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A black 007?

Started by merithyn, October 26, 2012, 05:01:13 PM

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Ideologue

#30
October 26, 2012, 06:20:23 PM
Hey, garbo, as a black man on black issues, what are your opinions of race blind casting in general?  Basically what I'm asking for is that you fully validate my opinions. :)
Kinemalogue
Current reviews: The 'Burbs (9/10); Gremlins 2: The New Batch (9/10); John Wick: Chapter 2 (9/10); A Cure For Wellness (4/10)

Eddie Teach

#31
October 26, 2012, 06:24:23 PM
To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

Viking

#32
October 26, 2012, 06:39:05 PM
First Maxim - "There are only two amounts, too few and enough."
First Corollary - "You cannot have too many soldiers, only too few supplies."
Second Maxim - "Be willing to exchange a bad idea for a good one."
Second Corollary - "You can only be wrong or agree with me."

A terrorist which starts a slaughter quoting Locke, Burke and Mill has completely missed the point.
The fact remains that the only person or group to applaud the Norway massacre are random Islamists.

garbon

#33
October 26, 2012, 06:44:56 PM
Quote from: Ideologue on October 26, 2012, 06:20:23 PM
Hey, garbo, as a black man on black issues, what are your opinions of race blind casting in general?  Basically what I'm asking for is that you fully validate my opinions. :)

Sorry but what you posted seems backwards to me.
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

garbon

#34
October 26, 2012, 06:47:39 PM
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on October 26, 2012, 06:19:19 PM
Quote from: garbon on October 26, 2012, 06:08:05 PM
I don't see the importance of that difference. Bond has been played by all different sorts of men, just like the role of President of the US.

No, he's been played by tall athletic white men with British-sounding accents. The audience accepts all of them as being the same guy. Nobody thinks of Jimmy Carter and Ronald Reagan as being the same guy. Or Dennis Haysbert and Morgan Freeman, for that matter.

It's just a role and as much as there is continuity there is also a lot of difference that various actors have brought to the role (and I'd guess for you then more strikingly with Dench playing M).  I don't see why race is a much bigger factor than acting style and approach to the character.
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

garbon

#35
October 26, 2012, 06:53:39 PM
Quote from: garbon on October 26, 2012, 06:44:56 PM
Quote from: Ideologue on October 26, 2012, 06:20:23 PM
Hey, garbo, as a black man on black issues, what are your opinions of race blind casting in general?  Basically what I'm asking for is that you fully validate my opinions. :)

Sorry but what you posted seems backwards to me.

Actually to expand on that - I think racial based casting only makes sense if you are either a) trying to highlight the effects of racism in the work (so it wouldn't make sense to have white women playing the black roles in The Help) or you're trying to get at a culture/sub-culture where it would be awkward if you didn't pick someone of that race (like Tyler Perry films).

So I guess that kind of goes with what you said though I'd say something like Nick Fury doesn't fit as his original backstory has no role in the film and as such his race doesn't really matter.
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

Eddie Teach

#36
October 26, 2012, 06:57:58 PM
M is a title, Dench didn't become Bernard Lee, she just took his job. There are numerous references to her "predecessor" that go along with that.

To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

Grey Fox

#37
October 26, 2012, 07:00:58 PM
It could be do able but what it really needs is a throwback Bond. In the 1960s.
Colonel Caliga is Awesome.

Eddie Teach

#38
October 26, 2012, 07:05:46 PM
Quote from: Grey Fox on October 26, 2012, 07:00:58 PM
It could be do able but what it really needs is a throwback Bond. In the 1960s.

Agree. Craig's films and to a lesser extent Brosnan's have seen Bond looking less and less like Bond and more like any other action-oriented spy thriller.
To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

Neil

#39
October 26, 2012, 07:06:25 PM
Quote from: Viking on October 26, 2012, 06:04:36 PM
Quote from: The Brain on October 26, 2012, 06:01:55 PM
Quote from: Viking on October 26, 2012, 06:00:27 PM
If you make bond black you will have to explain why he is black...

:unsure:

While if you make Bond Irish or Scottish, or Australian then you don't need to explain. If having a black bond is ok, why isn't anybody thinking about a chinese bond?
Because if he were Chinese he'd be on the side of evil.
I do not hate you, nor do I love you, but you are made out of atoms which I can use for something else.

garbon

#40
October 26, 2012, 07:07:05 PM
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on October 26, 2012, 06:57:58 PM
M is a title, Dench didn't become Bernard Lee, she just took his job. There are numerous references to her "predecessor" that go along with that.



I don't think that's exactly correct. After all, Casino Royale was like a reboot of the series with us seeing how Bond first become 007.

QuoteBolstered by the success of Universal Pictures' rival Jason Bourne film series (as well as Warner Bros.' reboot of the Batman series with Batman Begins), the decision was made at MGM and Eon to "bring Bond back to his roots" by eliminating the gadgets and fantasy elements that had begun to define the series, and introducing a tougher, darker, and more realistic Bond that was more in line with the Bond of Ian Fleming's original novels than with any of his previous screen incarnations. Thus, the 21st Bond film, Casino Royale, in addition to being the first film adaptation of a Fleming novel since 1969's On Her Majesty's Secret Service, was to be a reboot of the series, establishing a new timeline and narrative framework not meant to precede any previous film.This not only freed the Bond series from more than forty years of continuity, but allowed the film to show a less experienced and more vulnerable Bond.
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

MadImmortalMan

#41
October 26, 2012, 07:20:55 PM
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on October 26, 2012, 05:59:02 PM
:lol:

James Bond's a character, not an institution.


A character with a Scottish dad and a Swiss mom. Will the black JB be a reboot where his mom is actually Jamaican?
"Stability is destabilizing." --Hyman Minsky

"Complacency can be a self-denying prophecy."
"We have nothing to fear but lack of fear itself." --Larry Summers

merithyn

#42
October 26, 2012, 07:21:45 PM
Quote from: garbon on October 26, 2012, 05:56:45 PM
Has 4 years been enough time to get you to be okay with having a black president? After all, that's a position that has an even longer history of only being white.

<_<

Don't even try pulling the racist card on this one, boo-boo. The President is doing a job, not playing a role. There's a world of difference between a beloved fictional character and a job. I wouldn't be any happier if they made a new Winnie the Poo movie and painted him pink. :contract:
Yesterday, upon the stair,
I met a man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish, I wish he'd go away...

Eddie Teach

#43
October 26, 2012, 07:22:22 PM
Well, Dench came on the scene in Goldeneye as someone stepping into the job. There was continuity then. They changed a lot more than just M's gender(or conversely, Bond's age) for Casino Royale. I'm not huge on reboots(though Batman was done quite well) and changing major characters' sex or race seems pretty gimmicky. However, I'm a sucker for spy thrillers and so would probably give it a chance.
To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

Razgovory

#44
October 26, 2012, 07:24:30 PM
Quote from: MadImmortalMan on October 26, 2012, 07:20:55 PM
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on October 26, 2012, 05:59:02 PM
:lol:

James Bond's a character, not an institution.


A character with a Scottish dad and a Swiss mom. Will the black JB be a reboot where his mom is actually Jamaican?

I don't think there is a rule that says you can't be black and Scottish.  Maybe there is in Switzerland, but not Scotland.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017
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