Football (Soccer) Thread

[Gups]

Kind of like the early rounds of cups then?
Big teams do care about winning the cup a little but when facing a low league team they'll put out kids, confident their winning is a foregone conclusion.
Then you get giant killings.

Doubt it'll harm spains qualification, though the other Scotland level teams in that group will be pissed.

We don't have a minnow in our group to do experiments against, all teams are competitive, maybe the weaker one is Cyprus, as Georgia nowadays have a couple of really good players. These are games that you have to take seriously.

.

I don't think its black and white. Georgia and Scotland have some good players but are generally not great.
And if you want to experiment you do need half decent opposition or else... Well of course the Real Madrid b team ran all over Liechtenstein
Qualifiers are about trying to balance competitive experimentation with actually getting the results you need.
Which Spain obviously massively fucked up here.

You're right that qualifiers are in part experimentation, but IMO they're mainly about getting results, and the experimentation should not jeopardize them, otherwise you risk the massive failure and embarrassment that comes from not qualifying for a big tournament, something that has happened to well established national teams that have messed up (for instance, it is quite something that Italy has failed to qualify for the last two World Cups).

You experiment near the end once you are there or nearly there and also closer to the tournament.

[Zoupa]

Yeah Conte isn't a project manager

I think he's been doing literally everything he can to get fired in the last few weeks which is not ideal (David Squires did a good cartoon on it https://www.theguardian.com/football/ng-interactive/2023/mar/21/david-squires-on-antonio-conte-tottenham-and-an-unlikely-return). But yeah he criticised all of the players and the board in a massive rant.

But it always seemed like an incredibly unlikely combination that wouldn't work. Conte is very demanding particularly for transfers, and Daniel Levy is famously difficult on transfers. But also, in the nicest possible way, I feel like he's demanding of players and results and Spurs are often Spursy

I wonder how they will get on now that Kane will likely move in the summer, Son is finished, and Richarlison hasn't kicked on for them. What is left of the team come August? It will be a painful rebuild.

The Age of Tottenham is over. The Age of Arsenal has returned.   

[The Larch]

Kind of like the early rounds of cups then?
Big teams do care about winning the cup a little but when facing a low league team they'll put out kids, confident their winning is a foregone conclusion.
Then you get giant killings.

Doubt it'll harm spains qualification, though the other Scotland level teams in that group will be pissed.

We don't have a minnow in our group to do experiments against, all teams are competitive, maybe the weaker one is Cyprus, as Georgia nowadays have a couple of really good players. These are games that you have to take seriously.

.

I don't think its black and white. Georgia and Scotland have some good players but are generally not great.
And if you want to experiment you do need half decent opposition or else... Well of course the Real Madrid b team ran all over Liechtenstein
Qualifiers are about trying to balance competitive experimentation with actually getting the results you need.
Which Spain obviously massively fucked up here.

You're right that qualifiers are in part experimentation, but IMO they're mainly about getting results, and the experimentation should not jeopardize them, otherwise you risk the massive failure and embarrassment that comes from not qualifying for a big tournament, something that has happened to well established national teams that have messed up (for instance, it is quite something that Italy has failed to qualify for the last two World Cups).

You experiment near the end once you are there or nearly there and also closer to the tournament.

And in the friendlies.

[Josquius]

Yeah Conte isn't a project manager

I think he's been doing literally everything he can to get fired in the last few weeks which is not ideal (David Squires did a good cartoon on it https://www.theguardian.com/football/ng-interactive/2023/mar/21/david-squires-on-antonio-conte-tottenham-and-an-unlikely-return). But yeah he criticised all of the players and the board in a massive rant.

But it always seemed like an incredibly unlikely combination that wouldn't work. Conte is very demanding particularly for transfers, and Daniel Levy is famously difficult on transfers. But also, in the nicest possible way, I feel like he's demanding of players and results and Spurs are often Spursy

I wonder how they will get on now that Kane will likely move in the summer, Son is finished, and Richarlison hasn't kicked on for them. What is left of the team come August? It will be a painful rebuild.

The Age of Tottenham is over. The Age of Arsenal has returned.   

The age of Tottenham is English footballs fusion power.
Always just around the corner. Never to come.

[Josephus]

You're right that qualifiers are in part experimentation, but IMO they're mainly about getting results, and the experimentation should not jeopardize them, otherwise you risk the massive failure and embarrassment that comes from not qualifying for a big tournament, something that has happened to well established national teams that have messed up (for instance, it is quite something that Italy has failed to qualify for the last two World Cups).

Problem is teams don't have much of a chance to "experiment" anymore. In between Euro qualifiers, Nations League and FIFA qualifiers. Best they get is the odd FIFA window when they don't have a regular game to play.

[FunkMonk]

Yeah Conte isn't a project manager

I think he's been doing literally everything he can to get fired in the last few weeks which is not ideal (David Squires did a good cartoon on it https://www.theguardian.com/football/ng-interactive/2023/mar/21/david-squires-on-antonio-conte-tottenham-and-an-unlikely-return). But yeah he criticised all of the players and the board in a massive rant.

But it always seemed like an incredibly unlikely combination that wouldn't work. Conte is very demanding particularly for transfers, and Daniel Levy is famously difficult on transfers. But also, in the nicest possible way, I feel like he's demanding of players and results and Spurs are often Spursy

I wonder how they will get on now that Kane will likely move in the summer, Son is finished, and Richarlison hasn't kicked on for them. What is left of the team come August? It will be a painful rebuild.

The Age of Tottenham is over. The Age of Arsenal has returned.   

 

[FunkMonk]

Chelsea 0 Aston Villa 2. 

Boehly has to spend whatever it takes to get rid of Potter and get Nagelsmann.

[Tamas]

Bloody effin' time:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2023/apr/02/chelsea-sack-manager-graham-potter-after-less-than-six-months-in-charge

Too late to bring back Tuchel, though.

Knowing the new owner he'll get Mourinho.

[FunkMonk]

Bloody effin' time:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2023/apr/02/chelsea-sack-manager-graham-potter-after-less-than-six-months-in-charge

Too late to bring back Tuchel, though.

Knowing the new owner he'll get Mourinho.

 

Boehly and the rest of the ownership group seem quite clueless, but I imagine with enough money they'll stumble into something decent eventually.

[Josquius]

Bloody effin' time:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2023/apr/02/chelsea-sack-manager-graham-potter-after-less-than-six-months-in-charge

Too late to bring back Tuchel, though.

Knowing the new owner he'll get Mourinho.

 

Boehly and the rest of the ownership group seem quite clueless, but I imagine with enough money they'll stumble into something decent eventually.

Ah. The Sunderland approach.

[FunkMonk]

Potter should have played Boehly's suggested formation of 4-4-3   

I shouldn't laugh too hard though. It wasn't long ago when Arsenal was being run into the ground through negligence and  criminality. Thankfully the club turned it around and hired decent executives and a potentially generational manager.

Who will be Boehly's Arteta? Or will he just try to buy Arteta   

[Sheilbh]

Bloody effin' time:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2023/apr/02/chelsea-sack-manager-graham-potter-after-less-than-six-months-in-charge

Too late to bring back Tuchel, though.

Knowing the new owner he'll get Mourinho.

From a club with an owner who spent a lot of money and made a lot of bad decisions - condolences

The thing I think to watch for now is what sort of manager he goes for. Potter is a project manager who needs a season or two and, from Brighton, I think does best when there's a wider organisation around him. If Boehly sticks with that - the fans may hate him because fair to say they expect immediate and very good results - but it might work in the long-run, like Arsenal.

But given the transfers my guess is he'll go for someone like a Mourinho (recapture a bit of the old feeling) or some other quite demanding, big name manager. And speaking from Everton's experience there's no worse sign for a club than an owner ping-ponging between different types of managers and expensively assembling a Frankenstein squad along the way that underperforms and is difficult to shift

Given the amount of money spent and the number of players in Chelsea's squad and some of the names, honestly the only manager I can think of who can make that work is someone like Ancelotti who has incredible man management skills. A squad of 31  pretty expensive players and no European football next year is going to be a challenge.

[FunkMonk]

Bloody effin' time:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2023/apr/02/chelsea-sack-manager-graham-potter-after-less-than-six-months-in-charge

Too late to bring back Tuchel, though.

Knowing the new owner he'll get Mourinho.

From a club with an owner who spent a lot of money and made a lot of bad decisions - condolences

The thing I think to watch for now is what sort of manager he goes for. Potter is a project manager who needs a season or two and, from Brighton, I think does best when there's a wider organisation around him. If Boehly sticks with that - the fans may hate him because fair to say they expect immediate and very good results - but it might work in the long-run, like Arsenal.

But given the transfers my guess is he'll go for someone like a Mourinho (recapture a bit of the old feeling) or some other quite demanding, big name manager. And speaking from Everton's experience there's no worse sign for a club than an owner ping-ponging between different types of managers and expensively assembling a Frankenstein squad along the way that underperforms and is difficult to shift

Given the amount of money spent and the number of players in Chelsea's squad and some of the names, honestly the only manager I can think of who can make that work is someone like Ancelotti who has incredible man management skills. A squad of 31  pretty expensive players and no European football next year is going to be a challenge.

They're definitely going to have a fire sale to get rid of a ton of players though. They have to hope they bounce back next season and get into a CL place.

I think next season 5th place in the prem is a CL-qualifying spot, too

[Tamas]

"Manager who was a disaster and suspiciously enough whose previous club started doing better once he left is not to be blamed for his failure. After all, he is English and we need to believe we can produce a manager worth a damn:"

https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2023/apr/03/the-end-of-an-error-for-chelsea-graham-potter-put-out-of-his-misery

[Tamas]

As this comment in the Guardian puts it (made before the sacking):

Let me begin by saying that their career results show that Unai Emery is simply a better manager than Graham Potter... Aston Villa have a better manager than Chelsea.

Graham Potter was chosen by Chelsea's owners based hope rather than proven results, and the Chelsea job is his until the owners' hope turns into the realisation that Potter is hopeless.

Chelsea have had two underqualified English managers in four years. That's more English managers than any other top four club in the last 20 years. One manager departed and tried his hand at relegating Everton, whilst the other has successfully transformed Chelsea into a mid-table club.