Game of Thrones begins....

[Syt]

Salman Rushdie slams Game of Thrones, kinda:
http://www.haaretz.com/weekend/magazine/interview-salman-rushdie-is-not-afraid-1.389961

[...]

"I mean, there is always a lot of junk; most novels published are bad novels, most plays put on are bad plays, most movies that come out are bad movies and that is also true of TV. Nineteen times out of 20 you fall asleep. There was a series called 'Game of Thrones' which was very popular here in the United States, a post-Tolkien kind of thing. It was garbage, yet very addictive garbage - because there's lots of violence, all the women take their clothes off all the time, and it's kind of fun. In the end, it's well-produced trash, but there's room for that, too.

"I watched all that because if I am going to work in this field, I need to know what it is going on. I have been making myself have whole-series marathons to get the point of how it goes. I will soon start writing my little series."

[...]

[Berkut]

Salman Rushdie slams Game of Thrones, kinda:
http://www.haaretz.com/weekend/magazine/interview-salman-rushdie-is-not-afraid-1.389961

[...]

"I mean, there is always a lot of junk; most novels published are bad novels, most plays put on are bad plays, most movies that come out are bad movies and that is also true of TV. Nineteen times out of 20 you fall asleep. There was a series called 'Game of Thrones' which was very popular here in the United States, a post-Tolkien kind of thing. It was garbage, yet very addictive garbage - because there's lots of violence, all the women take their clothes off all the time, and it's kind of fun. In the end, it's well-produced trash, but there's room for that, too.

"I watched all that because if I am going to work in this field, I need to know what it is going on. I have been making myself have whole-series marathons to get the point of how it goes. I will soon start writing my little series."

[...]

I can't say I really disagree with him, even though I very much liked the first season.

It is pretty much trash. That doesn't mean it isn't very good entertainment though.

[The Brain]

Salman Rushdie slams Game of Thrones, kinda:
http://www.haaretz.com/weekend/magazine/interview-salman-rushdie-is-not-afraid-1.389961

[...]

"I mean, there is always a lot of junk; most novels published are bad novels, most plays put on are bad plays, most movies that come out are bad movies and that is also true of TV. Nineteen times out of 20 you fall asleep. There was a series called 'Game of Thrones' which was very popular here in the United States, a post-Tolkien kind of thing. It was garbage, yet very addictive garbage - because there's lots of violence, all the women take their clothes off all the time, and it's kind of fun. In the end, it's well-produced trash, but there's room for that, too.

"I watched all that because if I am going to work in this field, I need to know what it is going on. I have been making myself have whole-series marathons to get the point of how it goes. I will soon start writing my little series."

[...]

The TV show is certainly meh compared to the books.

[Gups]

About to start a Feast of Crows....well will hold off for a while, maybe Christmas I'm thinking.  Really affects my school work when I start reading these.


Goes downhill from here though, huh?   

They're still good reads, just not to the level of the first few.  Don't worry too much about it.

No they're not really. The fifth one is particularly bad. I wished I hadn't bothered with it at all.

[jimmy olsen]

Salman Rushdie slams Game of Thrones, kinda:
http://www.haaretz.com/weekend/magazine/interview-salman-rushdie-is-not-afraid-1.389961

[...]

"I mean, there is always a lot of junk; most novels published are bad novels, most plays put on are bad plays, most movies that come out are bad movies and that is also true of TV. Nineteen times out of 20 you fall asleep. There was a series called 'Game of Thrones' which was very popular here in the United States, a post-Tolkien kind of thing. It was garbage, yet very addictive garbage - because there's lots of violence, all the women take their clothes off all the time, and it's kind of fun. In the end, it's well-produced trash, but there's room for that, too.

"I watched all that because if I am going to work in this field, I need to know what it is going on. I have been making myself have whole-series marathons to get the point of how it goes. I will soon start writing my little series."

[...]

I can't say I really disagree with him, even though I very much liked the first season.

It is pretty much trash. That doesn't mean it isn't very good entertainment though.

What makes it trash?

Can you list some television shows that were art rather than trash and explain why?

[Valmy]

I can't say I really disagree with him, even though I very much liked the first season.

It is pretty much trash. That doesn't mean it isn't very good entertainment though.

Well I was not aware it was meant to be high art.  Trash compared to what would be my question.  Compared to the LOTR movies?  I mean I doubt the HBO GoTR series will be used as an example in a 31st century classroom of the height of ancient American fiction or anything but it was pretty sophisticated for a TV series.

[Eddie Teach]

Midnight's Children was dull and pretentious. I did kind of like the Satanic Verses though.

[Berkut]

Salman Rushdie slams Game of Thrones, kinda:
http://www.haaretz.com/weekend/magazine/interview-salman-rushdie-is-not-afraid-1.389961

[...]

"I mean, there is always a lot of junk; most novels published are bad novels, most plays put on are bad plays, most movies that come out are bad movies and that is also true of TV. Nineteen times out of 20 you fall asleep. There was a series called 'Game of Thrones' which was very popular here in the United States, a post-Tolkien kind of thing. It was garbage, yet very addictive garbage - because there's lots of violence, all the women take their clothes off all the time, and it's kind of fun. In the end, it's well-produced trash, but there's room for that, too.

"I watched all that because if I am going to work in this field, I need to know what it is going on. I have been making myself have whole-series marathons to get the point of how it goes. I will soon start writing my little series."

[...]

I can't say I really disagree with him, even though I very much liked the first season.

It is pretty much trash. That doesn't mean it isn't very good entertainment though.

What makes it trash?

Appeals to generally very base entertainment values, like sex and violence. Is largely driven by a very negative story, and the appeal is mostly about watching bad people doing nasty things to one another.

Can you list some television shows that were art rather than trash and explain why?

Art? I don't know about that, but I can certainly list plenty of TV shows that were not as trashy as GoT.

Babylon 5. Firefly. Six Feet Under. Carnival. Frasier. MASH. Sports Night. News Radio. Hill Street Blues.

I could go on, those are just a few that pop into my head as being considerably less trashy than GoT, where the appeal is at least trying to be based on something a little bit more cerebral.

[Berkut]

I can't say I really disagree with him, even though I very much liked the first season.

It is pretty much trash. That doesn't mean it isn't very good entertainment though.

Well I was not aware it was meant to be high art.  Trash compared to what would be my question.  Compared to the LOTR movies?  I mean I doubt the HBO GoTR series will be used as an example in a 31st century classroom of the height of ancient American fiction or anything but it was pretty sophisticated for a TV series.

I think it achieves pretty much exactly what it was meant to be in fact. They are not going for Shakespeare.

I guess I don't think describing it as trashy is necessarily a huge negative. It can be both trashy and damn good, even trashy and sophisticated.

You cannot really argue though that a TV show that includes whores flashing their crotch at people, lesbian sex scenes, a couple instances of incest, and plenty of over the top violence is not trashy though.

[Valmy]

You cannot really argue though that a TV show that includes whores flashing their crotch at people, lesbian sex scenes, a couple instances of incest, and plenty of over the top violence is not trashy though.

Well that's true but it seems like every HBO series does that.  I think after watching enough of HBO programming I just sorta expect it and ignore it.  I have no idea why they feel that need to do it just because they can.

But when Salman said trash though I presumed he meant that the quality of the show as a whole is trash.  Maybe when and if I read his series I willl agree with him.

[jimmy olsen]

I think it achieves pretty much exactly what it was meant to be in fact. They are not going for Shakespeare.

Shakespeare was as trashy as society allowed and it was still art. Plenty of sex and violence in Shakespeare.  In fact theater itself was by definition trashy in it's time and was banned by the government several times.

[Admiral Yi]

I wouldn't call the TV show trash.  Showing tits and blood doesn't make a show trash.

[grumbler]

I think it achieves pretty much exactly what it was meant to be in fact. They are not going for Shakespeare.

I guess I don't think describing it as trashy is necessarily a huge negative. It can be both trashy and damn good, even trashy and sophisticated.

You cannot really argue though that a TV show that includes whores flashing their crotch at people, lesbian sex scenes, a couple instances of incest, and plenty of over the top violence is not trashy though.

I suppose if we simply re-define the concept "trashy" then GoT is trashy.  But so is every other series you named, because they appealed to emotion like GoT does.  They are less trashy than GoT by that measure, but still trashy.

Or, maybe, we should reject the concept of "trashy" as a valid measure of TV show quality and recognize that it is simply the label that a snob applied to work not like his own.  I think accepting Rushdie's labeling system adds nothing to the debate.  He is a smart guy but not very introspective, and certainly not a man who can complain about the fiction work of others; he wrote some very good philosophically-inclined  works, but he doesn't understand character or plot and I find the idea of him writing for TV or movies to be questionable, at best.

Is GoT deliberately over the top in places?  Sure.  Does that make it bad TV?  No, it makes it good TV, because TV is about showing and not telling, and GoT doesn't hold back when it comes to showing.  I think I enjoyed the show even more than the book, and I enjoyed the book a lot.

[Gups]

I'll say this for Rushdie. His wife is seriously hot. No wonder he looks so pleased with himself.

[Valmy]

I think they divorced years ago.  No wonder he is lashing out at Game of Thrones.