Spain is Doomed; Youth Unemployment Hits 51%

[Brazen]

The root of the problem is that many welfare states were set up during a demographically benign period. Ageing populations and increased life expectancy are making the more generous systems unsustainable.

Solution: eat the elderly. They're a bit tough but nothing slow cooking won't cure.

[Tamas]

I know this is as much of an unreal utopia as it could ever  be right now, but I keep wondering if all these economic and demographics processes, at least in Europe, are leading us back toward the "one parent works, the other stays home with the kids" model. I am not saying man and woman because we might do this without a backtrack in culture and civilization.

If you simplify things down to the barest level, there are two main issues:
-not enough jobs
-not enough children

Having one half of the population abandoning the jobmarket to instead raise more children could solve both.

Again, I know this is impossible in the foreseeable future due to costs of living vs individual income levels, but still, I wonder if this will be the end result of all this.

[Monoriu]

If you simplify things down to the barest level, there are two main issues:
-not enough jobs
-not enough children

Having one half of the population abandoning the jobmarket to instead raise more children could solve both.

That's from a society point of view.  From an individual household's point of view, the security offered by having two incomes is hard to replace. 

[Tamas]

If you simplify things down to the barest level, there are two main issues:
-not enough jobs
-not enough children

Having one half of the population abandoning the jobmarket to instead raise more children could solve both.

That's from a society point of view.  From an individual household's point of view, the security offered by having two incomes is hard to replace.

Do not underestimate the pressure of society in determining what is good for you.

Tyler Durden: My dad never went to college, so it was real important that I go.
Narrator: Sounds familiar.
Tyler Durden: So I graduate, I call him up long distance, I say "Dad, now what?" He says, "Get a job."
Narrator: Same here.
Tyler Durden: Now I'm 25, make my yearly call again. I say Dad, "Now what?" He says, "I don't know, get married."

[Eddie Teach]

That's from a society point of view.  From an individual household's point of view, the security offered by having two incomes is hard to replace.

In which case it might be wise for the government to institute policies which encourage stay-at-home parenting.

[Josquius]

If you simplify things down to the barest level, there are two main issues:
-not enough jobs
-not enough children

Having one half of the population abandoning the jobmarket to instead raise more children could solve both.

That's from a society point of view.  From an individual household's point of view, the security offered by having two incomes is hard to replace. 

Thats where the state should step in.

[Tamas]

No. It will take care of itself. Social engineering is bollocks.

[Sheilbh]

If you simplify things down to the barest level, there are two main issues:
-not enough jobs
-not enough children

Having one half of the population abandoning the jobmarket to instead raise more children could solve both.

I think this is happening socially.  There's far more pressure on women to give up their jobs and have their entire lives defined by being or becoming a mother.  That trend along with lauding a certain variety of promiscuity and dressing like a wet dream as sexual liberation make me suspicious that a lot of what people describe as post-feminism looks a lot like pre-feminism mixed with what men would like.  I think we probably need a big dose more of feminism.

But I don't think this is the solution, not least because the most economically successful bits of Europe are the ones that have very high rates of female work participation (across age groups) and provide a lot of support for workers with children.  It's not going to help with the not enough jobs either because that's a bit lump of labour.  Simply removing that much productivity and demand from the economy would be dreadful.

[Monoriu]

Do not underestimate the pressure of society in determining what is good for you.

The real problem is that what is good for the individual and what is good for society are different.  As a society we need more babies.  As an individual I refuse to have any 

[Tamas]

Do not underestimate the pressure of society in determining what is good for you.

The real problem is that what is good for the individual and what is good for society are different.  As a society we need more babies.  As an individual I refuse to have any 

Yes, but you are getting a lot of social pressure because of that. Most people brake under it. Some brake too late.

The ones who don't, they are lucky.

[Eddie Teach]

  That trend along with lauding a certain variety of promiscuity and dressing like a wet dream as sexual liberation make me suspicious that a lot of what people describe as post-feminism looks a lot like pre-feminism mixed with what men would like.  I think we probably need a big dose more of feminism.

Quiet, you.

[Zanza]

Do not underestimate the pressure of society in determining what is good for you.

The real problem is that what is good for the individual and what is good for society are different.  As a society we need more babies.  As an individual I refuse to have any 

Yes, but you are getting a lot of social pressure because of that. Most people brake under it. Some brake too late.

The ones who don't, they are lucky.

I am sure that most parents would disagree with you and tell you that having kids was one of the best decision in their lifes.

[Zanza]

I know this is as much of an unreal utopia as it could ever  be right now, but I keep wondering if all these economic and demographics processes, at least in Europe, are leading us back toward the "one parent works, the other stays home with the kids" model. I am not saying man and woman because we might do this without a backtrack in culture and civilization.

If you simplify things down to the barest level, there are two main issues:
-not enough jobs
-not enough children

Having one half of the population abandoning the jobmarket to instead raise more children could solve both.

Again, I know this is impossible in the foreseeable future due to costs of living vs individual income levels, but still, I wonder if this will be the end result of all this.

Your conclusions are all wrong, probably thanks to your ideology. The parts of Europe with extensive social states are more successful than those without it and with some exceptions like Germany also have relatively healthy fertility numbers and public finances.

[Josquius]

No. It will take care of itself. Social engineering is bollocks.

Sweden and France saw large increases in their birth rate when they set in place a few reforms to make having a kid easier.
Such things as paternity leave clearly do work.

[Tamas]

Do not underestimate the pressure of society in determining what is good for you.

The real problem is that what is good for the individual and what is good for society are different.  As a society we need more babies.  As an individual I refuse to have any 

Yes, but you are getting a lot of social pressure because of that. Most people brake under it. Some brake too late.

The ones who don't, they are lucky.

I am sure that most parents would disagree with you and tell you that having kids was one of the best decision in their lifes.

Of course. I was just giving a nod to the anti-breaders of Languish, I am not one of them.