PRC White Paper Reveals Armed Forces Structure

[Jacob]

Story on BBC here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-china-22163599

White Paper in English here: http://eng.mod.gov.cn/TopNews/2013-04/16/content_4442750.htm

[derspiess]

Yeah, cover it up with the BBC article, Xiacob.  We all know you're on the mailing lists for both the CPC and PLA.

But anyway, didn't read the whole thing.  Have they figured out how to make a tank better than the T-62?  They're making some advances with their small arms, but the heavier stuff is seriously lagging.  Not that I'm complaining.

[Jacob]

The thing I found odd is that, according to the BBC, the army has 850,000 officers... that sounds like they have an almost 1:1 ratio of officers and enlisted ranks. Which is kind of weird.

Or is that how it is in modern militaries?

[derspiess]

The thing I found odd is that, according to the BBC, the army has 850,000 officers... that sounds like they have an almost 1:1 ratio of officers and enlisted ranks. Which is kind of weird.

Or is that how it is in modern militaries?

  Looks like they just corrected it.

FWIW though, I don't know about the PLA so much but the Soviet and other ComBloc armed forces tended to be officer-heavy.  Something like 8:1 (enlisted to officer) which is way more than Western militaries.  The commie militaries used officers for highly-skilled technical positions, whereas their Western counterparts would be NCOs. 

[CountDeMoney]

Have they figured out how to make a tank better than the T-62?  They're making some advances with their small arms, but the heavier stuff is seriously lagging.  Not that I'm complaining.

Shit, they still had gas masks for their 3rd echelon horse cavalry reserves in the western provinces as late as 1992.  I doubt their tanks and arty have made such similar leaps and bounds. 

[11B4V]

The thing I found odd is that, according to the BBC, the army has 850,000 officers... that sounds like they have an almost 1:1 ratio of officers and enlisted ranks. Which is kind of weird.

Or is that how it is in modern militaries?

It's called no effective NCO corps.

[Malthus]

The thing I found odd is that, according to the BBC, the army has 850,000 officers... that sounds like they have an almost 1:1 ratio of officers and enlisted ranks. Which is kind of weird.

Or is that how it is in modern militaries?

It's called no effective NCO corps.

A question: aside from historical development, does having a seperate stream of NCO positions as opposed to officer positions make sense?

[ulmont]

FWIW though, I don't know about the PLA so much but the Soviet and other ComBloc armed forces tended to be officer-heavy.  Something like 8:1 (enlisted to officer) which is way more than Western militaries.

The US armed forces have a 4.9:1 (enlisted to officer ratio)...


http://www.militaryonesource.mil/12038/MOS/Reports/2011_Demographics_Report.pdf

Obviously old data, but this link claims a 2:1 (enlisted to officer ratio).

As of 2007, the PLA has 2.3 million personnel divided roughly into thirds (765,000) for officers, NCOs, and conscripts.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/china/plan-personel-enlistedforces.htm

[derspiess]

A question: aside from historical development, does having a seperate stream of NCO positions as opposed to officer positions make sense?

Absolutely.  But could you elaborate on what you're getting at?

[The Brain]

Don't you mean Rice Paper?

[derspiess]

The US armed forces have a 4.9:1 (enlisted to officer ratio)...


http://www.militaryonesource.mil/12038/MOS/Reports/2011_Demographics_Report.pdf

I'll have to go back & check my source, but I was thinking specifically in terms of Cold War-era line units.  We had something like 13:1 and Warsaw Pact armies had 8:1.

[Jacob]

Don't you mean Rice Paper?

Rice paper is commonly white

[The Brain]

Don't you mean Rice Paper?

Rice paper is commonly white

Rice paper doesn't mean generic paper.

[ulmont]

I'll have to go back & check my source, but I was thinking specifically in terms of Cold War-era line units.  We had something like 13:1 and Warsaw Pact armies had 8:1.

There may be a lot of work done in the phrase "line units" there.  According to this source, which I haven't tried to verify in any way, the Vietnam/Cold-War US armed forces were 7:1.
http://fabiusmaximus.com/2012/09/10/american-military-force-changed-43153/

4.9:1 still beats 2:1, though.

[Caliga]

Don't you mean Rice Paper?