http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2415871/Yemeni-child-bride-8-dies-internal-injuries-night-forced-marriage-groom-40.html
I know this is in the mail, but this is free of commentary and the bashing of the fuzzy wuzzies. The thing is that this custom has religious and tribal sanction. This is normal in this place, though it seems 8 is at the lower end of the age range. I also observe that Yemei law as it is explained explicitly is in breach of the UN convention of Human Rights when it prevents the girl from being free to choose her own husband. This is one of those stories that I can't get angry about because I don't think I can muster the kind of rage that this deserves. I just feel sad and disappointed.
This doesn't seem to be a report of the actual event, but rather of the reaction of yemeni womens rights activists to this. This marriage was reported in the news a few weeks ago and was still carried out.
QuoteYemeni child bride, eight, dies of internal injuries on first night of forced marriage to groom five times her age
'Rawan' died in the tribal area of Hardh, which borders Saudi Arabia
Activists have called for groom and family to be arrested over her death
One activist: 'Groom is an animal who deserved to be punished severely'
An eight-year-old child bride has died in Yemen of internal bleeding sustained during her wedding night after being forced to marry a man five times her age, activists have claimed.
The girl, identified only as Rawan, died in the tribal area of Hardh in northwestern Yemen, which borders Saudi Arabia.
Activists are now calling for the groom, who is believed to be around 40 years old, and her family to be arrested so they can face justice in the courts.
They say arrests would help put a stop to the practice of marrying very young girls to older men in the impoverished region.
Angry Man, a blogger, posted that the man was 'an animal who deserved to be punished severely for his crime'.
'All those who supported such a crime should also be punished,' he added.
Another blogger, called Omar, wrote: 'Rawan's family members are not humans. They do not deserve to have children.'
But another blogger, called 'Sad', appeared more sympathetic to the custom. He wrote: 'Her family and her groom could have waited for some time before having this marriage,' Sad said.
'It was not fair at all and the marriage should not have happened even if some tribes believe that it is a good custom.'
The practice of marrying young girls is widespread in Yemen and has attracted the attention of international rights groups seeking to pressure the government to outlaw child marriages.
Yemen's gripping poverty plays a role in hindering efforts to stamp out the practice, as poor families find themselves unable to say no to 'bride-prices' that can be hundreds of dollars for their daughters.
More than a quarter of Yemen's females marry before age 15, according to a report in 2010 by the Social Affairs Ministry.
Tribal custom also plays a role, including the belief that a young bride can be shaped into an obedient wife, bear more children and be kept away from temptation.
In September 2010, a 12-year-old Yemeni child-bride died after struggling for three days in labour to give birth, a local human rights organisation said.
Yemen once set 15 as the minimum age for marriage, but parliament annulled that law in the 1990s, saying parents should decide when a daughter marries.
I read that on German language sites, but it appears that Yemeni authorities deny that this incidence occurred?
That said, the child marriage customs in that part of the world are reprehensible to say the least.
Even if it didn't happen it's bringing more notice and response to the issue of women's rights for this kind of issue and many others facing girls and women.
Henry VII's mother was 12 at the age of conception, 13 at the age of birth.
It almost killed the 2 of them, and she never had another a child.
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on September 10, 2013, 02:22:27 PM
Henry VII's mother was 12 at the age of conception, 13 at the age of birth.
It almost killed the 2 of them, and she never had another a child.
Yes, the problem is that the 12 year old is 50% older than that other girl.
More 3rd World charms for the fans of multiculturalism *sneer*
G.
Yup. I'd like to hear what my old "multiculturalism at any cost" Sociology prof would have had to say about this.
Quote from: The Brain on September 10, 2013, 03:06:48 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on September 10, 2013, 02:22:27 PM
Henry VII's mother was 12 at the age of conception, 13 at the age of birth.
It almost killed the 2 of them, and she never had another a child.
You're saying Moslems are worse than medieval? That's pretty racist.
One of the defenses muslim apologists give for the evil in their book is that it is just as bad as the old testament. Same logic applies. Going Medieval or Going Old Testament on somebody are euphemisms for being violent and sadistic. So yes, it is as bad as the old testament and here it manages to be worse than the middle ages.
When these laws are demanded to be in affect in the US or Canada, you'll have an argument against multiculturalism. Until then, I accept that there is good in bad in every culture, and I will be happy to accept the good.
Quote from: merithyn on September 10, 2013, 03:14:10 PM
When these laws are demanded to be in affect in the US or Canada, you'll have an argument against multiculturalism. Until then, I accept that there is good in bad in every culture, and I will be happy to accept the good.
And the good in this bad is what?
Quote from: The Brain on September 10, 2013, 03:17:22 PM
Quote from: merithyn on September 10, 2013, 03:14:10 PM
When these laws are demanded to be in affect in the US or Canada, you'll have an argument against multiculturalism. Until then, I accept that there is good in bad in every culture, and I will be happy to accept the good.
And the good in this bad is what?
Yemen, distant land of poverty, becomes a go-to destination for pedophiles? :hmm:
Quote from: merithyn on September 10, 2013, 03:14:10 PM
When these laws are demanded to be in affect in the US or Canada, you'll have an argument against multiculturalism. Until then, I accept that there is good in bad in every culture, and I will be happy to accept the good.
So you think it is ok for little girls to be married off and raped at 8? Seriously, this is ok if their culture says it is ok?
This is how you get the rotten idea that for the most part only countries where human rights are respected get condemned for human rights abuse by anybody other than the US State Department and the better international human rights groups.
Quote from: Viking on September 10, 2013, 03:26:13 PM
Quote from: merithyn on September 10, 2013, 03:14:10 PM
When these laws are demanded to be in affect in the US or Canada, you'll have an argument against multiculturalism. Until then, I accept that there is good in bad in every culture, and I will be happy to accept the good.
So you think it is ok for little girls to be married off and raped at 8? Seriously, this is ok if their culture says it is ok?
This is how you get the rotten idea that for the most part only countries where human rights are respected get condemned for human rights abuse by anybody other than the US State Department and the better international human rights groups.
That isn't what she said. :lol:
Seriously.
The story, of course is terrible.
The only good thing I can think to say is that even in Yemen and Afghanistan child marriages are "controversial" at best. They are also countries with extremely weak rule of law. They are probably no more representative of the wider islamic world than the child marriages in Mormon polygamous communities are representative of the West.
Quote from: Viking on September 10, 2013, 03:26:13 PMSo you think it is ok for little girls to be married off and raped at 8? Seriously, this is ok if their culture says it is ok?
Come on grallon, even for you that's a ridiculous straw man.
Quote from: Barrister on September 10, 2013, 03:30:45 PM
The story, of course is terrible.
The only good thing I can think to say is that even in Yemen and Afghanistan child marriages are "controversial" at best. They are also countries with extremely weak rule of law. They are probably no more representative of the wider islamic world than the child marriages in Mormon polygamous communities are representative of the West.
http://www.girlsnotbrides.org/country/yemen/
QuoteUNICEF 2012 % MARRIED BY 15
11%
So you are comparing an activity which is illegal in the US and conducted by a few hundred people with an activity which is legal in yemen and happens to at least 11% of all girls?
You are comparing 1,000,000 women just in yemen to the FLDS and the followers of the scumbag and rapist Warren Jeffs?
(how did I get 1 million? the population of yemen is over 20 million now and 11% of the half of 20 million is more than 1 million)
So it is much much much much much more representative of the wider islamic world, at least, yemen, than the FLDS is of the west. We are talking 4 orders of magnitude here.
Quote from: Malthus on September 10, 2013, 03:27:11 PM
Quote from: Viking on September 10, 2013, 03:26:13 PM
Quote from: merithyn on September 10, 2013, 03:14:10 PM
When these laws are demanded to be in affect in the US or Canada, you'll have an argument against multiculturalism. Until then, I accept that there is good in bad in every culture, and I will be happy to accept the good.
So you think it is ok for little girls to be married off and raped at 8? Seriously, this is ok if their culture says it is ok?
This is how you get the rotten idea that for the most part only countries where human rights are respected get condemned for human rights abuse by anybody other than the US State Department and the better international human rights groups.
That isn't what she said. :lol:
Seriously.
That is the consequence of what she said. It would matter to her if it came to her home, but as long as it is in third world shitholistan then she's all for cultural tolerance.
No Puff, I think you got it totally wrong.
I believe the part you are missing is that she already condemns child marriage-rape, but doesn't consider that part of multiculturalism(tm) since it isn't practiced in the West, i.e. the zone in which multiculturalism has relevance.
Why do we keep bringing up culture when discussing "them".
Quote from: lustindarkness on September 10, 2013, 03:50:05 PM
Why do we keep bringing up culture when discussing "them".
Because religion gets lonely.
Quote from: Viking on September 10, 2013, 03:43:49 PM
Quote from: Malthus on September 10, 2013, 03:27:11 PM
Quote from: Viking on September 10, 2013, 03:26:13 PM
Quote from: merithyn on September 10, 2013, 03:14:10 PM
When these laws are demanded to be in affect in the US or Canada, you'll have an argument against multiculturalism. Until then, I accept that there is good in bad in every culture, and I will be happy to accept the good.
So you think it is ok for little girls to be married off and raped at 8? Seriously, this is ok if their culture says it is ok?
This is how you get the rotten idea that for the most part only countries where human rights are respected get condemned for human rights abuse by anybody other than the US State Department and the better international human rights groups.
That isn't what she said. :lol:
Seriously.
That is the consequence of what she said. It would matter to her if it came to her home, but as long as it is in third world shitholistan then she's all for cultural tolerance.
That, too, isn't what she said, or the consequence of what she said.
What she said was that the vileness of this practice isn't evidence against "multiculturalism" in the US, unless people try to legally import it there.
Of course it is. This is their culture. This is the argument used to defend the practice by those who practice it, and, in effect, the argument used to condone it by those who benefit from living in a culture where this doesn't happen.
Quote from: Viking on September 10, 2013, 03:58:53 PM
Of course it is. This is their culture. This is the argument used to defend the practice by those who practice it, and, in effect, the argument used to condone it by those who benefit from living in a culture where this doesn't happen.
Um, no it isn't. At least as the vast majority view "multiculturalism". Can't speak for Meri, but the vast majority of non-extremists have no problem saying that people are perfectly welcome tto import and practice their cultural norms here, such as wearing a funny hat, eating funny food, or talking funny, as long as they obey the laws of our society - meaning no raping, no murdering, no cannibalism, etc. Hence, they are welcome to practice "the good" (or at least "the not-evil"), but they must leave "the bad" at the border.
You are suffering a case of grallon-itis, defined as an inability to respond to the argument actually made.
Quote from: Viking on September 10, 2013, 03:42:42 PM
Quote from: Barrister on September 10, 2013, 03:30:45 PM
The story, of course is terrible.
The only good thing I can think to say is that even in Yemen and Afghanistan child marriages are "controversial" at best. They are also countries with extremely weak rule of law. They are probably no more representative of the wider islamic world than the child marriages in Mormon polygamous communities are representative of the West.
http://www.girlsnotbrides.org/country/yemen/
QuoteUNICEF 2012 % MARRIED BY 15
11%
So you are comparing an activity which is illegal in the US and conducted by a few hundred people with an activity which is legal in yemen and happens to at least 11% of all girls?
You are comparing 1,000,000 women just in yemen to the FLDS and the followers of the scumbag and rapist Warren Jeffs?
(how did I get 1 million? the population of yemen is over 20 million now and 11% of the half of 20 million is more than 1 million)
So it is much much much much much more representative of the wider islamic world, at least, yemen, than the FLDS is of the west. We are talking 4 orders of magnitude here.
I did say "the wider islamic world", and not just Yemen.
Your link is interesting, as it links to a bunch of different countries. Almost all of which have very low rates of child marriage. Afghanistan, predictably, is horribly at a 15% rate under the age of 15. Saudi Arabia though has no data, and a couple of links showing the Saudi government cracking down on it. War-torn iraq is at 3%. Egypt 2%. Indonesia 4%. Algeria 1%. Turkey 3%.
So clearly child marriage is more of a problem in the arab world than it is in the west. But in both places it is in the minority. Even in conservative Saudi Arabia they don't generally support child marriages.
Quote from: Viking on September 10, 2013, 03:43:49 PMThat is the consequence of what she said. It would matter to her if it came to her home, but as long as it is in third world shitholistan then she's all for cultural tolerance.
:lmfao:
Quote from: Malthus on September 10, 2013, 04:06:57 PM
Quote from: Viking on September 10, 2013, 03:58:53 PM
Of course it is. This is their culture. This is the argument used to defend the practice by those who practice it, and, in effect, the argument used to condone it by those who benefit from living in a culture where this doesn't happen.
Um, no it isn't. At least as the vast majority view "multiculturalism". Can't speak for Meri, but the vast majority of non-extremists have no problem saying that people are perfectly welcome tto import and practice their cultural norms here, such as wearing a funny hat, eating funny food, or talking funny, as long as they obey the laws of our society - meaning no raping, no murdering, no cannibalism, etc. Hence, they are welcome to practice "the good" (or at least "the not-evil"), but they must leave "the bad" at the border.
I suppose the Quebec stance would be that the bits in bold are just parts/signifiers of "the bad."
Quote from: garbon on September 10, 2013, 04:19:06 PM
Quote from: Malthus on September 10, 2013, 04:06:57 PM
Quote from: Viking on September 10, 2013, 03:58:53 PM
Of course it is. This is their culture. This is the argument used to defend the practice by those who practice it, and, in effect, the argument used to condone it by those who benefit from living in a culture where this doesn't happen.
Um, no it isn't. At least as the vast majority view "multiculturalism". Can't speak for Meri, but the vast majority of non-extremists have no problem saying that people are perfectly welcome tto import and practice their cultural norms here, such as wearing a funny hat, eating funny food, or talking funny, as long as they obey the laws of our society - meaning no raping, no murdering, no cannibalism, etc. Hence, they are welcome to practice "the good" (or at least "the not-evil"), but they must leave "the bad" at the border.
I suppose the Quebec stance would be that the bits in bold are just parts/signifiers of "the bad."
Yup.
Quote from: derspiess on September 10, 2013, 02:47:48 PM
Yup. I'd like to hear what my old "multiculturalism at any cost" Sociology prof would have had to say about this.
I'm unclear what "multiculturalism" has to to do with this. I wasn't aware that Yemen was a multiculturalist society.
Viking's insistence that allowing Quebecois Sikhs to wear turbans will lead to a significant increase in the rape and murder of eight year old girls is easily disproven by examining actual facts.
Quote from: Grallon on September 10, 2013, 02:27:13 PM
More 3rd World charms for the fans of multiculturalism *sneer*
G.
An odd statement. Surely the Yemenis would argue that this is part of their native culture, not them accepting the foreign culture of some immigrants. Besides, I thought you were pro-child rape.
Quote from: Jacob on September 10, 2013, 04:28:32 PM
Viking's insistence that allowing Quebecois Sikhs to wear turbans will lead to a significant increase in the rape and murder of eight year old girls is easily disproven by examining actual facts.
You got it all wrong.
It's the Jews wearing Kippahs that will lead to child-rape and murder. :Joos
Quote from: Malthus on September 10, 2013, 04:36:17 PM
Quote from: Jacob on September 10, 2013, 04:28:32 PM
Viking's insistence that allowing Quebecois Sikhs to wear turbans will lead to a significant increase in the rape and murder of eight year old girls is easily disproven by examining actual facts.
You got it all wrong.
It's the Jews wearing Kippahs that will lead to child-rape and murder. :Joos
Tell Viking, he's the one making the argument.
Somewhat related to this story, recently I happened to watch a 'Who Do You Think You Are' episode with an apparently well know British Asian actor. His family came over in the East African Asian flight of the late60s/early70s, he traced their recent history in Kenya during the 20th century and back to India in the 19th.
In amongst all the to be expected tragedy caused by poverty and economic upheavals were a few very interesting surprises. On of them was he found out his grandmother had married at 6 years to his grandfather who was 10 years old at the time, the actors reaction was just like probably yours or mine, a big sort of WTF. Yet at the time in the 1890s/1900s it wasn't that uncommon amongst the poor. They went on to live a relatively prosperous long lived marriage though they did loose 8 out of their 10 children in infancy.
But 'we've' moved on a great deal in just 2 generations, so I see some hope that these backward customs and the despicable crimes like the Yemeni incident will one day become unthinkable even in their home countries.
So did the Daily Mail get this story from Blogs?
Who is Blogs?
Quote from: Barrister on September 10, 2013, 04:09:28 PM
I did say "the wider islamic world", and not just Yemen.
Your link is interesting, as it links to a bunch of different countries. Almost all of which have very low rates of child marriage. Afghanistan, predictably, is horribly at a 15% rate under the age of 15. Saudi Arabia though has no data, and a couple of links showing the Saudi government cracking down on it. War-torn iraq is at 3%. Egypt 2%. Indonesia 4%. Algeria 1%. Turkey 3%.
So clearly child marriage is more of a problem in the arab world than it is in the west. But in both places it is in the minority. Even in conservative Saudi Arabia they don't generally support child marriages.
Also from that site:
Nicaragua: 10%
Brazil: 11%
Dominican Republic: 12%
Quote from: Baron von Schtinkenbutt on September 10, 2013, 06:51:21 PM
Quote from: Barrister on September 10, 2013, 04:09:28 PM
I did say "the wider islamic world", and not just Yemen.
Your link is interesting, as it links to a bunch of different countries. Almost all of which have very low rates of child marriage. Afghanistan, predictably, is horribly at a 15% rate under the age of 15. Saudi Arabia though has no data, and a couple of links showing the Saudi government cracking down on it. War-torn iraq is at 3%. Egypt 2%. Indonesia 4%. Algeria 1%. Turkey 3%.
So clearly child marriage is more of a problem in the arab world than it is in the west. But in both places it is in the minority. Even in conservative Saudi Arabia they don't generally support child marriages.
Also from that site:
Nicaragua: 10%
Brazil: 11%
Dominican Republic: 12%
Fucking Arab shitholistans.
Quote from: mongers on September 10, 2013, 05:51:43 PM
Somewhat related to this story, recently I happened to watch a 'Who Do You Think You Are' episode with an apparently well know British Asian actor. His family came over in the East African Asian flight of the late60s/early70s, he traced their recent history in Kenya during the 20th century and back to India in the 19th.
In amongst all the to be expected tragedy caused by poverty and economic upheavals were a few very interesting surprises. On of them was he found out his grandmother had married at 6 years to his grandfather who was 10 years old at the time, the actors reaction was just like probably yours or mine, a big sort of WTF. Yet at the time in the 1890s/1900s it wasn't that uncommon amongst the poor. They went on to live a relatively prosperous long lived marriage though they did loose 8 out of their 10 children in infancy.
But 'we've' moved on a great deal in just 2 generations, so I see some hope that these backward customs and the despicable crimes like the Yemeni incident will one day become unthinkable even in their home countries.
My understanding of those child to child marriages is that they are really betrothals. They're not supposed to start humping right away.
Its the illogicalness of this I don't get.
Marrying a little girl to a man- OK, I can sort of see the logic there, it makes sense within their culture, situation, etc...
But for the man to then destroy his investment like that... It should be common knowledge that even morals aside you can't really do this sort of thing with kids without damaging them.
I'm assuming here of course that he isn't a rich pervert who gets off on killing kids but rather an also somewhat poor person who wanted a young wife.
What would Muhammad do.
Quote from: Tyr on September 10, 2013, 06:56:08 PM
Marrying a little girl to a man- OK, I can sort of see the logic there, it makes sense within their culture, situation, etc...
Perhaps faulty logic.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on September 10, 2013, 06:55:33 PM
Quote from: mongers on September 10, 2013, 05:51:43 PM
Somewhat related to this story, recently I happened to watch a 'Who Do You Think You Are' episode with an apparently well know British Asian actor. His family came over in the East African Asian flight of the late60s/early70s, he traced their recent history in Kenya during the 20th century and back to India in the 19th.
In amongst all the to be expected tragedy caused by poverty and economic upheavals were a few very interesting surprises. On of them was he found out his grandmother had married at 6 years to his grandfather who was 10 years old at the time, the actors reaction was just like probably yours or mine, a big sort of WTF. Yet at the time in the 1890s/1900s it wasn't that uncommon amongst the poor. They went on to live a relatively prosperous long lived marriage though they did loose 8 out of their 10 children in infancy.
But 'we've' moved on a great deal in just 2 generations, so I see some hope that these backward customs and the despicable crimes like the Yemeni incident will one day become unthinkable even in their home countries.
My understanding of those child to child marriages is that they are really betrothals. They're not supposed to start humping right away.
I was retelling the story as an illustration of how quickly norms can change within cultures, especially once poverty is alleviated.
Within the programme they looked at the issue of early sex, when investigating the child deaths he talked with an Indian health worker/statistician and she was making the point that historically early sex and childbirth fatally compromised many of the children who went on to die in infancy.
I think in the grandparents case she had her first child at 12 and several others relatively early, which the health worker said would worsen their survival chances by around 50%.
Quote from: Viking on September 10, 2013, 03:26:13 PM
Quote from: merithyn on September 10, 2013, 03:14:10 PM
When these laws are demanded to be in affect in the US or Canada, you'll have an argument against multiculturalism. Until then, I accept that there is good in bad in every culture, and I will be happy to accept the good.
So you think it is ok for little girls to be married off and raped at 8? Seriously, this is ok if their culture says it is ok?
This is how you get the rotten idea that for the most part only countries where human rights are respected get condemned for human rights abuse by anybody other than the US State Department and the better international human rights groups.
:blink:
W. T. F??
Have you lost your fucking mind? Where are you pulling this shit out of??
Forget it Meri, it is Viking.
Quote from: katmai on September 10, 2013, 07:59:48 PM
Forget it Meri, it is Viking.
I... he... wow... just wow... :blink:
Quote from: garbon on September 10, 2013, 07:17:24 PM
Quote from: Tyr on September 10, 2013, 06:56:08 PM
Marrying a little girl to a man- OK, I can sort of see the logic there, it makes sense within their culture, situation, etc...
Perhaps faulty logic.
How?
Quote from: Tyr on September 10, 2013, 08:29:41 PM
Quote from: garbon on September 10, 2013, 07:17:24 PM
Quote from: Tyr on September 10, 2013, 06:56:08 PM
Marrying a little girl to a man- OK, I can sort of see the logic there, it makes sense within their culture, situation, etc...
Perhaps faulty logic.
How?
Because it doesn't really make sense.
Quote from: garbon on September 10, 2013, 09:16:13 PM
Quote from: Tyr on September 10, 2013, 08:29:41 PM
Quote from: garbon on September 10, 2013, 07:17:24 PM
Quote from: Tyr on September 10, 2013, 06:56:08 PM
Marrying a little girl to a man- OK, I can sort of see the logic there, it makes sense within their culture, situation, etc...
Perhaps faulty logic.
How?
Because it doesn't really make sense.
Assuming the logic is "it's ok to marry little girls, therefore it's ok to marry little girls", it's actually tautological. :wacko:
Quote from: merithyn on September 10, 2013, 07:51:43 PM:blink:
W. T. F??
Have you lost your fucking mind? Where are you pulling this shit out of??
His rich fantasy life.
Quote from: Jacob on September 10, 2013, 04:28:32 PM
Viking's insistence that allowing Quebecois Sikhs to wear turbans will lead to a significant increase in the rape and murder of eight year old girls is easily disproven by examining actual facts.
You have a significant case of failure at reading comprehension. The cultural relativism is inside Meri's head and it is premitting a different set of standards to apply to third world shitholeistan to the ones she insist on or herself when it comes to universal human rights.
Quote from: merithyn on September 10, 2013, 07:51:43 PM
Quote from: Viking on September 10, 2013, 03:26:13 PM
Quote from: merithyn on September 10, 2013, 03:14:10 PM
When these laws are demanded to be in affect in the US or Canada, you'll have an argument against multiculturalism. Until then, I accept that there is good in bad in every culture, and I will be happy to accept the good.
So you think it is ok for little girls to be married off and raped at 8? Seriously, this is ok if their culture says it is ok?
This is how you get the rotten idea that for the most part only countries where human rights are respected get condemned for human rights abuse by anybody other than the US State Department and the better international human rights groups.
:blink:
W. T. F??
Have you lost your fucking mind? Where are you pulling this shit out of??
here is where I am pulling this shit out of.
Quote from: merithyn on September 10, 2013, 03:14:10 PM
When these laws are demanded to be in affect in the US or Canada, you'll have an argument against multiculturalism. Until then, I accept that there is good in bad in every culture, and I will be happy to accept the good.
Quote from: Viking on September 11, 2013, 01:54:47 AM
Quote from: Jacob on September 10, 2013, 04:28:32 PM
Viking's insistence that allowing Quebecois Sikhs to wear turbans will lead to a significant increase in the rape and murder of eight year old girls is easily disproven by examining actual facts.
You have a significant case of failure at reading comprehension. The cultural relativism is inside Meri's head and it is premitting a different set of standards to apply to third world shitholeistan to the ones she insist on or herself when it comes to universal human rights.
The standards in "shitholeistan" are not her problem.
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on September 11, 2013, 02:00:33 AM
Quote from: Viking on September 11, 2013, 01:54:47 AM
Quote from: Jacob on September 10, 2013, 04:28:32 PM
Viking's insistence that allowing Quebecois Sikhs to wear turbans will lead to a significant increase in the rape and murder of eight year old girls is easily disproven by examining actual facts.
You have a significant case of failure at reading comprehension. The cultural relativism is inside Meri's head and it is premitting a different set of standards to apply to third world shitholeistan to the ones she insist on or herself when it comes to universal human rights.
The standards in "shitholeistan" are not her problem.
Tolerating them for shitholeistan is and only opposing them if they show up at her doorstep just points to moral bankrupcy.
God helps those who help themselves.
Quote from: garbon on September 10, 2013, 09:16:13 PM
Quote from: Tyr on September 10, 2013, 08:29:41 PM
Quote from: garbon on September 10, 2013, 07:17:24 PM
Quote from: Tyr on September 10, 2013, 06:56:08 PM
Marrying a little girl to a man- OK, I can sort of see the logic there, it makes sense within their culture, situation, etc...
Perhaps faulty logic.
How?
Because it doesn't really make sense.
I don't see how. It gets the marriage and all the political considerations sorted ASAP, lets the girl get used to her husband/the other wives , gives the parents the money they need now and takes away a mouth they have to feed, stops another man snapping her up when she gets to breedig age, etc...
It's not something I would condone but it's perfectly logical.
Quote from: Viking on September 11, 2013, 02:02:36 AM
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on September 11, 2013, 02:00:33 AM
Quote from: Viking on September 11, 2013, 01:54:47 AM
Quote from: Jacob on September 10, 2013, 04:28:32 PM
Viking's insistence that allowing Quebecois Sikhs to wear turbans will lead to a significant increase in the rape and murder of eight year old girls is easily disproven by examining actual facts.
You have a significant case of failure at reading comprehension. The cultural relativism is inside Meri's head and it is premitting a different set of standards to apply to third world shitholeistan to the ones she insist on or herself when it comes to universal human rights.
The standards in "shitholeistan" are not her problem.
Tolerating them for shitholeistan is and only opposing them if they show up at her doorstep just points to moral bankrupcy.
I thought she said there was good and bad in every culture. What exactly do you want here to do?
Quote from: Razgovory on September 11, 2013, 03:25:02 AM
I thought she said there was good and bad in every culture. What exactly do you want here to do?
Apparently it's hypocritical to let non-white savages govern their own countries.
Quote from: Viking on September 11, 2013, 02:02:36 AM
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on September 11, 2013, 02:00:33 AM
Quote from: Viking on September 11, 2013, 01:54:47 AM
Quote from: Jacob on September 10, 2013, 04:28:32 PM
Viking's insistence that allowing Quebecois Sikhs to wear turbans will lead to a significant increase in the rape and murder of eight year old girls is easily disproven by examining actual facts.
You have a significant case of failure at reading comprehension. The cultural relativism is inside Meri's head and it is premitting a different set of standards to apply to third world shitholeistan to the ones she insist on or herself when it comes to universal human rights.
The standards in "shitholeistan" are not her problem.
Tolerating them for shitholeistan is and only opposing them if they show up at her doorstep just points to moral bankrupcy.
Even if one accepts that, it still doesn't have anything to do with multiculturalism.
Quote from: Viking on September 11, 2013, 01:54:47 AM
You have a significant case of failure at reading comprehension. The cultural relativism is inside Meri's head and it is premitting a different set of standards to apply to third world shitholeistan to the ones she insist on or herself when it comes to universal human rights.
The failure at reading comprehension is yours. What I said, in small words, is that so long as none of those people come to Western Nations and demand that we allow them to marry children, none of this has any bearing on multiculturalism.
I can't control what they do in their home nations. No one can, or these things would have been stopped ages ago. But when it comes to what they bring to MY home nation, we can - and we do - prevent it from happening. What we DO allow of their culture, however, are the things that do not harm others nor break our laws. Things like wearing specific clothing or speaking a specific language.
I think the confusion comes in the word "multiculturalism". It's defined as:
QuoteThe doctrine that several different cultures (rather than one national culture) can coexist peacefully and equitably in a single country
It doesn't say all aspects of that one culture. Just to clarify.