France threatens to 'suspend' Schengen Treaty

[Sheilbh]

Maybe the EU should've made two Schengens. Suit Schengen, where gainfully employed people in clothes costing €80 or more per item were registered and allowed to go wherever they wanted, and Summer Camp Schengen, where the less gainfully employed street vendors, trampoline artists, pickpockets and pan flute players were sent off to the salt mines? 

Before you know we'll be up to our balls in jugglers

Non-suit Schengen's useful too.  Apparently the need to get another visa is why Britain's off the Chinese tourism boom

[Norgy]

It's probably not difficult to rebuild them.

Especially not if those beellions of Libyans and Ayrabs are put to work on them. 

[grumbler]

It's probably not difficult to rebuild them.

Especially not if those beellions of Libyans and Ayrabs are put to work on them. 

[alfred russel]

It's probably not difficult to rebuild them.

Right now there are a generation of schengen area europeans that are in their early 30s and have not known border control inside the area during their adult lives. There would be a huge backlash from such people (and older people who have grown used to freedom of movement) if they suddenly needed a passport they may not have to travel across a nearby border. It would also make travel across borders a lot slower and a lot more annoying--be it for planes, trains, or automobiles.

[Tamas]

It's starting to look like we are going to do a reenactment of the 1930s, with the role of Germany being played by France.

[Martinus]

Schengen is a huge help for businesses--visa issues are a pain for businesspeople with less recognized passports. A member of a multinational from Mexico that needs to visit five offices on a european trip would need five visas, which is ridiculously time consuming.

Also are you sure this is Schengen-related and not freedom of movement related?

[Ed Anger]

It's starting to look like we are going to do a reenactment of the 1930s, with the role of Germany being played by France.

I need to get in on the ground floor of this money making opportunity.

[Martinus]

From my experience, unless you are traveling by car/bus, the existence of Schengen is not that material - you go through ID/passport check at the airport or railway station anyway, so there is not much of a difference (at least from what I can tell based on my travels to the UK and Schengen countries).

[alfred russel]

Schengen is a huge help for businesses--visa issues are a pain for businesspeople with less recognized passports. A member of a multinational from Mexico that needs to visit five offices on a european trip would need five visas, which is ridiculously time consuming.

Also are you sure this is Schengen-related and not freedom of movement related?

I don't understand the distinction.

[Martinus]

The former is an optional treaty within the EU which deals with lack of border checks. The latter is one of the basic four freedoms of the EU Treaty which has to be observed by all EU members and allows people to move freely without visas, passports and immigration restrictions (subject to rare exceptions).

[alfred russel]

From my experience, unless you are traveling by car/bus, the existence of Schengen is not that material - you go through ID/passport check at the airport or railway station anyway, so there is not much of a difference (at least from what I can tell based on my travels to the UK and Schengen countries).

I disagree--I've never crossed a controlled boundary in a train, bus, or car, but it is an additional pain by air. It takes longer to board because the airline has to check to make sure its passengers have their paperwork in order, then you have to stand in line to get your exit stamp, then after landing you have to stand in line to get your entry stamp, then you have to clear customs. The airlines usually say to get to the airport an extra half hour early for international flights, and it is always a lottery for how long it will take after you land (it can get ugly, especially in the US).

Then there are the other stressors: such as immigration forms you need to fill out that ask questions you don't know the answers to (the address of the hotel I'm staying, for instance--a car was just going to meet me), immigration forms that are in another language, you don't have a pen and have to ask around to borrow one on a flight filled with foreign speakers, or finally getting to the counter and realizing you filled out the wrong forms/the right forms but filled out incorrectly/forgot the forms on the plane/have the right form and know how to fill it out but never found a pen to borrow.

[alfred russel]

The former is an optional treaty within the EU which deals with lack of border checks. The latter is one of the basic four freedoms of the EU Treaty which has to be observed by all EU members and allows people to move freely without visas, passports and immigration restrictions (subject to rare exceptions).

All I know is that the less attractive passport holders who travel internationally consider what they call a Schengen Visa to be the golden ticket to europe. I assumed that if Schengen unraveled so would those visas. But I don't know.

[Tamas]

Yeah, even arriving to the UK via plane was longer than, say, France, let alone Turkey and their money-grabbing visa scheme.

And it is absolutely wonderful on land.
Especially for east euros. I was a kid when crossing the border meant a collision course with a lot of regulations and rules, and a border guard for whom the chief agenda was keeping people in, and "contraband" like decent merchandise out.
That gives you some anxiety even a decade or two later when lining up at the gates. So it's great to just drive past the empty booths. Reminds you of what bigger unity gave us, and what populist assholes like Sarkozy can cost us.

[Slargos]

 

You're missing the bigger picture.

As a multiculturalist fucktard you will desperately want Sarkozy in charge. He's all bark when it comes to these issues.

[Martinus]

From my experience, unless you are traveling by car/bus, the existence of Schengen is not that material - you go through ID/passport check at the airport or railway station anyway, so there is not much of a difference (at least from what I can tell based on my travels to the UK and Schengen countries).

I disagree--I've never crossed a controlled boundary in a train, bus, or car, but it is an additional pain by air. It takes longer to board because the airline has to check to make sure its passengers have their paperwork in order, then you have to stand in line to get your exit stamp, then after landing you have to stand in line to get your entry stamp, then you have to clear customs. The airlines usually say to get to the airport an extra half hour early for international flights, and it is always a lottery for how long it will take after you land (it can get ugly, especially in the US).

Then there are the other stressors: such as immigration forms you need to fill out that ask questions you don't know the answers to (the address of the hotel I'm staying, for instance--a car was just going to meet me), immigration forms that are in another language, you don't have a pen and have to ask around to borrow one on a flight filled with foreign speakers, or finally getting to the counter and realizing you filled out the wrong forms/the right forms but filled out incorrectly/forgot the forms on the plane/have the right form and know how to fill it out but never found a pen to borrow.

Ok I suppose for someone traveling out of the EU it's a pain, but as I said, there is no difference for a EU citizen - whether I travelled to Spain (which is in Schengen) or the UK (which is not), the procedure was pretty much similar - just show an ID to an official at the airport and I'm through (in one case it was the airport official, in the other it was a border officer, though).