Game of Thrones begins....

[crazy canuck]

I agree with grumbler. In fact from my experiences with pen and paper roleplaying, people who always chose the optimal path for their characters were the most boring. Some of the most fun sessions I ever had a both a player and a game master was when people where making dumb (but in-character) choices.

People trying to role play are expected to make dumb decisions that are out of character.  We tend to expect more from writers who are paid for their work.

[grumbler]

Jamie has always been a guard.

He was an heir to a great house.
He's never been "just" a guard.

He also missed the fact that Jamie was promoted to Lord Commander of the Kingsguard, a position roughly equivelent to Ser Barriston's role for Dani.  Yet he allowed Ser Jaime to run around without a bodyguard, never calling that dumb.  Some double standards here, or just being obstinate for the sake of being obstinate?  Ser Jamie has "always been a guard" as much as Ser Sarriston has been, and as little.

[crazy canuck]

Jamie has always been a guard.

He was an heir to a great house.
He's never been "just" a guard.

He also missed the fact that Jamie was promoted to Lord Commander of the Kingsguard, a position roughly equivelent to Ser Barriston's role for Dani.  Yet he allowed Ser Jaime to run around without a bodyguard, never calling that dumb.  Some double standards here, or just being obstinate for the sake of being obstinate?  Ser Jamie has "always been a guard" as much as Ser Sarriston has been, and as little.

Another inaccuracy Grumbler.  The Lord Commander of the Kingsguard is not a member of the Small Council and in no way advises the King.  You have to ignore these distinctions for your view to have any merit.

[The Minsky Moment]

Jamie has always been a guard.

He was an heir to a great house.
He's never been "just" a guard.

Incorrect.  In both the Books and the show he had to renounce his inheritance to become a King's Guard.  That is the main reason his father was so upset about the decision.  From that point on he was just a guard.  King Joffrey certainly didn't care too much about him.

Hmm that seems to make me correct - he wasn't "always" a guard - wasn't till the third(?) book

[Admiral Yi]

He was a Kingsguard when he skewered the last Targaryian.

[crazy canuck]

Jamie has always been a guard.

He was an heir to a great house.
He's never been "just" a guard.

Incorrect.  In both the Books and the show he had to renounce his inheritance to become a King's Guard.  That is the main reason his father was so upset about the decision.  From that point on he was just a guard.  King Joffrey certainly didn't care too much about him.

Hmm that seems to make me correct - he wasn't "always" a guard - wasn't till the third(?) book

No.  The books start with him being a guard.  Remember, he was a guard when he killed the mad king.  He was the youngest King's Guard ever iirc.

[Habbaku]

The books starting with him being a guard does not always mean he has been a guard...

[crazy canuck]

The books starting with him being a guard does not always mean he has been a guard...

Sure, there was a time when he was a child and in his pre-teens when he was not a guard.  But I thought people were talking about Jamie the man walking around unescorted.  When Jamie the boy walked around he probably did have an escort because at that time he was an heir and he was relatively defenseless.  The books are unclear on that point though.

[Josephus]

The books starting with him being a guard does not always mean he has been a guard...

Sure, there was a time when he was a child and in his pre-teens when he was not a guard.  But I thought people were talking about Jamie the man walking around unescorted.  When Jamie the boy walked around he probably did have an escort because at that time he was an heir and he was relatively defenseless.  The books are unclear on that point though.

We'll need a prequel to clear that up

[Habbaku]

The books starting with him being a guard does not always mean he has been a guard...

Sure, there was a time when he was a child and in his pre-teens when he was not a guard.  But I thought people were talking about Jamie the man walking around unescorted.  When Jamie the boy walked around he probably did have an escort because at that time he was an heir and he was relatively defenseless.  The books are unclear on that point though.

So, when you say MM is "incorrect" in asserting that he used to be an heir and wasn't always just a guard...

[crazy canuck]

The books starting with him being a guard does not always mean he has been a guard...

Sure, there was a time when he was a child and in his pre-teens when he was not a guard.  But I thought people were talking about Jamie the man walking around unescorted.  When Jamie the boy walked around he probably did have an escort because at that time he was an heir and he was relatively defenseless.  The books are unclear on that point though.

So, when you say MM is "incorrect" in asserting that he used to be an heir and wasn't always just a guard...

I concede that when he was a baby he was not a guard.  How context deaf is this conversation really going to get.

[Berkut]

Jaime is certainly not "just a guard" at any point. He is a Lannister, and the brother of the queen (or former queen), and the uncle or father of the king. He was one of the principal commanders of the Lannister armies during the war, hence his value as a hostage of Rob Stark. Rob Stark certainly never considered him "just a guard".

His life is certainly much more under threat than just some Kingsguard. He clearly has influence well beyond being some guy who guards the king, and there are plenty who might wish to do him harm as such, or kidnap him, or whatever.

Context deaf? Are you kidding? You are seriously lecturing anyone about "context" after claiming that Jaime Lannister is "just a kingsguard"?

[grumbler]

Another inaccuracy Grumbler.  The Lord Commander of the Kingsguard is not a member of the Small Council and in no way advises the King.  You have to ignore these distinctions for your view to have any merit.

Another inaccuracy, crazy Canuck.  The Lord Commander is a member of the small council, and is thus an adviser to the King.  You have to know the books before you can assert that your views have any merit.

Can you name any Kingsguard/Queensguard/Rainbow Guard member whatever that appears in any of the books or episodes with a bodyguard? 

[grumbler]

Jaime is certainly not "just a guard" at any point. He is a Lannister, and the brother of the queen (or former queen), and the uncle or father of the king. He was one of the principal commanders of the Lannister armies during the war, hence his value as a hostage of Rob Stark. Rob Stark certainly never considered him "just a guard".

His life is certainly much more under threat than just some Kingsguard. He clearly has influence well beyond being some guy who guards the king, and there are plenty who might wish to do him harm as such, or kidnap him, or whatever.

Context deaf? Are you kidding? You are seriously lecturing anyone about "context" after claiming that Jaime Lannister is "just a kingsguard"?

Let's not confuse cC's quotes with others making statements about his arguments.  Leave the game of mis-quoting in order to forward intellectually dishonest arguments to cC:  he has vast experience in it.

[Berkut]

The funny thing is that I actually agree that Selmy wandering about Mereen without a bodyguard is pretty silly. Not ridiculously so, but still kind of silly. He is a critically important figure in the government, and Mereen is known to harbor very hostile elements to the current ruler, and targeting Selmy is a clear way to effectively strike at Daenyrs. Hell, if the entire POINT of that attack was to bait out Selmy so they could kill or capture him, that would be a job well done for a budding insurgency.

But the people arguing this are doing such a bad job of it, it is hard to actually join in...