Sarkozy relaunched

[Slargos]

I love Le Pen

He has praised the Confederacy in the past, and I have unreserved support for him.

Well, Le Pen has been ruined for me. Go Socialists!

It's his daughter running.  She has gone on the record as saying that the Confederacy deserved its fate, as only strong cultures deserve to live.

And the irony of the imminent death of the French is probably lost on her.

[Ed Anger]

le mew.

[Slargos]

le mew.

[Valmy]

And the irony of the imminent death of the French is probably lost on her.

We shall see.  In 2001 when this canard was first brought to my attention I was told France would be majority muslim any minute now...yet peculiarly the percentage has gone from an estimated 10% to an estimated 9% of France in that time.  Maybe the Muslims are becoming proper non-believing Frenchies?

[Slargos]

And the irony of the imminent death of the French is probably lost on her.

We shall see.  In 2001 when this canard was first brought to my attention I was told France would be majority muslim any minute now...yet peculiarly the percentage has gone from an estimated 10% to an estimated 9% of France in that time.  Maybe the Muslims are becoming proper non-believing Frenchies?

Or they're fudging the numbers. Or you are.

[Valmy]

Or they're fudging the numbers. Or you are.

Me?  I just read what stats I see on wiki and CIA World factbook.

[Slargos]

Or they're fudging the numbers. Or you are.

Me?  I just read what stats I see on wiki and CIA World factbook.

I'm merely fronting alternative explanations. 

Regardless, 10% is a horrifying number whichever way you spin it.

[Lettow77]

 Neil, did she..really say such a thing?

Could you cite this? that's a pretty damning indictment of her, if so

[Ed Anger]

le mew.

very good.

[KRonn]

I applaud the French for taking a lead role in this. Seems the French have more concrete plans for an end game in Libya, and looking to help make some significant change. Won't likely be willing for a scenario of Gaddafi remaining in power, where it seems others are just fixated on preventing the Rebels from being slaughtered en-masse.

[grumbler]

I applaud the French for taking a lead role in this. Seems the French have more concrete plans for an end game in Libya, and looking to help make some significant change. Won't likely be willing for a scenario of Gaddafi remaining in power, where it seems others are just fixated on preventing the Rebels from being slaughtered en-masse.

Seems like the quintessential "wag the Frog" operation.  The interesting question is "who will the French bomb when the rebels turn on each other?"  As Iraq showed, getting rid of the dictator is the easy part.

[KRonn]

I applaud the French for taking a lead role in this. Seems the French have more concrete plans for an end game in Libya, and looking to help make some significant change. Won't likely be willing for a scenario of Gaddafi remaining in power, where it seems others are just fixated on preventing the Rebels from being slaughtered en-masse.

Seems like the quintessential "wag the Frog" operation.  The interesting question is "who will the French bomb when the rebels turn on each other?"  As Iraq showed, getting rid of the dictator is the easy part.

Yep, exactly. The aftermath is the tough part, and who really are the Rebel factions? The main tribes aren't too friendly to each other, and I think some serious divisions there.

[derspiess]

Seems like the quintessential "wag the Frog" operation.  The interesting question is "who will the French bomb when the rebels turn on each other?"  As Iraq showed, getting rid of the dictator is the easy part.

I'm guessing they (we?  NATO?  the Easter Bunny?) will do some quick, half-assed nation-building & declare it a success just before it goes all to hell.  Hopefully nobody on our side gets it in their mind that they need to incubate a western-style democracy there.  That's going to require an awful lot of hand-holding for short-term success and long-term is probably doomed to failure.

Realistic goals in Libya should be:

1) Get rid of Gadaffi.  If he's allowed to remain in power over part of the country for any length of time, he's dangerous to the West.  He still has money & can/will sponsor terrorism to get back at us as long as he has any sort of power.  We crossed that line when the first bomb dropped & there's no going back.

2) Ensure that whatever power structure succeeds Gadaffi is not a threat to the West, maintains stability, and is at least slightly more responsive to human rights than Gadaffi is (might be tricky to accomplish all three at the same time).

3) Stability.  I mentioned it in #2 but it's worth mentioning again.  Libya's oil needs to flow freely and it would behoove Europe to re-establish the deal they had with Gadaffi to clamp down on the flow of illegal immigrants headed to Europe.

[viper37]

le mew.

It's spelled Lemieux.  EPIC FAIL.