Iraq falling apart?

[Zoupa]

If Iraks goes towards civil war, I think the blame lies squarely on the Irakis themselves. Maybe a 3-state solution would have been better.

Why are you opposed to this Valmy?

[grumbler]

I get the feeling that I'm about to see a train wreck. I dont know why.

I agree, and I know why:  the Prime Minister is trying to destroy his own country for sectarian and personal reasons.  His reorganization of the government to place all power in his own hands (he is Defense Minister, National Security Minister, and Interior Minister, so all the government's armed agents all report to him) is very worrying.

[grumbler]

Maybe. I think it's just as likely that Obama will be blamed for things going pear shaped. Juxtaposing those quotes from Obama in the article ([Obama]hailed [al-Maliki] as the leader of "Iraq's most inclusive government yet.") with some of the stuff that's going on ("within a month, al-Maliki would arrest multiple major opposition figures, and Iraqi democracy was on the verge of complete collapse") could be very effective.

Bush said the same things.  I'm not sure Obama will be blamed for an Iraqi administration that was in place when he took office.

[Valmy]

If Iraks goes towards civil war, I think the blame lies squarely on the Irakis themselves. Maybe a 3-state solution would have been better.

Why are you opposed to this Valmy?

Opposition is not quite the right word.  I just think it would be destabilize the region and be a very bad thing.  Now maybe it would have been better if we had carefully managed it but for it to just fly apart organically the clusterfuck is going to be that much worse.

[The Brain]

If Iraks goes towards civil war, I think the blame lies squarely on the Irakis themselves. Maybe a 3-state solution would have been better.

Why are you opposed to this Valmy?

Blame doesn't matter. Results matter.

[Berkut]

Maybe. I think it's just as likely that Obama will be blamed for things going pear shaped. Juxtaposing those quotes from Obama in the article ([Obama]hailed [al-Maliki] as the leader of "Iraq's most inclusive government yet.") with some of the stuff that's going on ("within a month, al-Maliki would arrest multiple major opposition figures, and Iraqi democracy was on the verge of complete collapse") could be very effective.

Bush said the same things.  I'm not sure Obama will be blamed for an Iraqi administration that was in place when he took office.

Yeah, I don't think the blame for Iraq, to the extent that it lies with the US at all, can be laid at the feet of Obama in any way. Hell, he has basically just extended the very policies that Bush and McCain invented for him.

If Iraq fails, it won't be because of Obama - it would have failed regardless of who ran the US, I think. And likely regardless of anything the US could reasonable have done.

[CountDeMoney]

Yeah, I don't think the blame for Iraq, to the extent that it lies with the US at all, can be laid at the feet of Obama in any way. Hell, he has basically just extended the very policies that Bush and McCain invented for him.

If Iraq fails, it won't be because of Obama - it would have failed regardless of who ran the US, I think. And likely regardless of anything the US could reasonable have done.

I'm sure the GOP presidential campaign people will see it exactly that way this year.

[Phillip V]

Maybe. I think it's just as likely that Obama will be blamed for things going pear shaped. Juxtaposing those quotes from Obama in the article ([Obama]hailed [al-Maliki] as the leader of "Iraq's most inclusive government yet.") with some of the stuff that's going on ("within a month, al-Maliki would arrest multiple major opposition figures, and Iraqi democracy was on the verge of complete collapse") could be very effective.

Bush said the same things.  I'm not sure Obama will be blamed for an Iraqi administration that was in place when he took office.

Yeah, I don't think the blame for Iraq, to the extent that it lies with the US at all, can be laid at the feet of Obama in any way. Hell, he has basically just extended the very policies that Bush and McCain invented for him.

If Iraq fails, it won't be because of Obama - it would have failed regardless of who ran the US, I think. And likely regardless of anything the US could reasonable have done.

Same with Afghanistan...

[mongers]

I get the feeling that I'm about to see a train wreck. I dont know why.

I agree, and I know why:  the Prime Minister is trying to destroy his own country for sectarian and personal reasons.  His reorganization of the government to place all power in his own hands (he is Defense Minister, National Security Minister, and Interior Minister, so all the government's armed agents all report to him) is very worrying.

Those seem straight out of the playbook for the communist take over of eastern european counties in 46-48, now all we have to figure out is who is Iraq becoming a client state of ?   

[Neil]

And we are going to be blamed for this by everybody 

And rightly so, seeing as it is 100% the fault of the US government.

[DGuller]

What did we do?  Iraq was lucky that Americans were there to maintain order when Saddam had his unfortunate slip-and-fall accident on the platform.

[Iormlund]

Here's hoping an independent Kurdistan makes it out of the ruins.

Why would you hope for such a disastrous developement?

Wouldnt the turks shit a cow if that happened?

My brother was backpacking in Turkish Kurdistan last summer and things didn't look stable at all from what he says. Shots heard at night, dangerous roads, major military movement, brigade-sized incursions into Iraq, etc.

[Ideologue]

Thing is, I don't think many people care in the US.  Neither Democrats or Republicans really like the Iraqis that much.

No we are pretty tired of the whole thing.

We did what we could. The rest is (mostly) on them.

Agreed.

[The Brain]

Is there a military base near Baltimore btw?

[Ideologue]

I'm not sure they properly appreciate the whole "Kill a bunch of you, so the survivors can have a better life", thing.

It worked in Germany and Japan.