:lol:
QuoteAUSTIN, Texas (Reuters) - A decision from Texas Governor Greg Abbott to deploy the Texas State Guard to monitor a U.S. military training exercise some conspiracy theorists see as a prelude for federal occupation was met with puzzlement by the White House on Wednesday.
http://news.yahoo.com/white-house-texas-odds-over-military-drills-decried-215502570.html (http://news.yahoo.com/white-house-texas-odds-over-military-drills-decried-215502570.html)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/checkpoint/wp/2015/03/31/why-the-new-special-operations-exercise-freaking-out-the-internet-is-no-big-deal/ (http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/checkpoint/wp/2015/03/31/why-the-new-special-operations-exercise-freaking-out-the-internet-is-no-big-deal/)
:blink:
A little surprised over the reaction of the Governor of Texas. I don't know him but I presume that he must be a clear-headed, rational and intelligent individual with good common sense. Is there more to the story that I am not aware of?
Quote from: Monoriu on April 30, 2015, 02:09:48 AM
:blink:
A little surprised over the reaction of the Governor of Texas. I don't know him but I presume that he must be a clear-headed, rational and intelligent individual with good common sense. Is there more to the story that I am not aware of?
You should reconsider your presumptions.
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on April 30, 2015, 02:13:43 AM
Quote from: Monoriu on April 30, 2015, 02:09:48 AM
:blink:
A little surprised over the reaction of the Governor of Texas. I don't know him but I presume that he must be a clear-headed, rational and intelligent individual with good common sense. Is there more to the story that I am not aware of?
You should reconsider your presumptions.
I think the Texas state guard is there to learn from the exercises or even to participate in them. That seems to make more sense than "they are there to prevent federal troops from invading", which is dangerously close to anime fiction territory.
Quote from: Monoriu on April 30, 2015, 02:41:38 AM
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on April 30, 2015, 02:13:43 AM
Quote from: Monoriu on April 30, 2015, 02:09:48 AM
:blink:
A little surprised over the reaction of the Governor of Texas. I don't know him but I presume that he must be a clear-headed, rational and intelligent individual with good common sense. Is there more to the story that I am not aware of?
You should reconsider your presumptions.
I think the Texas state guard is there to learn from the exercises or even to participate in them. That seems to make more sense than "they are there to prevent federal troops from invading", which is dangerously close to anime fiction territory.
He says: "During the training operation, it is important that Texans know their safety, constitutional rights, private property rights and civil liberties will not be infringed."
Which translates to the casual reader: our state guard will make sure that our people are state from Los Federales.
Quote from: Syt on April 30, 2015, 03:00:09 AM
Quote from: Monoriu on April 30, 2015, 02:41:38 AM
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on April 30, 2015, 02:13:43 AM
Quote from: Monoriu on April 30, 2015, 02:09:48 AM
:blink:
A little surprised over the reaction of the Governor of Texas. I don't know him but I presume that he must be a clear-headed, rational and intelligent individual with good common sense. Is there more to the story that I am not aware of?
You should reconsider your presumptions.
I think the Texas state guard is there to learn from the exercises or even to participate in them. That seems to make more sense than "they are there to prevent federal troops from invading", which is dangerously close to anime fiction territory.
He says: "During the training operation, it is important that Texans know their safety, constitutional rights, private property rights and civil liberties will not be infringed."
Which translates to the casual reader: our state guard will make sure that our people are state from Los Federales.
I've heard about statism but this is ridiculous.
Quote from: Syt on April 30, 2015, 03:00:09 AM
He says: "During the training operation, it is important that Texans know their safety, constitutional rights, private property rights and civil liberties will not be infringed."
Which translates to the casual reader: our state guard will make sure that our people are state from Los Federales.
Yeah I read that, but it doesn't add up. It is a bit hard to believe that someone whose mind is so detached from reality can get elected to a governer position. I have considered the possibility that he is perfectly aware that what he is doing doesn't make sense, but he did it anyway because it pleases his voters. I also think this possibility is unlikely, because surely the vast majority of voters in Texas, if not all of them, are mentally sound and well informed.
So I am puzzled. I think there must be some crucial facts that have not been mentioned. It is hard for me to believe that the Governor of Texas bought such an obviously untrue conspiracy theory.
Are you really saying that he is crazy? :unsure:
I thought you guys had hit rock bottom with Perry, this is ridiculous.
Quote from: Monoriu on April 30, 2015, 03:15:44 AM
because surely the vast majority of voters in Texas, if not all of them, are mentally sound and well informed.
Again, no idea where you're getting this. :P
Most positive way to spin this is the governor is doing this to placate the paranoid populace rather then any suspicion on his part. However that's hardly what one would call good when so many Texans feel this way that the governor is compelled to act in this way.
I can't believe that the US military is operating like this in Texas. There have to be dozens of sites it can use to train without the risk that some wacko civilian will mistake the US military for invading aliens and start shooting or bombing. I suppose if there was some way that the governor of Texas could use the Texas ANG to protect US personnel and facilities the risk could be mitigated to a large degree, but who expects the Texas Guard to be any more sane than the average Texan?
If the US military needs a desert to train in, they can find one safer for their personnel than one in Texas. Like in Iraq, for instance.
Texans hate the troops.
Quote from: jimmy olsen on April 30, 2015, 03:26:01 AM
I thought you guys had hit rock bottom with Perry, this is ridiculous.
Let me just say I expected more from Abbott.
:lol: The Texas State Guard are basically disaster relief volunteers who don't have to get their regular clothes dirty. Abbott is "doing something" by "deploying" them, probably to get people to stop calling his office. Their monitoring will probably consist of hanging out at the nearest Starbucks.
Quote from: Monoriu on April 30, 2015, 03:15:44 AM
Yeah I read that, but it doesn't add up. It is a bit hard to believe that someone whose mind is so detached from reality can get elected to a governer position. I have considered the possibility that he is perfectly aware that what he is doing doesn't make sense, but he did it anyway because it pleases his voters. I also think this possibility is unlikely, because surely the vast majority of voters in Texas, if not all of them, are mentally sound and well informed.
The voters in Texas do not think this. Abbott does not think this. But the hardcore of Republican nutcases who must be pandered to do. If anybody wants to know why I basically vote straight Democrat now despite loathing them fiercely it is because of this kind of thing. We have completely insane and bizarre pronouncements from some of our officials being applauded by these nutcases. It is the result of decades of echo chamber conservative media around here eventually making the insane mainstream. Siege's schtick is almost a moderate position of these people.
Fortunately Abbot himself is basically a decent dude as far as politicians go, but he has to do these kinds of things for the base. He also has to, awkwardly, use their crazy ideology to justify logical policies as well. I liked how he suggested we stop completely whoring ourselves out to every international corp that comes by claiming 'the government should not be meddling in business'. Lolz. Being 'pro-business' is big gub'mint!
Quote from: MadBurgerMaker on April 30, 2015, 07:55:50 AM
:lol: The Texas State Guard are basically disaster relief volunteers who don't have to get their regular clothes dirty. Abbott is "doing something" by "deploying" them, probably to get people to stop calling his office. Their monitoring will probably consist of hanging out at the nearest Starbucks.
Yep. It is pandering. A stupid waste of state resources.
But um hasn't the guard been deployed over seas? Not sure I would characterize them that way anymore.
The Texas State Guard, not the National Guard. They don't go overseas.
Quote from: MadBurgerMaker on April 30, 2015, 08:13:27 AM
The Texas State Guard, not the National Guard.
Ooops. Yeah you are right. I keep forgetting the militia to the militia. Which is kind of funny since I used to run on the track right by their headquarters.
Quote from: Valmy on April 30, 2015, 08:18:53 AM
Which is kind of funny since I used to run on the track right by their headquarters.
Well hell, I've never even seen a person who is in that, let alone a whole building of theirs.
I wonder what kind of boats the "maritime regiment" has.
Quote from: MadBurgerMaker on April 30, 2015, 08:58:07 AM
Well hell, I've never even seen a person who is in that, let alone a whole building of theirs.
This was all pre-9/11. It used to be fairly crowded. Then they shut it down entirely. It is open again but you have to pass through security checkpoints and that is just a bit much to run on a track.
Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on April 30, 2015, 06:45:00 AM
Texans hate the troops.
A good chunk of the US Army infantry is from Texas, though not as many as it used to be 10 years ago.
Not that there is going to be any fight here.
This is clearly just a message for the pResident.
Quote from: Valmy on April 30, 2015, 09:04:10 AM
This was all pre-9/11. It used to be fairly crowded. Then they shut it down entirely. It is open again but you have to pass through security checkpoints and that is just a bit much to run on a track.
Just think about how fun it would be to jog in place while some DPS type tries to wand you!
I mean right up until they taze and beat you, but you get the idea.
Quote from: Siege on April 30, 2015, 09:27:47 AM
Not that there is going to be any fight here.
This is clearly just a message for the pResident.
What message is the pResident supposed to get out of this? Don't bother engaging in military activities in Texas? Fire the JCS for scheduling this exercise in Texas? The governor of Texas is a moron or a loon?
As for the idea that there isn't going to be a fight here, I hope not, but we are dealing with Texans, so who knows? Santa Anna tried to conduct a military exercise in Texas when it was part of mexico, and Texans started shooting at
his guys.
Everything I know about Texas, I learned from reading Joe R. Lansdale ... but that didn't prepare me for this. :(
Oh grumbler how I wish these sorts of people were confined to Texas.
Quote from: Siege on April 30, 2015, 09:27:47 AM
A good chunk of the US Army infantry is from Texas, though not as many as it used to be 10 years ago.
Not that there is going to be any fight here.
This is clearly just a message for the pResident.
The "message" is material to be used to humiliate his opposition.
Quote from: Valmy on April 30, 2015, 09:40:42 AM
Oh grumbler how I wish these sorts of people were confined to Texas.
There may be a tongue-in-cheek element to my posts.
Love this photo full of mouthbreathers:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fa5.img.talkingpointsmemo.com%2Fimage%2Fupload%2Fw_652%2Fd6ggodr16bp8tvjzgeef.jpg&hash=3948249bce68a87e5c6cd543ccc8287a78089316)
DONT TRAIN ON ME! (or tread btw kthx)
Quote from: grumbler on April 30, 2015, 09:35:36 AM
Quote from: Siege on April 30, 2015, 09:27:47 AM
Not that there is going to be any fight here.
This is clearly just a message for the pResident.
What message is the pResident supposed to get out of this? Don't bother engaging in military activities in Texas? Fire the JCS for scheduling this exercise in Texas? The governor of Texas is a moron or a loon?
As for the idea that there isn't going to be a fight here, I hope not, but we are dealing with Texans, so who knows? Santa Anna tried to conduct a military exercise in Texas when it was part of mexico, and Texans started shooting at his guys.
And I'm pretty sure you remember, since you were there, that Santa Annus exercise was exactly to provoke a fight.
Quote from: Siege on April 30, 2015, 09:27:47 AM
This is clearly just a message for the pResident.
Couldn't he send a nicely formatted letter, or call him on the phone? Is wasting government resources on this the best way to send a message?
Languish don't longer have the pulse of the country.
There is a lot of people out there that had to face the consequences of the missmanagement by this administration that are fed up with the feds.
Languish is a bunch of elitists liberals making judgement from their ivory towers.
Well that sucks. What a bummer.
Quote from: Siege on April 30, 2015, 11:56:46 AM
Languish don't longer have the pulse of the country.
We once had the pulse of the country? I mean not even sure most of us live here.
Also I am not sure thinking you are going to seize control of the country and make me your slave is the same as being concerned about federal mismanagement. But if those are your orders feel free to leak it.
Quote from: Siege on April 30, 2015, 11:56:46 AM
Languish is a bunch of elitists liberals making judgement from their ivory towers.
My tower's made of plywood. And I don't even own it. :(
My tower is made of faux ivory and is only one floor high.
As an Euroweenie I don't need an ivory tower as I am just a floating ball of light anyway.
Quote from: Zanza on April 30, 2015, 12:35:44 PM
As an Euroweenie I don't need an ivory tower as I am just a floating ball of light anyway.
Not to be confused with floating balls of light on top of towers.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg2.wikia.nocookie.net%2F__cb20140427122513%2Flotr%2Fimages%2F9%2F9f%2FSauron_eye_barad_dur.jpg&hash=862157cf6eff1e46979e63323178c7dfbc3e0f91)
Quote from: Syt on April 30, 2015, 12:39:21 PM
Not to be confused with floating balls of light on top of towers.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg2.wikia.nocookie.net%2F__cb20140427122513%2Flotr%2Fimages%2F9%2F9f%2FSauron_eye_barad_dur.jpg&hash=862157cf6eff1e46979e63323178c7dfbc3e0f91)
Oh hai dad.
I looked up a bit on Texas and the recent governers, then I stumbled upon this on Youtube.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0PAJNntoRgA
He was a serious contender in the Republican nomination race. But he said something about Obama's war on religion? Something wrong with this country when gays can serve openly in the military? Kids can't celebrate Christmas :blink:
Keep in mind Perry does not mean any of that. He says what he thinks his base wants to hear. Dude used to be a Democrat at one point. Last session they passed a bill 'saving' Christmas that Rick signed at a big ceremony surrounded by Santa Clauses. It was disgustingly cynical.
My fear is that people who actually believe these things will get elected.
"FOR THE LOVE OF HUMANITY, please have your liberals spayed or neutered!!"
Seeb, there used to be a time when you walked with people. Now all you do is talk at them.
Quote from: Siege on April 30, 2015, 03:08:28 PM
"FOR THE LOVE OF HUMANITY, please have your liberals spayed or neutered!!"
Where will the conservatives rebelling against their left-wing parents come from then?
Quote from: MadBurgerMaker on April 30, 2015, 09:34:26 AM
Quote from: Valmy on April 30, 2015, 09:04:10 AM
This was all pre-9/11. It used to be fairly crowded. Then they shut it down entirely. It is open again but you have to pass through security checkpoints and that is just a bit much to run on a track.
Just think about how fun it would be to jog in place while some DPS type tries to wand you!
I mean right up until they taze and beat you, but you get the idea.
Pardon me?
:ph34r:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ftsp.aceplace.net%2Fimg%2Fslider%2Fsites%2F7%2Fimages%2Fgallery%2Fd96409bf894217686ba124d7356686c9.jpg&hash=4b83534cc39c40083ef01231247ff97728651ca5)
Which one are you?
Quote from: Admiral Yi on April 30, 2015, 03:18:26 PM
Seeb, there used to be a time when you walked with people. Now all you do is talk at them.
Cut him some slack. He actually spelled all the words right in that post. Gotta be the first time he's done that in three years, so he might not be posting as part of his shtick.
Quote from: MadBurgerMaker on April 30, 2015, 05:11:18 PM
:ph34r:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ftsp.aceplace.net%2Fimg%2Fslider%2Fsites%2F7%2Fimages%2Fgallery%2Fd96409bf894217686ba124d7356686c9.jpg&hash=4b83534cc39c40083ef01231247ff97728651ca5)
Which one are you?
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/0e/a2/c7/0ea2c7b75874b5bb948b6422c13bc99d.jpg)
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages3.cinema.de%2Fimedia%2F0249%2F2300249%2Cyp%2BT7PMY5lKvdiJRNP2232rRcIxVh8A_S7N9IsWuz4QEwaEPZZrjpU%2BrJbihmueTTpJCTKIusJ0qmDEDRKo4WA%3D%3D.jpg&hash=4a2d97090497a72c6130e21f4f8af728bbcc1fa8)
QuoteYou listen to me, and you listen good! I am gonna kill every member of your family! I'm gonna hunt them down like the animals they are, and I'm gonna skin em' alive! They are going to feel the pain and suffering of every last victim! They're gonna crawl on on their hands and knees, and they're gonna beg me for mercy! But all I'm gonna have for them is pain! Pain and death!
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.ytimg.com%2Fvi%2Ff-FhSKPImqQ%2Fsddefault.jpg&hash=01325b80e44aff7a97f6d4bfd3fcbba4b1c9b428)
Quote from: Siege on April 30, 2015, 11:56:46 AM
Languish don't longer have the pulse of the country.
There is a lot of people out there that had to face the consequences of the missmanagement by this administration that are fed up with the feds.
Languish is a bunch of elitists liberals making judgement from their ivory towers.
So you are intentending to carry out illegal orders to conquer Texas.
Election years can be so much fun.
Quote from: Siege on April 30, 2015, 11:56:46 AM
Languish don't longer have the pulse of the country.
Do I have the pulse? :o
QuoteSeeb, there used to be a time when you walked with people. Now all you do is talk at them.
It's like Facebook :mellow:
Its interesting but I increasingly see parallels between the crazy far right US anti-gubment types and anti-EUers in Britain.
The left hate each respective body because they're much too liberal and utterly incompetent.
The right seem to think there's some master plan at work and they're all-powerful though.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/16/us/in-texas-a-military-exercise-is-met-by-some-with-suspicion.html?smid=fb-nytimes&smtyp=cur
QuoteIn Texas, a Military Exercise Is Met by Some With Suspicion
CHRISTOVAL, Tex. — The beige-metal community center on Main Street here next door to the fire station, the scene of 4-H Club meetings and family reunions, may never be the same. Jade Helm 15 is coming.
One resident said a friend of his, a Vietnam veteran, started burying some of his firearms to hide them. A farmer was rumored to have taken a different approach, by buying 20,000 rounds of ammunition. The superintendent of the school district thought he saw low-flying military cargo planes overhead. Members of the Christoval Volunteer Fire Department, which owns the community center, signed an agreement with military officials stating — oddly to some, suspiciously to others — that the Army will pay for any damage to the building after it uses it.
Sindy Miller, who runs a hair salon on Main Street, said fears of a military takeover have been the talk of this West Texas town, southeast of Midland.
"They're worried that they're going to come in and take their firearms away," Ms. Miller said. "Martial law, basically. I try not to listen to all these conspiracy-theory-type people. All they're worried about is their beer and their guns."
Jade Helm 15, an eight-week military exercise that has generated paranoia for months fueled by conservative bloggers and Internet postings, begins Wednesday in Texas and six other states: Arizona, Florida, Louisiana, Mississippi, New Mexico and Utah.
The Army's Green Berets, Navy SEALs and other Special Operations troops will be conducting drills on private property, military bases and some public facilities. According to military documents, more than 1,200 service members will participate in the operation in Texas, in more than a dozen mostly small towns and rural counties.
Army officials say there is no cause for alarm.
"The public can expect little disruption in their day-to-day activities since much of the exercise will be conducted in remote areas," the organizer of the exercise, the Army Special Operations Command at Fort Bragg, N.C., said in a statement Monday.
But in a larger sense, Jade Helm 15 has already caused disruptions, particularly in Texas.
On the orders of Gov. Greg Abbott, the Texas State Guard will monitor Jade Helm 15 from Camp Mabry in Austin, the state capital. So will at least one national group of unofficial monitors and protesters that calls itself Counter Jade Helm. It plans to have teams of volunteers follow Army vehicles and post their locations to its website. Army planners and local elected officials have been busy answering questions from apprehensive residents and holding briefings for the Sheriffs' Association of Texas, the San Angelo Tea Party and county commissioners.
Off-base training exercises involving role-playing are not new — candidates for the Army's Special Forces take part in a four-week drill known as Robin Sage in rural North Carolina — but the size and scope of Jade Helm 15 make it unusual.
The military exercise will train Special Operations troops in what Army planners call "unconventional warfare." The exercise is being conducted in rural Texas because the military needed "large areas of undeveloped land with low population densities with access to towns," and wanted soldiers to adapt to unfamiliar terrain as well as social and economic conditions, according to Army documents.
In East Texas, near the Louisiana border, the troops have permission in Marion County to use their aircraft on a private runway. The community center in Christoval will be used for, as one local official described it, "an altercation site." A nighttime helicopter "extraction" will unfold in Disaster City, a mock community in College Station where emergency responders train.
Local officials who have been briefed on the exercise say it is modeled after the French resistance to Nazi occupation during World War II. It calls for some military personnel to play the role of the occupiers and for others to work undetected as part of the resistance. Military maps show Texas and Utah as "hostile," other states as "permissive," and still others as uncertain but leaning hostile or friendly.
Much of the paranoia over Jade Helm 15 is the outgrowth of an anti-Obama sentiment that is widespread in Texas and parts of the Southwest.
"It stems from an absolute distrust with the Obama administration," said Judge Stephen C. Floyd of Tom Green County, its top elected official. "I share a lot of their distrust of the Obama administration and their rule-making, but I have a great deal of confidence in the U.S. military."
According to some right-wing bloggers and activists, the exercise is part of a secret plot by the Obama administration to impose martial law, confiscate firearms, invade red-state Texas or prepare for instituting "total population control." A report on Infowars, a website operated by Alex Jones, a libertarian-leaning talk radio host from Texas, suggested Helm was an acronym for Homeland Eradication of Local Militants.
Military organizers have not explained the meaning of the exercise's name, its slogan ("Master the Human Domain") or its logo, which features a Dutch wooden clog at the center of two intersecting arrows and a sword.
The level of realism sought by Army planners, and uncertainty about whether troops will try to blend in with civilians during the exercise, have heightened the curiosity and unease among some Texans. The military has told local officials that fire extinguishers will be at each training site and that some personnel may carry weapons loaded with blank ammunition or paintball-style training cartridges. According to a PowerPoint presentation prepared by military organizers for Texas officials, some Jade Helm 15 participants "may conduct suspicious activities" as part of their training and others "will be wearing civilian attire and driving civilian vehicles."
In April, Mr. Abbott was criticized for giving legitimacy to conspiracy theorists when he ordered the Texas State Guard to monitor Jade Helm 15. The governor has been getting regular updates since then about the preparations for the exercise, but a spokesman for him said he has no concerns about it. "The Special Operations Command has assured Texas that this exercise poses no risk to anyone, and the governor sees no reason to worry or doubt them," said the spokesman, John Wittman.
In Christoval, an unincorporated town of about 500, Scott Degenaer, 53, smoked a cigarillo outside his home and said he was not sure what to think about Jade Helm 15. But he had suspicions. Two flags flapped in the breeze on his porch: an American flag and a Confederate battle flag. Signs on his house and in the yard read, "Pray for America" and "Warning: The door you are about to break down is locked for your protection!"
Mr. Degenaer, a Navy veteran, said that he saw a Black Hawk helicopter flying over Christoval on Sunday, and that he understood the paranoia that would lead some people to bury firearms.
"With Obama being in there," he said, "with the way he's already stomped all over the Constitution, pushing his presidential authority to the max, it would only be just the stroke of a pen for him to do away with that. This man is just totally anti-U.S. I mean, he just signed a deal with Iran."
Throughout the interview, Mr. Degenaer was skeptical whether the reporter and photographer who spoke with him were members of the news media and wondered if they were part of Jade Helm 15. "Spec Ops grows beards," he said, referring to the photographer's facial hair. "Y'all got a military ID?"
While much of the attention on Jade Helm 15 has focused on conspiracy theories, Army planners have spent months quietly persuading private property owners and small-town leaders to welcome them to their communities. Many local officials and ranchers have granted troops access to their land and buildings, without asking for compensation in return.
In the West Texas town of Eldorado, the local authorities gave the Army approval to use a vacant hospital for office space, although the Army did not ask to use it. And Eldorado's longtime mayor, John Nikolauk, said he is allowing the troops to use his ranch.
"We're a very patriotic part of the country and we think it's great," said Mr. Nikolauk, a former United States Air Force pilot.
Mr. Nikolauk and other local officials said they considered the Internet rumors about Jade Helm 15 far-fetched.
"If the government has an idea they can come in and take over, and take guns away, the stupidest place they could come is West Texas," said Bill Ford, a commissioner in Tom Green County whose district includes Christoval. "There's more guns and ammo here and more people willing to use them than any combat area they've fought in. Bad things aren't going to happen here."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dBP4bimRFU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dBP4bimRFU)
Le sigh