Suck it, Norquist!

[merithyn]

God, how I hate that man! I don't get how he has nearly as much power as he seems to have, and I'm absolutely fucking thrilled to see it diminished.

Source

Anyone interested in avoiding a tumble over the fiscal cliff at the end of the year - and that includes everyone from Wall Street stock traders to Main Street businessmen concerned about a double-dip recession - may want to take note of the news out of Washington the past few days.

Grover NorquistIt didn't come from negotiation principals like President Obama or House Speaker John Boehner, but rather rank-and-file members of Congress.

Members of both the House and Senate said simply that the Emperor has no clothes on.

And that emperor is Grover Norquist, a Weston native and Harvard University graduate who is the founder and president of Americans for Tax Reform.

Democrats including Governor Deval Patrick, a Norquist college classmate, have long excoriated the conservative for pushing an ironclad no-new-taxes pledge on Republicans that they argue has prevented any of the revenue increases that liberals say must accompany any program cuts in a budgetary "grand bargain."

Norquist has promised to campaign against or support primary challengers to anyone breaking the pledge, but that individual threat has been diminished after Republicans lost both the presidency and seats in Congress during this month's general election.

That has prompted partisan soul-searching about how to best stave off future election losses. And now, as the lame-duck Congress resumes work today on a possible deal to avoid the program cuts and tax increases otherwise set to take effect Jan. 1, a number of Republicans - and past pledge signatories - are saying they won't be beholden to Norquist.

"If I were in Congress in 1941, I would have signed a declaration of war against Japan," Representative Peter King said Sunday during an appearance on NBC's "Meet the Press." "I'm not going to attack Japan today."

The New York congressman, chairman of the House Homeland Security Committee, explained that "the world has changed and the economic situation is different."

Senator Lindsey Graham, appearing on the ABC News program, "This Week," said he would violate the pledge "for the good of the country - only if Democrats will do entitlement reform."

Asked how he would explain the change to Norquist, the South Carolina Republican pointed to the impending automatic military spending cuts and said, "What I would say to Grover Norquist is that the sequester would destroy the United States military."

Senator Saxby Chambliss, another Republican from Georgia, told WMAZ-TV last week that: "I care more about my country than I do about a 20-year-old pledge."

He added: "If we do it his way, then we'll continue in debt, and I just have a disagreement with him about that. But I don't worry about that, because I care too much about my country. I care a lot more about it than I do Grover Norquist."

Norquist responded on CNN that he found Chambliss's comments "confusing" because the pledge was not to him, but the Georgian's constituents.

Today, he added during another appearance on the cable network that his group would target members who break the pledge when they seek reelection, although voters tend to issue any punishment without prodding.

King, as a member of the House, runs every two years, while both Graham and Chambliss are expected to run for new six-year Senate terms in 2014.

"Historically, the people who lose do so because the people in their state have figured that out," Norquist said on CNN's "Starting Point with Soledad O'Brien."

[garbon]

I'd wait until we see what actually happens. Talk is cheap.

[merithyn]

I'd wait until we see what actually happens. Talk is cheap.

Let me be happy for a minute, will you?

[garbon]

I'm just saying it would make more sense to pause the festivities till it happens.

[merithyn]

The fact that some of these guys are even openly saying, "Yeah, don't care about Norquist's pledge anymore," is a big step, to me. Four years ago, that pledge was iron-clad so far as these same folks were concerned.

[merithyn]

Eric Cantor is half-assed rejecting Norquist, too, though his abdication seems luke-warm at best.

Source

House Majority Leader Eric Cantor (R-Va.) appeared to take a step back from anti-tax champion Grover Norquist on Monday, suggesting that a "no new taxes" pledge coordinated by Norquist's Americans for Tax Reform group wouldn't determine his legislative duties regarding ongoing fiscal cliff negotiations.

"When I go to the constituents that have reelected me, it is not about that pledge," Cantor said on MSNBC. "It really is about trying to solve problems."

Asked if he could foresee a situation in which he would be willing to directly renounce the anti-tax pledge, Cantor dodged specifics, saying that he didn't know because he hadn't talked to Norquist.

Cantor's apparent disinterest in Norquist and his pledge comes as a number of congressional Republicans have received attention for rejecting it outright. Sens. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.), John McCain (R-Ariz.), Saxby Chambliss (R-Ga.), Bob Corker (R-Tenn.), as well as some House Republicans, have spoken out against the pledge and argued that it squelches valid discussion on finding new revenue.

Cantor seemed to agree with his colleagues at least on the revenue issue, saying that he stood with House Speaker John Boehner (R-Ohio), who recently told the White House that House GOP leadership was willing to consider new revenues, provided they came from the correct sources.

"I don't care if you raised taxes 100 percent on the wealthy, you're not going going to fix the deficit problem," he said. "We've got to have the president step up and say here's my position on how we reform the entitlements and start managing down this debt and deficit."

In a later interview with Fox News, Cantor also challenged President Barack Obama, saying that he'd put Obamacare on the bargaining table if he really wanted to "get serious" about coming to an agreement on averting the fiscal cliff. Boehner made a similar suggestion and was quickly rejected by the White House.

[Admiral Yi]

Now if only Obama would do the same with his pledge not to raise taxes on the Schumer class. 

[merithyn]

Now if only Obama would do the same with his pledge not to raise taxes on the Schumer class. 

Are you talking about the hedge fund taxes that Schumer is pushing for?

[Admiral Yi]

Are you talking about the hedge fund taxes that Schumer is pushing for?

I'm talking about the Bush tax rates on people making less than 200K that Obama promised not to raise.

[DGuller]

God, how I hate that man! I don't get how he has nearly as much power as he seems to have, and I'm absolutely fucking thrilled to see it diminished.

He gets his power the same way autocrats get their power:  through sheer terror.  As long as only a few politicians are willing to defy him at any one time, they will pay dearly.  His power will end the same way most dictators' power ends:  either by death, or by massive revolt by the subjects who all at once understand that the only thing they have to fear is fear itself.

And I will second what others are saying.  It's nice that politicians are speaking publicly about defying him, since that's already an act of defiance.  However, the proof will come by them telling Grover to fuck off by actually voting.

[Razgovory]

Are you talking about the hedge fund taxes that Schumer is pushing for?

I'm talking about the Bush tax rates on people making less than 200K that Obama promised not to raise.

Why doesn't the GOP breach the issue?  Certainly they could make that part of a deal.

[Admiral Yi]

Why doesn't the GOP breach the issue?  Certainly they could make that part of a deal.

I give up.  Why don't they?

[Razgovory]

Why doesn't the GOP breach the issue?  Certainly they could make that part of a deal.

I give up.  Why don't they?

I was asking you.  I don't know why you people do anything.  Why don't you write your Congressmen or Senator to put it on the table?

[Admiral Yi]

I was asking you.

I don't believe you.  Based on the position in the thread and your posting history I figure it was either an attempt to defend Obama's position or an attempt to indict me for inconsistency.

[katmai]

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar Yi!