead.
Exactly. Insular universities have done wonders for China's higher ed academic reputation and Nobel Prize haul.
Quote from: Ancient Demon on May 25, 2015, 10:06:56 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on May 25, 2015, 11:45:39 AM
BB, universities are now finding it much more difficult to obtain working permits for foreign professors, visiting chairs etc. High tech companies are finding it very difficult to now bring in people on contracts (executives and employees) etc. Restaurants in this area are crying out for employees because they can't fill the void left by the cancellation of the program.
The system is a mess right now. The government didn't think before it reacted to what they perceived to be a political advantage of going anti-immigrant.
Put it this way, our immigration system is terrible at bringing in needed people in a timely way. The foreign worker program covered up a lot of those problems. And now it is gone.
Maybe they could hire Canadian citizens instead.
Maybe. But if Canadian universities hire less able professors, Deans etc what do you think will happen to the quality of university education in Canada. Who benefits from that very short sighted policy other than perhaps the less able would be university professor?
Quote from: crazy canuck on May 26, 2015, 10:32:22 AM
Quote from: Ancient Demon on May 25, 2015, 10:06:56 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on May 25, 2015, 11:45:39 AM
BB, universities are now finding it much more difficult to obtain working permits for foreign professors, visiting chairs etc. High tech companies are finding it very difficult to now bring in people on contracts (executives and employees) etc. Restaurants in this area are crying out for employees because they can't fill the void left by the cancellation of the program.
The system is a mess right now. The government didn't think before it reacted to what they perceived to be a political advantage of going anti-immigrant.
Put it this way, our immigration system is terrible at bringing in needed people in a timely way. The foreign worker program covered up a lot of those problems. And now it is gone.
Maybe they could hire Canadian citizens instead.
Maybe. But if Canadian universities hire less able professors, Deans etc what do you think will happen to the quality of university education in Canada. Who benefits from that very short sighted policy other than perhaps the less able would be university professor?
University professors are perhaps a bad example. It's a field where positions are notoriously difficult to obtain - where we have an ample field of qualified domestic candidates. Just because a foreign candidate might be marginally more qualified doesn't mean the domestic one is not qualified. It's also a field where, due to teaching requirements, there is an advantage in hiring professors whose first language is in fact english or french.
Quote from: Barrister on May 26, 2015, 11:11:11 AM
University professors are perhaps a bad example. It's a field where positions are notoriously difficult to obtain - where we have an ample field of qualified domestic candidates. Just because a foreign candidate might be marginally more qualified doesn't mean the domestic one is not qualified. It's also a field where, due to teaching requirements, there is an advantage in hiring professors whose first language is in fact english or french.
:huh:
I had posted a more detailed post but suffice to say just look around at the qualifications most Deans and professors have these days. You will see many have been educated in foreign universities and many are from other countries. I do not agree with your view that foreign candidates are "marginally more qualified". There are certainly times when a domestic candidate is best. But not always. And isn't hiring the best person the goal in such situations? Further, have you given any thought to the knock on affect of domestic academics not having opportunities in other countries?
Again, as Warspite said, this anti immigrant movement is madness
Quote from: crazy canuck on May 26, 2015, 12:02:27 PM
Quote from: Barrister on May 26, 2015, 11:11:11 AM
University professors are perhaps a bad example. It's a field where positions are notoriously difficult to obtain - where we have an ample field of qualified domestic candidates. Just because a foreign candidate might be marginally more qualified doesn't mean the domestic one is not qualified. It's also a field where, due to teaching requirements, there is an advantage in hiring professors whose first language is in fact english or french.
:huh:
Which part are you having difficulty with? Perhaps I can break it down using smaller words. :)
Quote from: Barrister on May 26, 2015, 12:31:28 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on May 26, 2015, 12:02:27 PM
Quote from: Barrister on May 26, 2015, 11:11:11 AM
University professors are perhaps a bad example. It's a field where positions are notoriously difficult to obtain - where we have an ample field of qualified domestic candidates. Just because a foreign candidate might be marginally more qualified doesn't mean the domestic one is not qualified. It's also a field where, due to teaching requirements, there is an advantage in hiring professors whose first language is in fact english or french.
:huh:
Which part are you having difficulty with? Perhaps I can break it down using smaller words. :)
Yes, if our education system becomes what you wish that is all that will be left.
The single most important determinant of a country's economic potential is the skills, ingenuity and work ethic of its population. And one of the most effective ways for a country to increase its economic potential is to attract such people. It is not as if the developed countries of the world have some kind of problem with rapidly increasing population - the situation is to the contrary. The prevailing immigration policies in the developed world are simply backwards - if common sense prevailed, one would expect to see lively competition between nations to attract and retain skilled immigrants, instead there is a bizarre race to impose onerous restrictions, with the ultimate beneficiary being the country that has the least stupidly counterproductive policy.
The driver here is that the lump of labor fallacy remains one of the most durable and unshakable economic fallacies.
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on May 26, 2015, 12:33:48 PM
The single most important determinant of a country's economic potential is the skills, ingenuity and work ethic of its population. And one of the most effective ways for a country to increase its economic potential is to attract such people. It is not as if the developed countries of the world have some kind of problem with rapidly increasing population - the situation is to the contrary. The prevailing immigration policies in the developed world are simply backwards - if common sense prevailed, one would expect to see lively competition between nations to attract and retain skilled immigrants, instead there is a bizarre race to impose onerous restrictions, with the ultimate beneficiary being the country that has the least stupidly counterproductive policy.
:yes:
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on May 26, 2015, 12:33:48 PM
the ultimate beneficiary being the country that has the least stupidly counterproductive policy.
Any idea what country that is? I'm asking for a friend.
https://youtu.be/768h3Tz4Qik