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Chrysler to File for Bankruptcy

Started by Savonarola, April 30, 2009, 12:01:30 PM

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The Minsky Moment

Quote from: Valmy on June 09, 2009, 01:50:30 PM
Both Automakers are doomed and we are tossing money to keep alive a corpse before it goes into rigor mortis.

We should allow both GM and Chrysler to die and let their remaining competitors buy up whatever assets they had worth saving.

That is what is happening to Chrysler.  the company is dying and the assets that remain are being assumed by a new company which will basically be run by Fiat.  Fiat is even actively considering abandoning the Chrysler brand (but keeping dodge and Jeep).  The big wrinkle is that Fiat effectively is agreeing to take on a modified UAW contract for its new US operation in return for a fat government bribe.

As for GM - there is no competitor out there that can swallow it whole or come close, and not all the lines and brands can be shed off easily.  There are selling off those lines that can be sold to stand-alone buyers, and stripping down the rest of the business.  If it is properly run going forward, I see no reason why it cannot survive.
The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.
--Joan Robinson

The Minsky Moment

Quote from: Hansmeister on June 09, 2009, 05:10:51 PM
A blogger named Verum Serum rases some interesting questions:

About his ability to think clearly, yes.

The idea that the Bush DOJ conspired with the incoming Obama admin to accomplish some nefarious end is a little too  :tinfoil: for me.  It might help a little if he could point to a single piece of evidence that supports his incredible claim that pressure was put on DOJ to agree to the non-proc deal in an unrelated case, but of course, he does not.

He is also mistaken as to his first premise notwithstanding the Marchionne statement - because as explained in the papers Fiat filed with the Supreme Court, under the terms of the contract, the deal *automatically* expires June 15, and can only be extended if additional time was needed to get government approval.  Fiat also points out that while in theory a new deal could be structured, there would be no assurance that they could secure the needed DIP financing.
The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.
--Joan Robinson

Neil

Quote from: Savonarola on June 09, 2009, 04:30:12 PM
Detroit's major advantages as a hub of both rail and water traffic were eliminated with the creation of the highway system,
And that's the terrible irony of it.  The crowning achievement of the auto industry was the death-knell of Detroit.
I do not hate you, nor do I love you, but you are made out of atoms which I can use for something else.

Berkut

Quote from: The Minsky Moment on June 09, 2009, 05:31:30 PM

As for GM - there is no competitor out there that can swallow it whole or come close, and not all the lines and brands can be shed off easily.  There are selling off those lines that can be sold to stand-alone buyers, and stripping down the rest of the business.  If it is properly run going forward, I see no reason why it cannot survive.

Do you see any reason to believe a corporation owned and run by the UAWand the US government would be run "properly" going forward?
"If you think this has a happy ending, then you haven't been paying attention."

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KRonn

Quote from: Berkut on June 09, 2009, 06:57:03 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on June 09, 2009, 05:31:30 PM

As for GM - there is no competitor out there that can swallow it whole or come close, and not all the lines and brands can be shed off easily.  There are selling off those lines that can be sold to stand-alone buyers, and stripping down the rest of the business.  If it is properly run going forward, I see no reason why it cannot survive.

Do you see any reason to believe a corporation owned and run by the UAWand the US government would be run "properly" going forward?
Mr negativity! I mean, what can possibly go wrong!? It's not like the government can't just keep printing money to pay for any cash shortfalls, right? Right?   :huh:

jimmy olsen

It is far better for the truth to tear my flesh to pieces, then for my soul to wander through darkness in eternal damnation.

Jet: So what kind of woman is she? What's Julia like?
Faye: Ordinary. The kind of beautiful, dangerous ordinary that you just can't leave alone.
Jet: I see.
Faye: Like an angel from the underworld. Or a devil from Paradise.
--------------------------------------------
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Scipio

What I speak out of my mouth is the truth.  It burns like fire.
-Jose Canseco

There you go, giving a fuck when it ain't your turn to give a fuck.
-Every cop, The Wire

"It is always good to be known for one's Krapp."
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KRonn


Neil

The government led by a black man, a union and Italians.  Now there's a bad omen.

Hell, Chrysler was awful when white plutocrats were running it.
I do not hate you, nor do I love you, but you are made out of atoms which I can use for something else.

The Minsky Moment

Quote from: Berkut on June 09, 2009, 06:57:03 PM
Do you see any reason to believe a corporation owned and run by the UAWand the US government would be run "properly" going forward?

The new CEO the feds put in place seems to have his head screwed on straight.  the real question going forward will be if the UAW uses their equity stake to muck around with management decisions.  If that happens I agree it doesn't look good.
The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.
--Joan Robinson

Berkut

No, I could not imagine they would use their equity stake to muck around with management decisions like pay and benefits.

I am sure if the new CEO comes along and tells them he is going to cut their salaries they will be all "OK, yous the boss Mr. CEO!"
"If you think this has a happy ending, then you haven't been paying attention."

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I Killed Kenny


Barrister

Quote from: Berkut on June 10, 2009, 12:42:42 PM
No, I could not imagine they would use their equity stake to muck around with management decisions like pay and benefits.

I am sure if the new CEO comes along and tells them he is going to cut their salaries they will be all "OK, yous the boss Mr. CEO!"

And how exactly are they going to "muck around with management decisions" with a minority stake?  They'll get to nominate a minority of the board of directors, but otherwise they'll have no say over the operation of the company.
Posts here are my own private opinions.  I do not speak for my employer.

Savonarola

Quote from: I Killed Kenny on June 10, 2009, 12:57:41 PM
YUROPE OWNS THE USA! :yeah:

Not the first time, but I can understand your excitement since it worked so well the last time a European company owned Chrysler.
In Italy, for thirty years under the Borgias, they had warfare, terror, murder and bloodshed, but they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci and the Renaissance. In Switzerland, they had brotherly love, they had five hundred years of democracy and peace—and what did that produce? The cuckoo clock

Zanza

Quote from: Barrister on June 10, 2009, 01:01:12 PMAnd how exactly are they going to "muck around with management decisions" with a minority stake?  They'll get to nominate a minority of the board of directors, but otherwise they'll have no say over the operation of the company.
They have a 55% stake. That suggests they may appoint half the board including a tie breaker (if there is such a person in American boards).