MUH PECANS!
http://www.slate.com/articles/life/holidays/2013/11/pecan_prices_why_china_s_demand_has_made_thanksgiving_pies_more_expensive.html
QuoteWhy Pecan Pies Have Gotten So Expensive? It's China's fault!
By Beth Goulart
What's more American than apple pie? Pecan pie. The world's first apple tree grew in Asia millennia ago. But the pecan tree is a native American. How appropriate, then, that pecans enjoy a place of honor on the table at Thanksgiving, a deeply homegrown holiday.
But hold the whipped cream. Pecan pie is expensive this year! Where I live in Austin, Texas, pecan pies are clearing $20 each at bakeries around town. In coastal cities like New York and San Francisco, where labor and overhead are higher, a 9-inch pie can set a pilgrim back as much as $34. Even at these prices, bakeries are selling pecan pies at a loss. Why so costly?
The cost of pecans is fully exposed to the economic push and pull of supply and demand—the government doesn't support pecan prices the way it does sugar prices, for instance. So when the most populous country in the world suddenly developed an insatiable and totally unprecedented hunger for pecans, demand skyrocketed. The price of pecans did, too.
James McWilliams (an occasional Slate contributor) tells the story in his new book, The Pecan: A History of America's Native Nut. The year was 2006, and the scene was a food trade show in Paris. An official from New Mexico's Department of Agriculture introduced a group of Chinese buyers to pecans, an important crop for that state. "The Chinese cracked them open, sampled them, and were intrigued—so intrigued," writes McWilliams, "that they traveled to New Mexico to meet growers, tour orchards, and discuss tentative contracts." At the time, China didn't import any pecans, and it didn't (still doesn't) grow any, either. No one in China ate pecans.
And yet, after only a couple of years and a bit of savvy marketing, a craze for pecans had gripped the Chinese like quinoa in California. Advertisements touted their antioxidants, claiming them capable of extending life and fending off Alzheimer's. China's exploding middle class has disposable income and considers the pecan a snack worth splurging on. The Chinese now eat pecans like we eat pistachios—partially shelled and brined, then roasted for extra salty-crunchy goodness.
By 2009 China had gone from not having a word for "pecan" to importing 83 million pounds—a quarter of the U.S. crop. With a public willing to pay between $10 and $15 a pound, importers began actively courting pecan growers in other states, like Georgia and Texas. "In 2005," writes McWilliams, "pecans were a novelty item in China. Today they can be found, as one newspaper reports, 'at gas stations, airports, and every grocery store in China.'
What does that mean for American pecan growers? Jake Montz planted his first pecan trees in 1987 and now grows some 25,000 trees' worth on his farm in Wichita Falls, Texas. These days about 25 percent of his crop goes to China. He sells another quarter in his own two nut shops, and the remainder goes to a shelling company that will, in turn, sell the nutmeats to grocery stores and companies that manufacture ice cream and breakfast cereals.
Conditions this year have squeezed his supply even more than usual. Severe drought in Texas has stretched on for three years now, and the pecan trees have suffered. Making matters worse, three late freezes decimated this year's crop. But he still has to pay his ever-rising costs—fuel, electricity, equipment, labor. Fortunately, high demand both domestically and from China means prices are high. "I'd rather have a big crop and sell them a little cheaper," says Montz. Unfortunately, that's not happening this year.
Professional bakers would love for pecans to be a little cheaper, too. In the mid-1990s, my local bakery, Texas French Bread, sold pecan pies for $10 to $12 each ($15 to $18 in today's dollars). Today, owner Murph Willcott pays more than $11 a pound for the fancy pecan halves that go into pies he can afford to sell only at Thanksgiving. Chopped nuts, usually sold as "pieces," would be cheaper, but the pies wouldn't look as nice. "The halves are prettier," he says, "so we try to use them." Willcott also values the freshest nuts. Though some bakers use nuts that are a year or two old, he says, "What you want is the one that's just been shelled, that is really beautiful and perfect. Those are really hard to find at this point." As a pecan ages, with or without its shell, it loses moisture and thus plumpness. An old pecan just isn't as pretty as a fresh pecan, and pretty matters—especially when people are paying more than $20 for a pie.
Willcott's pecan pies will sell for $22 this year, but that won't cover the cost of making them. "So we'll eat it on that one," he says, "and our margin won't be what we want it to be. But we'll make them anyway." Another Austin bakery, Walton's Fancy and Staple, has addressed pecans' soaring cost by pricing all its Thanksgiving pies at $22. This way, the lower cost of producing pies made with ingredients that happen to be cheaper—pumpkin, for instance—helps offset the more expensive pecan. But even using this strategy, Walton's has had to raise prices over the past several years, says culinary director Justin Raiford.
What does the pecan boom mean for people who bake their own pies? In 2008 pecans retailed for $3.50 a pound, according to McWilliams. In 2010 they were up to $6.95. Now, at my local grocery store, I pay $10.99 for pecan halves and $9.99 for pieces. My pecan pie recipe calls for three-quarters of a cup of each.
That means pecans are now the most expensive item when I prorate the prices on my ingredient list. Butter comes next (we use organic), then the corn syrup (don't judge me before you taste my pie), and maple syrup (Vermont's a long way away). When I add it all up, I find it will cost me $11.73 to make a pecan pie from scratch. Of course, we'll have to double that at Thanksgiving. One pecan pie is never enough.
Great for American pecan growers. :)
Now if the Chinese would only develop a taste for fruit cake.
MAH MEME
Fruit pie: :x
Cal, aren't you growing pecans on that small estate of yours? If not, here's your chance to make some big bucks!
Quote from: Tyr on November 27, 2013, 06:06:36 AM
Fruit pie: :x
Pecan pie is nuts and sugar. No fruit included.
Must be why this stuff got so pricey:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fbeerpulse.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2012%2F09%2FClownShoes-Genghis-Pecan-2.png&hash=f1d569928c8c603f6026a42cb76a931dd709de82)
Maybe it's time to start making pies from peanuts.
Oh I saw pecan pies at the grocery store, baked goods section for 5.99.
Betcha they're made with pecan pieces.
Possible. I didn't examine.
Hop to it.
Store is closed today.
You dodged a bullet there.
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on November 28, 2013, 03:14:25 PM
Maybe it's time to start making pies from peanuts.
It can be done. See my post in the Thanksgiving thread.
I love pecan pie. But the king of American baked goods is still the pumpkin pie :mmm:
Quote from: KRonn on November 27, 2013, 08:31:19 AM
Cal, aren't you growing pecans on that small estate of yours? If not, here's your chance to make some big bucks!
Nah. I may try those eventually but they take forever to mature and produce nuts.
Quote from: Sheilbh on December 01, 2013, 05:16:24 AM
I love pecan pie. But the king of American baked goods is still the pumpkin pie :mmm:
No way man. Pecan pie >>>>>>>> pumpkin pie (though I do like the latter). I had no pumpkin pie at Thanksgiving because I was saving all the room for pie in my belly for pecan pie.
Apple
Quote from: garbon on December 01, 2013, 11:53:32 PM
Apple
Agreed.
There is apple pie, then there is everything else.
Every year on my birthday I'm asked what kind of birthday cake I might like. Each year I reply the same "apple pie".
Only once have I received an apple pie for my birthday. :(
Apple pie is the Budweiser of pies.
Coconut creme and banana creme are the Champagne pies.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on December 02, 2013, 01:33:47 AM
Apple pie is the Budweiser of pies.
Coconut creme and banana creme are the Champagne pies.
Strenuously disagree.
Cream pies are all about the sweet.
An apple pie is more complex - it's the tartness balanced against the sweetness. It's the in and yang of pies.
Quote from: Barrister on December 02, 2013, 01:39:41 AM
Cream pies are all about the sweet.
They're mostly about the velvety texture.
Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on November 27, 2013, 10:08:06 AM
Quote from: Tyr on November 27, 2013, 06:06:36 AM
Fruit pie: :x
What a fucking idiot.
Honest mistake. Tyr's thinking of pies made by Jim Pecan, who while completely sane is quite fruity.
Maybe
Pecans pies while tasty, should really be called corn syrup pies, but I guess that doesn't sound as nice.
I add my vote to BB's apple pie nomination for best pie. Also, am I the only person who likes rhubarb pie?
I agree with Yi and Sheilbh. :) Apple is plebeian, pumpkin is sovereign, and coconut cream is sublime.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on December 02, 2013, 09:55:41 AM
I agree with Yi and Sheilbh. :) Apple is plebeian, pumpkin is sovereign, and coconut cream is sublime.
Your taste is all in your mouth.
Apple pie is complex, pumpkin much less so, and coconut cream last of all. Good apple pie is as good as pie gets, though people who have never had good apple pie might not realize that. Good pumpkin pie (spices balanced just right) is right up there, but not quite as good. The worst pumpkin pie is probably still better than the worst apple pie. The best coconut cream and the worst coconut cream are pretty much indistinguishable, though both are pretty tasty (if you can stand coconut at all) in a mediocre sort of way.
I've never had a bad coconut cream pie, but the spread between "worst ever" and "best ever" is pretty narrow.
The only time I've ever had a bad pumpkin pie was one year when my wife did not follow the recipe accurately and put in 1/4th the amount of sugar called for--it resulted in basically something that tastes like unsweetened pumpkin filling which is really pretty horrifying. But normally unless you commit such an offense you can't fuck pumpkin pie up. Now, I have had creative pumpkin pies that go to a new level with toppings and different spices that are really, really good.
Apple pie is regularly mediocre, but when done correctly is amazing--grumbler is essentially correct on all points. I think a good Key Lime pie is also a thing of wonder, and it's very often done badly.
Good lemon meringue pie is the best, with perfect tartness. All non homemade lemon meringue pie is crap, too sweet and with insubstantial meringue. My mom is one of the few who makes it right.
The only thing better than good apple pie is a good apple crisp.
Which is just an apple pie with delicious crumbly topping.
Another Euro vote for the superiority of the pumpkin over the pecan. I much prefer a savoury meat or cheese pie, but treacle tart is the king of pastry-based desserts.
Quote from: HVC on December 02, 2013, 08:40:58 AM
Also, am I the only person who likes rhubarb pie?
You are not.
My mother doesn't do many pies, but she has a holiday apple bread recipe that knocks Santa's socks off. And her pumpkin nut bread is divine.
Like some have already said...I generally dislike apple pie, but I've also had apple pie that was absolutely divine.
Pumpkin pie can also be good, and sometimes bad.
But the king of pies, is Key Lime. As said above, bad key lime pie is very bed, but great key lime pie is food of the Hods.
I may have to suspend judgement, though, as I don't think I've ever had a coconut cream pie. :hmm:
Quote from: HVC on December 02, 2013, 08:40:58 AM
Pecans pies while tasty, should really be called corn syrup pies, but I guess that doesn't sound as nice.
I add my vote to BB's apple pie nomination for best pie. Also, am I the only person who likes rhubarb pie?
I like rhubarb pie, but around here it's rare to find it. Sometimes you see it mixed with some other fruit (apple-rhubarb pie, etc.)
Tart cherries are one of the principle crops of Michigan, so up there the cherry pies are the best. There are even laws in Michigan requiring a certain number of cherries in order for it to be sold as cherry pie.
Here in Florida key lime pies are the best; even the grocery stores will sell very good key lime pies.
Quote from: Savonarola on December 02, 2013, 07:21:29 PM
Tart cherries are one of the principle crops of Michigan, so up there the cherry pies are the best. There are even laws in Michigan requiring a certain number of cherries in order for it to be sold as cherry pie.
Here in Florida key lime pies are the best; even the grocery stores will sell very good key lime pies.
And Michigan cherry butter. :mmm:
Quote from: Savonarola on December 02, 2013, 07:21:29 PM
There are even laws in Michigan requiring a certain number of cherries in order for it to be sold as cherry pie.
How much do they pay the cherry counter?
Quote from: Admiral Yi on December 02, 2013, 07:33:22 PM
Quote from: Savonarola on December 02, 2013, 07:21:29 PM
There are even laws in Michigan requiring a certain number of cherries in order for it to be sold as cherry pie.
How much do they pay the cherry counter?
A pittance :(
:P
Quote from: Savonarola on December 02, 2013, 07:21:29 PM
Tart cherries are one of the principle crops of Michigan, so up there the cherry pies are the best. There are even laws in Michigan requiring a certain number of cherries in order for it to be sold as cherry pie.
Here in Florida key lime pies are the best; even the grocery stores will sell very good key lime pies.
From my month in Panama City, I can attest that this is true. Though the pie at Uncle Ernie's bayside grill (noted as one of the best in that area) eclipsed those by a huge margin. And I imagine PC is not even really in core key lime territory.
I gotta admit i don't get the fuss over key lime pie.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on December 02, 2013, 10:19:58 PM
I gotta admit i don't get the fuss over key lime pie.
I don't either.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on December 02, 2013, 10:19:58 PM
I gotta admit i don't get the fuss over key lime pie.
They must've watched too much Dexter.
Quote from: frunk on December 02, 2013, 11:39:34 AM
Good lemon meringue pie is the best, with perfect tartness.
:mmm:
Blueberry pie>Apple Pie=Pumpkin Pie>Any other crappy creme pies
Quote from: sbr on December 03, 2013, 12:33:38 AM
Blueberry pie>Apple Pie=Pumpkin Pie>Any other crappy creme pies
:)
Quote from: grumbler on December 02, 2013, 11:25:40 AM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on December 02, 2013, 09:55:41 AM
I agree with Yi and Sheilbh. :) Apple is plebeian, pumpkin is sovereign, and coconut cream is sublime.
Your taste is all in your mouth.
Apple pie is complex, pumpkin much less so, and coconut cream last of all. Good apple pie is as good as pie gets, though people who have never had good apple pie might not realize that. Good pumpkin pie (spices balanced just right) is right up there, but not quite as good. The worst pumpkin pie is probably still better than the worst apple pie. The best coconut cream and the worst coconut cream are pretty much indistinguishable, though both are pretty tasty (if you can stand coconut at all) in a mediocre sort of way.
I've had the "real" apple and pumpkin pies you speak of. My sister-in-law makes them, makes great pies from scratch. Store bought are usually second rate compared, unless I can find a bakery that makes them well. My mother made the real pies too. So I have a tough time with the store bought stuff, especially the ones that substitute good fillings with too much sugary glop.
Quote from: Berkut on December 02, 2013, 12:06:55 PM
The only thing better than good apple pie is a good apple crisp.
Which is just an apple pie with delicious crumbly topping.
That's the stuff. :mmm: